Skiver restoration project and questions

[DanishMan]

The stuff I have is old. I will not charge a lot - but of course shipping will be expensive 

[katit]

Spent little more time. Removing main shaft was tricky, but now I know how it's done. I'm glad I'm doing it  - all bearings inside (needle and ball) in good shape but greaze became more like dry wax. Definitely need cleaning/repacking.

Separating pulley from shaft is a last piece to take apart, will have to make some kind of puller. Simple "knocking out" tecnique does not work.

 

[katit]

On ‎2‎/‎19‎/‎2019 at 11:51 PM, DanishMan said:

The stuff I have is old. I will not charge a lot - but of course shipping will be expensive 

Do you have this part? It's also displayed in previous post. My bad it's threaded and I tried to press it out, damaged one pin and bent it. If not - I will repair and make another pin. This is not critical part..

 

Ordered all new bearings. Some bearings which not easy to remove will be reused. But those are standard/cheap to replace. Pretty much all grease became "plasticky goo".

Machine finally apart, getting ready to clean/restore. I will try nickel plating on all small parts, will see how it goes.

 

[Nuttish]

I have that skiver. It works great.

IIRC from speaking with Sam or Dan at Campbell Randall, it's an Italian clone of a Fortuna, maybe FA. Most parts are interchangeable and still sold by Campbell Randall. The part numbers are often the same as well, just prepended with a Z.

Everything about restoring mine was pretty easy except diagnosing runout in the sharpening wheel spindle. That required correctly seating the bearings.

It also took a little work to minimize play in the drive shaft.

Your machine looks like it was exposed to water. The original deep groove bearings on the knife and drive shaft spindles were shielded but not sealed and the drive shaft also uses thrust bearings – I'd just assume they're all fouled and replace them. They're all inexpensive off the shelf sizes anyhow.

That's the original paint.

I used Eagle weldable urethane from McMaster Carr - round for the short and motor belts and flat infinite belt for the sharpening wheel. If you're missing the infinite belt, I'll measure mine and take a picture of the route for you. You don't need the Eagle kit; just put a butter knife in a vise, heat it up with a torch, and use it to melt your ends before you jam them together. These machines don't require much belt tension, so as long as the thing stays together you're fine.

Here's the manual. Fortuna manuals are also helpful for learning how to work on and operate the machine. Let me know and I'll post.

MFG-10A-15A.PDF

[katit]

@Nuttish

Thanks a lot for detailed response!

Quote

IIRC from speaking with Sam or Dan at Campbell Randall, it's an Italian clone of a Fortuna, maybe FA. Most parts are interchangeable and still sold by Campbell Randall. The part numbers are often the same as well, just prepended with a Z.

Interesting to know more history. If you look at badge on mine it says "made in Western Germany". And yes, all parts in machine stamped with Z. And it's "St Louis" company. I guess many different companies branded those machines? Will try calling them and see if they got parts needed.

Quote

Your machine looks like it was exposed to water. The original deep groove bearings on the knife and drive shaft spindles were shielded but not sealed and the drive shaft also uses thrust bearings – I'd just assume they're all fouled and replace them. They're all inexpensive off the shelf sizes anyhow

I would say it was exposed to weather/humidity. No direct rain or anything like that. Everything inside is OK, only top surface suffered. I am replacing all ball bearings except for knife shaft. Those needle bearings and thrust bearings were all embedded in "baked" grease. After soaking in kerosene everything cleaned up nicely and looks great.

Quote

That's the original paint

Thats interesting. I probably can do better job with a brush and closed eyes

Quote

I used Eagle weldable urethane from McMaster Carr - round for the short and motor belts and flat infinite belt for the sharpening wheel. If you're missing the infinite belt, I'll measure mine and take a picture of the route for you. You don't need the Eagle kit; just put a butter knife in a vise, heat it up with a torch, and use it to melt your ends before you jam them together. These machines don't require much belt tension, so as long as the thing stays together you're fine.

What size urethane did you use? I see they make tapered ones as well, maybe it will be better? I did have infinite belt it measured 97cm. I got green replacement from eBay - 95cm. I think 95cm is a correct size because belt that I had on was slightly loose and out of tensioner adjustment movement.

