where do you buy your leather?

[JustWakinUp]

I've noticed a difference between Zack Whites leather and Tandys leather.

The tandy leather when tooling seems awfully soft but the zack whites leather

seemed a tad stiff when tooling.

So my question to you all is where do you

like to purchase your tooling leather and for what reason?

[Randy Cornelius]

I use Wickett & Craig for most of my tooling leather. It is a softer tannage and takes tooling and stamping very well. They are great people to work with and will split any leather to your disired weight. You can buy direct from the Tanery and they have no minum order. My sales person is Glen Proud phone # 814-236-2220They have a good selection of all types of leather. It is the only place I can get veg tan leather drum dyed black and split to order.

I do use some Herman Oak from time to time but have to get it from a retailer as HO have a 10 side minum order to buy direct.

These are the only two American Veg. Tanned Tanneries left in the US.

I also use some of the Mexican tanned leathers from Thouroughbred Leather to make 2 saddles with good results, contact Jeff Ballard at 502-315-0315

The Mexican tanned skirting that Siegel sales is also good leather.

I have never heard of Zack White leather???? Where are they out of.

I have had some bad experiences with Tandy leather in the past. I hope they make improvements in the future.

Randy

[Art]

Hi Just,

Tandy -- You MUST go to the store and search for what you want and then tool a piece right there. There is some good leather in the stores, but a lot of times there isn't. I am not convinced they are committed to artisan quality leather yet, and maybe it is just because they don't hear us complaining. They are providing cheap Mexican leather more to bolster their margins than to provide quality material. I don't know where this mindset is coming from, but they need to change it. To me this is unfathomable because there are numerous leather companies offering quality imported hides at comparable prices.

Hermann Oak -- Quality Leather 10 sides at a time although you can purchase HO through others without minimums. You can get drum dyeing and additional processing at reasonable up charges. Like anything there is good and bad and I got one of these once, it had quite a few hard spots and somehow it seemed to get through quality control, the only thing I can say good about that was that I didn't also get the other side. This happened once and has never happened again and I consider it an abberation. Stuff happens and they made up for it on the next order.

Wickett & Craig -- What I have received from WC has been better tooling leather than the HO (in my very limited tooling experience). I have not been terribly happy with their dyeing (and I haven't checked it lately, last side I received was a little less than a year ago). I like my dyeing struck all the way through and that was not the case in my experience. Other than that a big OK and they have an outlet for small orders, no minimums.

Siegel of California -- You can get darned near anything you want here and good service to boot. They have something they call TR skirting that is very very good and tools well. No custom work. Their latigos (both types) are excellent. Friday specials are good also. Special lining leathers also available. English leather available. Not the lowest prices, but they don't send crap unless I order it, and when I have had problems (not often) they were fixed to my pickey satisfaction. If I had to deal with only one leather supplier, Siegel would be it.

Others -- There are many other fine providers, I have dealt with a couple, but no continuing experience.

Art

I've noticed a difference between Zack Whites leather and Tandys leather.

The tandy leather when tooling seems awfully soft but the zack whites leather

seemed a tad stiff when tooling.

So my question to you all is where do you

like to purchase your tooling leather and for what reason?

[Michael Sheldon]

For veg-tan, I only use Wickett and Craig

For latigo and miscellaneous, Siegel.

I don't buy leather from Tandy. Their quality is dodgy on a good day, but the price is the same as the quality suppliers.

[bruce johnson]

Weeell, OK. I'll jump into this snakepit of a topic with both feet.

