Please help with saddle ID

[RebeccaFe]

First off, thank you very much for accepting me to this website. I am amazed at all the knowledge and help available here.

My husband inherited this saddle from my father-in-law. He passed away in 1981 when my husband was young. Because of that, my husband doesn't know much about the history of this saddle. It had been stored in their basement in Brooklyn, New York until about eight years ago. Sadly, it's been in a storage shed for about 4 years now. I now have it inside my house, on a really great Goodwill find that works perfectly to display this beautiful heirloom. 

My husband's dad was involved with horses almost his whole life. He served in World War II and somewhere there's photo of him in uniform with his favorite horse. You'll also see that he embellished the saddle with some German coins he brought back from the war. His family owned horses in Brooklyn, back when there was still the possibility to do that. They had propert in Brooklyn that was 5 acres in size but the government used eminent domain to take it. They gave my father-in-law a house and an additional lot a few miles away, in exchange for taking their property. I just wanted to give a little back story to who the owner of this saddle was before it came to my husband.

Both my husband and I don't really know anything about the saddle itself. I'm hoping somebody here can give us some information. I also noticed a stamped date I'm part of the metal that I thought was quite interesting. I am including that in photos.

Also, I was going to purchase some Fiebing's Saddle Soap and Fiebing's 100% pure Neatsfoot oil. Would this be good to restore it? I don't have a lot of money to put towards professional restoration so I would like to do as much as possible on my own. If it's better for me to save up and wait to find a professional instead, please advise.  Any help in this regard would be appreciated as well.

Thank you again for any help. 

I can't seem to upload my photos because the files are too large. I could only upload one here that shows the stamp on the top. I hope it's ok to give an outside link. My husband is uploading it to his photo site, he photographs vintage cars and real estate. The saddle photos are in there own separate folder. Here's the link

https://rgamediaservices.zenfolio.com/p673608532

 

Edited to add: Also, should I insure this? I obviously don't want to sell it but I'm wondering the worth. Thanks!

Edited August 11, 2019 by RebeccaFe
Adding another question

[Northmount]

33 minutes ago, RebeccaFe said:

I can't seem to upload my photos because the files are too large.

Welcome to Leatherworker.net. 

Please resize your photos to fit.  See

Photos that are hosted on 3rd party sites and linked here will disappear when the host site changes their policies, or disappears.  Also when you remove the photos or change access requirements on the host site, they disappear from here.  To maintain the continuity and value of posts and threads here, photos need to be posted here.

Tom

[MikeRock]

You can also email the photos to yourself and save them.  When you email it will ask what size, with various options.  Works great for resizing to publish.

 

On the round logo you show.  Can you read the date?  It says 'established 1878 (or 3)'...... I think the bottom word is 'service'.  That saddle looks SO familiar, I have to go out to the shop and look at one in particular.

Can you read the lettering in the middle?  FS, FB???

God bless

Edited August 11, 2019 by MikeRock
added line on identification

[RebeccaFe]

2 hours ago, MikeRock said:

You can also email the photos to yourself and save them.  When you email it will ask what size, with various options.  Works great for resizing to publish.

 

On the round logo you show.  Can you read the date?  It says 'established 1878 (or 3)'...... I think the bottom word is 'service'.  That saddle looks SO familiar, I have to go out to the shop and look at one in particular.

Can you read the lettering in the middle?  FS, FB???

God bless

Thank you, I took another photo of the logo and it shows the date much better. It is definitely 1873. My eyes aren't as good as the cameras lens, lol.

I forgot  to answer regarding the lettering inside the logo. I was looking at another person's post here and I believe this is the same logo, as that saddle mark. It just looks like an earlier version. Here's the other person's photo taken as a screenshot. 

Edited August 11, 2019 by RebeccaFe

[RebeccaFe]

3 hours ago, Northmount said:

Welcome to Leatherworker.net. 

Please resize your photos to fit.  See

Photos that are hosted on 3rd party sites and linked here will disappear when the host site changes their policies, or disappears.  Also when you remove the photos or change access requirements on the host site, they disappear from here.  To maintain the continuity and value of posts and threads here, photos need to be posted here.

Tom

Thank you Tom. I totally understand about keeping the continuity and value. My husband just resized these. Hopefully they all work well now.

[RebeccaFe]

Sorry, I seem to be having difficulty posting these.

[RebeccaFe]

This is turned sideways but the stamp is interesting because it says Rig (something) May 1815.

Thank you for your time and help.

