speed reducer

[LAPat]

When I was at Melanie, the guy showed me a speed reducer and said that he thought I would be sorry to install it myself. I can't imagine it being very difficult, although the size of the belt might be a little hard to guess at. The idea of dragging a machine and table to a shop is more daunting than mounting the thing myself. Is it really that big a deal?

Also, I seem to have little issue with getting the Pfaff to stitch quite slowly although it would certainly be easy to go from a crawl to warp speed if I didn't pay attention. Does anyone work without a speed reducer on an industrial like the Pfaff?

Thanks in advance.

L.A. Patricia

[greg gomersall]

I use a 1245 pfaff with no speed reducer for a table machine, if you can learn to feather the pedal you should get along fine. One thing I might suggest instead of a speed reducer is to replace the clutch motor with a Servo motor. You will have all the control you seek and it is a real simple switch out. Greg

[Art]

Hi Pat,

To do the job right, you need to put the reducer where the motor normally goes and then remount the motor. Tables usually come drilled for the motor, it has a standard mount and is always in the same place. When you tilt the machine to get underneath, you automatically loosen the belt, if you mount the speed reducer in any other postition, it nullifies this function and requires that you lift the needle end of the machine to disengage the belt. The speed reducer and an electric servo motor cost about the same give or take, it would be a whole lot easier to just swap motors (get a 500 watt (3/4hp) motor instead of the 400w (1/2hp) to make up for a little power loss). I understand what the guy is saying, if you do it right, YOU probably don't want to do it. If you have trouble understanding what I said above, then you really don't want to get into it. Just replace the motor, that's a simple wrench job.

Art

When I was at Melanie, the guy showed me a speed reducer and said that he thought I would be sorry to install it myself. I can't imagine it being very difficult, although the size of the belt might be a little hard to guess at. The idea of dragging a machine and table to a shop is more daunting than mounting the thing myself. Is it really that big a deal?

Also, I seem to have little issue with getting the Pfaff to stitch quite slowly although it would certainly be easy to go from a crawl to warp speed if I didn't pay attention. Does anyone work without a speed reducer on an industrial like the Pfaff?

Thanks in advance.

L.A. Patricia

[bruce johnson]

Pat,

I am a big fan of Melanie, Arnold has really treated me right. He has a great shop, and keeps the cleanest warehouse I have ever seen. Good source of advice too.

I have a 1245 (Ferdco's version) with a speed reducer and the servo motor. On slowest speed on the dial, it is a - g - o - n - i - z - i -n - g - l - y slow. Something like maybe 1 stitch per 5 seconds. I think this machine and motor combo could easily be run and controlled like Greg said with just the servo motor and no speed reducer. It will be set up soon that way for me.

I have another machine being shipped now that had a clutch motor and no speed reducer. I am going to take the speed reducer off the 1245 and use it on the second machine. I will just have to get a new servo motor for the new machine that way.

[esantoro]

Many people here are much more knowledgeable than I am, but I really like having both the servo motor and speed reducer.

With the servo motor turned low without a reducer, it seems that any machine would suffer a lack of true punching power.

Ed

Pat,

I am a big fan of Melanie, Arnold has really treated me right. He has a great shop, and keeps the cleanest warehouse I have ever seen. Good source of advice too.

I have a 1245 (Ferdco's version) with a speed reducer and the servo motor. On slowest speed on the dial, it is a - g - o - n - i - z - i -n - g - l - y slow. Something like maybe 1 stitch per 5 seconds. I think this machine and motor combo could easily be run and controlled like Greg said with just the servo motor and no speed reducer. It will be set up soon that way for me.

I have another machine being shipped now that had a clutch motor and no speed reducer. I am going to take the speed reducer off the 1245 and use it on the second machine. I will just have to get a new servo motor for the new machine that way.

[greg gomersall]

Servo motors have an adjustable reostat you can adjust your speed with built right into them so why would you need a speed reducer as well? These Servo motors are D.C. current not A.C. like a clutch motor. Greg

[bruce johnson]

Greg,

The servo motor on my 1245 has the rheostat dial to adjust speed control. I am pretty sure I can get away without the speed reducer and have just as much control. My wife uses the 1245 some, and is not intimidated by it like the 2000. She is a flatbed user from homesewing, and just is more at ease.

I originally got my first servo motor for the Adler 205, and it was a bigger motor than the one on the 1245. It didn't have a rheostat on it, but gave me much more range of slow speed control than the clutch motor I replaced, and also had about the same high end for straight runs. When I ordered the 2000, I got the servo motor and it also doesn't have the rheostat. I am not sure if the larger motors don't have the rheostat, or just the earlier larger servos Ferdco stocked a couple years ago. I like the control and speed I have right now on the 2000 with the speed reducer. The new machine I have coming is a 2000 as well, second hand. I haven't ordered the motor yet, waiting to have the machine in hand first. I will talk to Ron when I get it, and ask about a rheostat on the larger motors. If there isn't one, I will scab the speedreducer off the 1245, or see if someone has one in the "boneyard".