I like Siegel's skirting - the golden oak. It is softer than HO. You will either like it or you won't. Nobody says, "Oh, it's sort of OK". They have some new colors, but I haven't tried them. I am a fan of the LM shearlings. I used to use Lazy M. Last fall I visited Siegels and took a swatch of Lazy M with me. Showed it to Steve. A short while later they started selling LM, it is consistantly as good or better than Lazy M by blind tests with some pretty picky folks. Denser wool, thick leather, and not as orangish as the Lazy M. More along the lines of the more yellow or tannish shearlings. I like Siegels USA greasy, waxy latigo. The greasier and waxier the better for me. Siegel's commercial oak is my lining of choice for heavier linings in the 2/3 - 4/5 range. This leather has been jacked seems like, and oils up OK. It doesn't tool up very well, too firm, but it will look good for plain linings and pockets. I also use the vegtan goats from Siegels for linings of the higher end or finer stuff. It also oils nicely for color. I like their mulehide for shoeing chaps and split it down for horn wraps. Diamond Tan is my favorite for gussets in ropebags and saddle bags. It is a waxy firmer bodied chrone tan. Some guys like it for chinks, but I think it is a bit stiff. Siegels sells a tooling leather that is the same tannage as the skirting, but only down to about 9/10 or something like that. Until I get a splitter like Greg, I have to source the lighter weights elsewhere. Sooo, staying in California, I buy the lighter tooling leathers from Hide House in Napa. It tools up about like the Siegels, and oils to about the same color. I like it.

My experience with Herman Oak is purely with me. I know guys that make it look really good in the lighter weights. My basket stamping looks flat, like I stamped it too wet or dry. The blocks look like those wheeled off police belts. I have had some issues with rawhide in the skirting as others have. I beat on some Thoroughbred at Elko for a couple days that was more than pretty good. I won a side of W&C last spring. Oiled up it didn't match anything I had. I made replacement stirrup leathers and a set of saddle bags out of it. It tooled OK, but oiled up kind of in-between. Would probably be fine if that was all you used. I know there are only a couple taneries left of consequence in the US, but some of the new imports are not your Daddy's imports for sure.

[abn]

Tandy -- You MUST go to the store and search for what you want and then tool a piece right there. There is some good leather in the stores, but a lot of times there isn't. I am not convinced they are committed to artisan quality leather yet, and maybe it is just because they don't hear us complaining. They are providing cheap Mexican leather more to bolster their margins than to provide quality material. I don't know where this mindset is coming from, but they need to change it. To me this is unfathomable because there are numerous leather companies offering quality imported hides at comparable prices.

For convenience I purchase my leather exclusively from Tandy, but as Art mentions, I always take a look at it in the store. Out of every 10 double shoulders, there will be one or two that I'll like. Tandy carries both domestic (Live Oak) and imported (Oak Leaf) sides. Look at both, because there will be times that the imported stuff is even better than the more expensive domestic leather.

If you don't have a store near you and have to mail-order, then the companies that the fellas mention above would probably be a good bet.

Regards, -Alex

[Regis]

Alex, or others,

So how about giving us some tips on picking that 1 or 2 out of a stak of 10? For tooling I mean. Over the next couple months, I'll have a chance to be in some leather shops (particularly TLF's) and would like some characteristics to look for or avoid (other than damaged areas in bad places).

Appreciate any advice,

Regis

For convenience I purchase my leather exclusively from Tandy, but as Art mentions, I always take a look at it in the store. Out of every 10 double shoulders, there will be one or two that I'll like. Tandy carries both domestic (Live Oak) and imported (Oak Leaf) sides. Look at both, because there will be times that the imported stuff is even better than the more expensive domestic leather.

If you don't have a store near you and have to mail-order, then the companies that the fellas mention above would probably be a good bet.

Regards, -Alex

[Roger]

Bruce.. is that golden oak the same as their strap sides?

i normally use 6-7 oz but i see they have strap in 7-80oz.

i have not been happy with the quality on the HO sides weaver has been sending and need to find something else.

[abn]

Alex, or others,

So how about giving us some tips on picking that 1 or 2 out of a stak of 10? For tooling I mean. Over the next couple months, I'll have a chance to be in some leather shops (particularly TLF's) and would like some characteristics to look for or avoid (other than damaged areas in bad places).

Appreciate any advice,

Regis

Great question, Regis. I'm sure others have their tips, but here are some of the things I look for.

• The leather's color is light, and hasn't been exposed to sunlight.

• The leather's in good condition, with few cuts, abrasions, or hard areas. (You'll need to check the flesh side for hidden cuts.)

• The leather's surface feels porous, not slick. A super smooth surface usually indicates oils that will have to be stripped.

• The leather's thickness is as advertised, and consistent throughout the side.

I'm sure I'm leaving out a few things. After a while, you'll be able to figure out which hides are the good ones simply by a quick glance. After you see your share of rough sides, the really nice ones will stand out.

