Firefighter Sewing machine

[Tc1388]

Hey everyone, I’m new to this forum & leatherworking as well. I’ve been teaching myself to hand tool leather work for helmet shields for guys in my department. I love creating pieces but drag feet when it comes to handstitching them. I’m looking to buy a used machine to get started before making any big financial commitment. I’m going through about 3/8”-1/2” and don’t know where to begin when looking for the right machine for like I said, a decent price. Any help is helpful.. thanks!

[Wizcrafts]

What materials will you be sewing on top and on the bottom layers? How much stress will there be on the sewn seams? What temperatures might they need to withstand?

The answers to these basic questions will help point you towards the type of sewing machine you will need to handle the thread and material.

Hint: The machine will obviously have to be able to sew into 1/2 inch of material. There are several that we deal with in leather work that sew well beyond 1/2 inch. But, you may need to use Kevlar or high temperature, flameproof Nomex thread for firefighter use. That's a whole nuther ball of wax.

[Tc1388]

So they’re made from cowhide tooling leather. There will be no stress on the seams, purely decorative identity tags. Thought about the thread before but I’ve been in some hot ones with my personal one and haven’t had any issues yet. Will def look into that type of thread once I get my hands on a machine. There’s a guy locally who is selling a Singer 211W155 for $450? There’s also a chandler industrial no model # for $800. Would buy either if I knew anything about these machines. Thanks for the help Wiz

[SilverForgeStudio]

The Wiz has spoken- but Ill toss my findings in as I am on the search as well for a machine for similar items. I do some work for a FD in my area and am a paid staffer- So I know where you are coming from but think ahead- think about 2 years down the road... IF you get into the hobby and it cranks into a business- you're gonna NEED to meet the specs for Nomex/Kevlar thread weights. Plus as an added bonus- lets say you hate it and want out- the machine has higher resale value as it WILL meet the need versus a startup machine you need to upgrade (Buy once- cry once).

What Im getting at is this- your product and will dictate the machine- consider thread weights, and look for a compound walking foot that will handle OVER what you are looking at... Why you ask? Because SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE that has one of your products is gonna tell someone else... and before you know it you are trying to sew a belt, gear tenders, belt keepers, holsters and stuff... Dont go "good enuff" on materials- Overproduce your product to duty-specs for everything so that: 

1. It doesn't come back for warranty work (You want a good name- back up your stuff)
2. It out performs the other guy who met the minimums (and you can back it up with endurance testing and showcase it if you have competition- Set the bar, dont just meet it)
3. Its how you would want to be treated if you were the customer

Look for a local sewing shop that does industrial/machines maintenance- in another thread there was an awesome point made- Cheap and free shipping is great but if you need maintenance there is NO support, backup and you will pay more to get it serviced than if you had bought from a local who knows the machine and can often do the work in house.

Be safe and as always- at peace- Hope your journey if fun and you get the right machine!

[Wizcrafts]

Besides needing to be a walking foot machine, the take-up lever itself needs to be beefier (is that even a word?) than an average upholstery class machine. This puts you into the heavy duty end of the walking foot spectrum. The reason has to do with the abrasive nature of these particular threads. With repeated use they can act like fine grit round Emory tape (more so the Kevlar thread).

You will need to focus on walking foot machines capable of sewing 1/2 inch out of the box. These include the Juki LU-1508NH and the Cowboy CB3200, as well as some Adler machines that can sew 1/2 inch with Nomex thread. Of the two, the Cowboy is less expensive.

[Tc1388]

Thank you guys both for the informative insight. Like I said I’m new to this and love doing it, taking pride in my work is of utmost importance, so durability is key. Do you guys have any dependable thread company references to just keep at hand stitching until I save enough for the cowboy? Again, thank you guys so much.

[Tc1388]

Also what thread thickness would be closest to standard waxed thread? Thanks again guys...

[Mark842]

I know The Thread exchange carries nomex and Kevlar thread. I prefer Superior threads for whatever my opinion is worth. They carry Kevlar but do not have Nomex. I'm guessing from what your saying you are making the helmet ID's, not sure what they are called. From the ones I have seen I would probably use size 207 to 300 thread.

[JerseyFirefighter]

I had been down this road as you are now. I asked the question.. had a slightly higher budget. In the end, I came to the conclusion unless you are versed in older sewing machines or very handy I would not bother looking into older machines hoping both that they work, and that they fit your needs (also future needs). I eventually decided that the larger investment (although painful at the time) would pay greater dividends... to which it did and still does to this day. If you were still cautious in dropping money on some of the larger machines on the market (cobra 4, cowboy 4500, ferdco 2000) that you should consider looking into the model below. (Cobra 3, Cowboy 3500 etc). They are slightly more affordable and I have only had a handful of times where I needed to come close to matching out my larger machine doing firefighter or K-9 stitching. 

As it was pleasantly beat into my head by people like Wiz... is that coming in looking to sew 12-16oz leather with an older machine is not for the timid and uneducated in matters of sewing machines. You'll doubt yourself now, but if you are getting a chance to save some money made on your projects, I would advise to save a bit longer and lay out for a newer machine that a lot of us in the fire service leather world tend to grab. Bonus points are there are plenty of us that frequently discuss issues or problems on the same types of projects where we have had issues in the past. I've got a lot of money invested in my shop, still to this day as large purchases go, my sewing machine will always be the #1 upgrade in terms of productivity. 

[DonInReno]

Unfortunately as others have said you’re sewing just over the max capabilities of the 211w155 and similar machines designed primarily for upholstery.   It’s probably worth it to measure your items since 3/8” is doable with upholstery machines.  

In the used market the choices for larger machines (Cowboy 3200 range) are slim, but if you’re patient there are some deals to be had, but there are very few $1,000 setups - anything less than $1,500 would be a good deal.