Ed,

I am not concerned about the lack of punching power with the servo motor. I haven't checked torques, but personal observations have borne this out. When I replaced the clutch motor on the Adler with servo I had to "relearn". If I reached up out of habit to the handwheel to help it around a corner stitching slow (as I had to do with the clutch motor at times for control) the servo motor would throw my hand off. Also if I have the speed dialed up on the 1245 and handwheel around a point, I can jerk my wrist if I step on the pedal a little too hard. Some mechanics say that the servos have a steady punch power slow or fast, and don't rely on momentum like clutch motors. Don't know.

[LAPat]

Can somebody explain a little more about servo versus clutch in terms of how power is supplied to the machine? I understand the feel of the clutch on the Pfaff, but do regular home machines have servo motors?

L.A. Pat

[Art]

Hi Pat,

Servo Motor produces full motor power at any speed since you can have a closed loop and Variable Frequency Drive and the Hall sensor to allow for as much or as little current as required to maintain the desired speed.

AC motors only have their power when running at the rated motor speed e.g. 1725 or 3450 rpm. Clutch motors run at rated speed and engage through a clutch when you push the pedal down. You can "feather" the clutch a bit like a car (except they work in opposite directions) but basically when the clutch is fully engaged the machine is running at full speed.

To way overly sinplify (and incorrectly to boot)

Servo = Automatic Transmission

Clutch = Manual Transmission.

The basic home sewing machine motor is (or used to be) an AC motor with a potentiometer foot control of various designs that varied the voltage. The only time you get full power is when the pedal is to the metal, anything under that drops the voltage and hence the power (power that you need for leather), it scrubs this power off as heat and that is why your foot control gets hot when you run the machine slow. This would not work well in an industrial situation and that is why industrial machines have a table with the motor underneath and full speed motors with plenty of power.

Since the 80s, you will occasionally see computer controlled DC motors on the higher end home sewing machines.

AC motor home machines just don't develop the power at lower speeds and are only really good for 6oz or less at slow speeds. Constant use on heavy leather (even if the machine head is built like a tank) will eventually toast the motor though. If you have one of those baklite button controllers, sew with your shoes on because slow speed running will get that thing hot enough to blister your tootsies.

Art

Can somebody explain a little more about servo versus clutch in terms of how power is supplied to the machine? I understand the feel of the clutch on the Pfaff, but do regular home machines have servo motors?

L.A. Pat

[Vwoodard]

Hi folks,

I just picked up the consew RB206rb-5 and was reading this thread. After using the machine with the clutch, even after adjusting the tension on the motor's arm that goes to the peddle, and playing with it, I find it just is too fast to control on the smaller pieces that I am doing. In regard to this message, I have a clarification question... when you say the Servo is more like an "Automatic Transmission", does the Treddle control act more as an on/off switch, with a fixed running speed set on the servo control adjustment, or do you still have speed adjustment like a gas peddle of the car, just more automatic?

Thanks,

Vince

Hi Pat,

Servo Motor produces full motor power at any speed since you can have a closed loop and Variable Frequency Drive and the Hall sensor to allow for as much or as little current as required to maintain the desired speed.

AC motors only have their power when running at the rated motor speed e.g. 1725 or 3450 rpm. Clutch motors run at rated speed and engage through a clutch when you push the pedal down. You can "feather" the clutch a bit like a car (except they work in opposite directions) but basically when the clutch is fully engaged the machine is running at full speed.

To way overly sinplify (and incorrectly to boot)

Servo = Automatic Transmission

Clutch = Manual Transmission.

The basic home sewing machine motor is (or used to be) an AC motor with a potentiometer foot control of various designs that varied the voltage. The only time you get full power is when the pedal is to the metal, anything under that drops the voltage and hence the power (power that you need for leather), it scrubs this power off as heat and that is why your foot control gets hot when you run the machine slow. This would not work well in an industrial situation and that is why industrial machines have a table with the motor underneath and full speed motors with plenty of power.

Since the 80s, you will occasionally see computer controlled DC motors on the higher end home sewing machines.

AC motor home machines just don't develop the power at lower speeds and are only really good for 6oz or less at slow speeds. Constant use on heavy leather (even if the machine head is built like a tank) will eventually toast the motor though. If you have one of those baklite button controllers, sew with your shoes on because slow speed running will get that thing hot enough to blister your tootsies.

Art