-Alex

[Art]

Hi Beez,

I order manufactured and partially manufactured products (like belt blanks) from Weaver and the quality of the leather is quite good. Sometimes the manufacturing is screwed-up (they say something has been done and it hasn't or something is done I didn't ask for) but the leather is consistently good, even very good at times.

However......., I do not buy leather from them (quite a few other things yes, but not leather sides). I worry that (and I don't know this at all but it makes sense) when those pallets of leather come in the door, there is a guy or gal that sorts them and the good ones go to the manufacturing plant and others go to leather sales. It just seems in my evil little mind that this is the way it would be done. I don't think they are cheating anyone, a particular type and grade has a variance, and I would not suspect they mess with the grade, but that the high side of the variance goes one way and the low side another. Then again, I don't know how much HO they use in their production work.

I've only had one side of HO (direct from HO not Weaver) that was not right and they fixed that. It seems that the further the customer is removed from the manufacturer, the more the quality slips. Mind you, that side would have been perfectly acceptable for an import, however I hold US manufacturers to a higher standard.

I cannot fault Weaver on their customer service though; if it is not right, they fix it, not quite a good as Siegel, but still pretty good.

Art

Bruce.. is that golden oak the same as their strap sides?

i normally use 6-7 oz but i see they have strap in 7-80oz.

i have not been happy with the quality on the HO sides weaver has been sending and need to find something else.

[Roger]

the sides i get from weaver seem to vary greatly!

i only order one side at a time and most times one a month. one of my problems is, i need it when i order it! i don't have time to wait on another being shipped to me. i do wish Tandy's top shelf leather was a bit better... i can get a side from them next day.

you pay top dollar for HO and the last side i got has quite a bit of stretch marks, open grain and some pretty bad scratches.

i always specify to please send me very clean hides as i use them for larger projects and this one is worse than the last.

[Art]

Hi Beez,

Contact Steve Siegel and tell him exactly what you use and what you want and see if he can help you out. They don't handle HO, but they might have something to approximate it (may even be better). His email is:

ceo@siegelofca.com

It might take a day or two, but he will get back to you.

Art

the sides i get from weaver seem to vary greatly!

i only order one side at a time and most times one a month. one of my problems is, i need it when i order it! i don't have time to wait on another being shipped to me. i do wish Tandy's top shelf leather was a bit better... i can get a side from them next day.

[Roger]

Hi Beez,

Contact Steve Siegel and tell him exactly what you use and what you want and see if he can help you out. They don't handle HO, but they might have something to approximate it (may even be better). His email is:

ceo@siegelofca.com

It might take a day or two, but he will get back to you.

Art

yea.. i guess i will.

I've had no complaints with what i have ordered from them

i have been buying their import double shoulders when they are on the friday special. i use them for my bags.

[Roger]

I went ahead and just ordered a side for Siegel.

after reading the descriptions it says that their strap sides are the same as their skirting.

I gave them a good explanation of watch it will be used for so, I'll see what i get

[bruce johnson]

Beez,

Been otherwise occupied for the day. Yes the Siegel strap sides are the same tannage as the skirting I like. Talk to the rep, they can pick the lighter 7/8s if you need to go light. When I need to get lighter for wallets and stuff like that, then I get it from HideHouse. Siegels are 1-2 days shipping away, HideHouse is overnight, as is TLF in Fresno. I am pretty spoiled. For personal reasons, Siegels are my first go-to leather supplier. I haven't dealt with Goliger or Stevenson-Paxton, although they are all close by too. I try to run with minimal inventory on hand for most things. Like my other business, "I want to use the last one as the brown truck pulls up", "Let the supplier be your warehouse" and those other business class mantras. Vandy at Sheridan Leather Outiftters was two or three days on my last order, and she has some hardware stuff nobody else does. That's cool. She may be the closest seller of Thoroughbred leather if they are still carrying it.

[CitizenKate]

Of all the hides I've used:

- Tandy Oak Leaf

- Seigel "Texano"

- Hidecrafter Laredo

- Wickett & Craig tooling sides

The W&C and Laredo are just about tied for for nice tooling properties. I mostly buy W&C these days because they have been the most consistent yield. I would order more Laredo, but it doesn't come in the weight I use the most.

Kate