 

Thanks a lot for manual! Very helpful.

Question: Do you know what is this cover on a left for? I see most skivers sold today don't have it. I wonder what it does and what this black knob on left does.

 

[DanishMan]

I think I have the part, you mention. I will check it tomorrow, when I get home.

Brgds

DanishMan

[katit]

18 minutes ago, DanishMan said:

I think I have the part, you mention. I will check it tomorrow, when I get home.

Thanks! I also reached out to part supplier on this, they say it may have to be special ordered, and they will be letting me know today when/how much.

18 hours ago, Nuttish said:

I used Eagle weldable urethane from McMaster Carr - round for the short . You don't need the Eagle kit; just put a butter knife in a vise, heat it up with a torch, and use it to melt your ends before you jam them together. These machines don't require much belt tension, so as long as the thing stays together you're fine.

Ordered 10ft of 3L belting. Will see how strong it holds. Maybe it will work for sewing machines as well?

[DarkGoku]

I have a Cobra NP-4 skiving machine, and looks damn near identical. I'd give them a call over @ Leather Machine Company (https://www.leathermachineco.com/) ask for cobra Steve:) hope this helps

[Nuttish]

On 3/4/2019 at 9:54 AM, katit said:

@Nuttish

Thanks a lot for detailed response!

Interesting to know more history. If you look at badge on mine it says "made in Western Germany". And yes, all parts in machine stamped with Z. And it's "St Louis" company. I guess many different companies branded those machines? Will try calling them and see if they got parts needed.

I would say it was exposed to weather/humidity. No direct rain or anything like that. Everything inside is OK, only top surface suffered. I am replacing all ball bearings except for knife shaft. Those needle bearings and thrust bearings were all embedded in "baked" grease. After soaking in kerosene everything cleaned up nicely and looks great.

Thats interesting. I probably can do better job with a brush and closed eyes

What size urethane did you use? I see they make tapered ones as well, maybe it will be better? I did have infinite belt it measured 97cm. I got green replacement from eBay - 95cm. I think 95cm is a correct size because belt that I had on was slightly loose and out of tensioner adjustment movement.

 

Thanks a lot for manual! Very helpful.

Question: Do you know what is this cover on a left for? I see most skivers sold today don't have it. I wonder what it does and what this black knob on left does.

 

My machine is identical to yours, so I assume it was also made in West Germany. It doesn't appear to have ever had that badge, just a square one with a model number and no country of origin. Otherwise the same.

I wouldn't bother reaching out to Manufacturer's Supply. They still exist but don't seem keen on helping individuals with these ancient machines. Sam at Campbell Randalls knows everything about these things and has multiple options for reasonably priced parts.

The cover on the side is to extend the work surface and enclose the feed roll mechanism and bell knife. My machine had a scrap/dust collector system connected that consisted of a short section of duct connecting a hole underneath the edge of the bell knife to the enclosed cabinet in the left side of the table base. The cover would have also increased static pressure in the system and helped the fan suck scraps down the duct.

The black knob holds a diamond dressing rod. It turns maybe 30º inside a threaded sleeve that advances and retracts so you can carefully touch the dressing rod to the grinding wheel to square up the edge. 

I used 1/4" OD round weldable urethane belting for the drive pulleys and 1/2" weldable urethane for the infinite belt. Both from McMaster Carr https://www.mcmaster.com/59725K804 https://www.mcmaster.com/6075K12

Looks like you're missing the guide. IIRC it attaches to one of the holes behind and just to the left of the presser foot with an M6 thumb screw. In this picture I'm using an M6 sewing machine presser foot screw, but I replaced it with a bigger one with a plastic knob from Campbell Randall. You see that an OEM guide is just a slotted piece of steel that you can move in and out. You could make one out of scrap acrylic or aluminum with a drill and jewelers saw.

[Nuttish]

23 hours ago, katit said:

Thanks! I also reached out to part supplier on this, they say it may have to be special ordered, and they will be letting me know today when/how much.

Ordered 10ft of 3L belting. Will see how strong it holds. Maybe it will work for sewing machines as well?

If you've got a premade table you won't have any trouble finding a cheap purpose-made V belt.