[fredk]

Wipe it down gently with saddle soap. Mix some bees' wax with pure neatsfoot oil into a cream, like margarine, and apply that. Work an area at a time, overlapping the areas. Rubbing the cream into the leather, let it sit for a couple of hours then lightly buff it off. A couple of treatments like this and it should come up a treat

[RebeccaFe]

20 minutes ago, fredk said:

Wipe it down gently with saddle soap. Mix some bees' wax with pure neatsfoot oil into a cream, like margarine, and apply that. Work an area at a time, overlapping the areas. Rubbing the cream into the leather, let it sit for a couple of hours then lightly buff it off. A couple of treatments like this and it should come up a treat

Thanks! I will definitely try this.

[steveh]

Bona Allen is the maker, originally from Georgia, but yours was made in forth worth Texas.  The date on the rigging Hardware is the patent date.

Edited August 11, 2019 by steveh

[RebeccaFe]

1 hour ago, steveh said:

Bona Allen is the maker, originally from Georgia, but yours was made in forth worth Texas.  The date on the rigging Hardware is the patent date.

Ah, ok, the patent date! That makes more sense than it being the age of the saddle. How do you know it was made in Ft. Worth? I'm just curious. Thanks for the info!

[MikeRock]

Just let Duck Duck Go go to work.  Fascinating, and to the point.  Your saddle dates to 1970 or newer. 

My neighbor in Keystone, SD had a few of them, brand new in 1972.  I thought that looked familiar!  Here's the info from http://forums.horsecity.com/topic/47091886-old-bona-allen-info-and-help-please/

 

Bonaparte Allen began his saddlery in Buford, Georgia in 1873. When he died in the 1920's he left the company to his sons. Tandy Leather Co. bought the company in 1970 and moved it to Texas. I see by the maker's mark on the "frog" of the rear housing that your saddle was built in Fort Worth, so it's a 1970 model or newer.

I have no idea of how Tandy's numbers run. Last I knew, Bona Allen is now owned by Foxwood Manufacturing of Olney, Illinois. Not sure when the company changed hands, but back in 1985 I was going to be a road man for TexTan (a subsidiary of Tandy) and they had a line of nice cowboy boots carrying the Bona Allen name. It was explained to me that they were no longer making the Bona Allen saddles but wanted to keep the name alive and under their ownership.

As it turned out, I didn't take the job with TexTan.

Sorry I can't be of much help.

[steveh]

4 hours ago, RebeccaFe said:

Ah, ok, the patent date! That makes more sense than it being the age of the saddle. How do you know it was made in Ft. Worth? I'm just curious. Thanks for the info!

Well, I made that statement , on the 1st photo you posted of a Latigo carrier. I realize now that was not your saddle, and that you posted that regarding that the makers mark was similar to yours. Take a closer look at the makers mark in the center of the seat near the handhole. Can you make out where it was made? It looks pretty worn and hard to read.

[chrisash]

I wonder if the number of german coin's has a special meaning? Maybe research into military history would bring the answer and in any event would no doubt be of interest to your family

[fredk]

I can't see the coin too clearly but it looks pre-Hitler regime, possibly the Weimar Republic

PS. Yes, insure it. Go to a saddlery or tack shop. See what a similar looking modern saddle sells for then insure this for 2 to 4 times that amount. You may be able to add it to your house contents insurance as a named single item. There will be an extra premium on your house contents insurance for it.

Edited August 12, 2019 by fredk

[MikeRock]

Sorry, I missed the part about the logo being on another, similar saddle.   Yours must be a Georgia made one, very much pre 1970.  

[MikeRock]

This is as close as I can get.

[oltoot]

Plated rigging probably makes it mid to early post WWII. Make sure that cleaning leaves leather damp not redried before using anything else. Lexol NF would be preferable to pure neatsfoot.

[DrmCa]

Every mention of eminent domain and United States in one sentence makes my blood boil.

[Fizzity]

Hi. My Grandma had this Porter saddle. The stamping is 8107. 
is there any info I can get on it?

thanks for the consideration 

[gothcowboy]

Glad someone stepped up and ID'd it - beat me to it. I have a few Bona Allen saddles.

FWIW - oiling a really dirty old saddle like this doesn't clean it, it just soaks the dirt in. You could use a mild detergent like diluted Dawn dishwashing detergent and a super soft baby toothbrush, clean out all the crevices, rinse with water and a rag. When it's dry you can use a less greasy heavy duty conditioner like Oakwood Leather Conditioner. With a saddlelike this, you may take a couple days to condition it. It's had years of neglect to make up for.

Adding oil to decades of filth is like "washing" your dirty hair with axle grease. Soap and water cleans (think shampoo), rinse really well, then you do a conditioner. Clean first, then condition. Also, having that leather damp will give you an opportunity to reshape the skirts over a day or so as they dry. After the leather is moisturized they don't shape as easily, or set as well.