GB 125 vs 134x8

[JHLeatherwood]

So many questions ...

I got my Consew 332 "estate sale special" back from the "repair guy" and my confidence in him is shot. So I need help.

He installed the GB 125 needle shown. 

He told me I needed to buy 135x16 needles, and to use 18 or 20 for my 69 and 92-weight threads (starting with 92 on top and 69 in the bobbin).

In earlier conversations on here, and after a phone call with Bob @ Toledo, I bought the needles shown in the second photo.

They are SIGNIFICANTLY shorter, and appear to be 135x8 - which makes sense why they'd be shorter.

This is my first industrial sewing machine, and my first machine in 20+ years. I have the Consew manual (a bad scan of 40-year-old paper), and I'm mechanically minded, so I'm willing to dive in.

Should I:

• Go with the 134s I bought from Toledo, knowing that means I'm going to have to learn how to adjust the needle height and timing?
• Find more of the GB 125s, which I can drop  in but may be more prone to breaking because they're long?

I'm mostly sewing scrap right now, learning how to use the new servo and machine. I'll use this mostly for non-visible lightweight sewing in wallets, bags, and accessories. Once I get more comfortable (and consistent with it, I may sew sheaths and visible seams on bags and wallets. Holsters etc. will still be hand-sewn, until I can afford a machine that will handle 277 thread.

Also: I'm strictly a hobbyist.

• Does it make sense to buy pre-wound bobbins, or am I OK winding my own?

The bobbin winder that came with the machine is irreparable, but I rigged up a substitute with my cordless drill that seems to work OK.

[Wizcrafts]

3 hours ago, JHLeatherwood said:

I have the Consew manual

Use the needle system shown in your manual. The system defines the upper mounting shank diameter and the length to the eye, and/or the tip. It also can differentiate between round and leather points. Set the needle bar to time those needles.

The designation "GB 125" doesn't tell us the needle system, just the business end diameter. A #125 needle is also called Singer size 20. This is used with #92 thread in difficult materials, instead of the usual #19 needle (aka: #120). For instance, I am currently using a #20 needle on a project where I sew with #92 thread through stick-on Velcro that is stuck onto clear 20 gauge vinyl. The sticky goop fouls the eye of the normal size 19 needle causing skipped stitches, while the #20 sails on along.

[DonInReno]

It’s always exciting when someone gets a new machine - you’ll find all sorts of uses for it.

Many people will set their machines up for the longer needles in order to have a common needle for walking foot machines as well as any needle feed machines such as your consew.   If the style of needle you like is available in the shorter needles, such as the ones you’ve purchased, there’s no benefit going with the longer ones since this is your only machine.    The length of the needle won’t change the maximum thickness of material that will fit under the presser foot.

With these twin needle machines you don’t have to use it with two needles.

Also, many different stitching widths are available and often come as a set including presser foot, needle clamp, feed dog and needle plate.   The hooks would also need to be adjusted for the different needle spacing, but it’s not a hugely difficult process once you get the hang of it.

Personally I like the same size thread top and bottom unless there is a tangible visual benefit to the different sizes.

Keep in mind that your machine and needle feed Singer/Juki/Seiko machines that look similar are also very similar internally so if you don’t find an answer in a Consew manual, it might still be easy to find in other places.

My Singer leaks oil like crazy from the upper oil reservoir so leaving a piece of cloth under the presser foot when not being used helps keep the oil from puddling when not being used. 

[JHLeatherwood]

Great answers - this place is a gold mine! And I appreciate y'all's patience as I learn a Brand New Thing or two.

@Wizcrafts the manual says "135x7 #9-#20 (327RB-1 : 135x7 #11 to #22)" on the needle size. 

The Thread Exchange reference page says the 135x5 and 135x7 are recommended

332 ALL CLASSES EXCEPT

134

DBx1*, 135x5, 135x7, DPx5, SY 1955

I get that the 134 is the  Groz-Beckert size scheme.

I've looked at way too many cross-reference and needle descriptions, and I'm still confused. I completely trust Bob Kovar, and he sold me the needles in the photo above - it looks to me like they're all "134" (in 16, 19, and 23 to match the 69, 92, and 207 threads I bought). Is there any reason NOT to use the needle Bob sold me?

I still don't understand what the number after the "x" means: the manual says to use 135x7, Bob sold me 135x8, and sewing machine repair guy (SMRG) said to use 135x16.

To set the needle "length", I look at the manual pages 7 and 8. I understand each of the words they use, but I'm not really following the procedure. It doesn't help that the scanned photos are dark smudges. I'd love to find a better version, or even a good video showing how to set the needle height and timing.

Sorry for the wall of text. 

[JHLeatherwood]

@DonInReno - great info- thank you. I've noticed oil running down the needle, and I already have a small puddle in the drip tray.

I don't suppose you know if there's a good-quality electronic or still-in-print Singer manual for a twin to my machine? Like I said to Wiz above, my downloaded manuals are bad scans of mid-'80s translated Japanese technical writing. The only videos I've found specifically for my machine on youtube are less than stellar, too.

Thanks for your help!

 

[DonInReno]

While you don’t have a walking foot machine, setting the hook and needle is very similar.   Check out all Uve’s videos, but this one explains the relationship between hook, needle gap, and needle height you’re looking for.  Moving the needle bar up or down is a pretty simple matter of loosening a screw and moving the bar a little.

 

[Wizcrafts]

3 hours ago, JHLeatherwood said:

I completely trust Bob Kovar, and he sold me the needles in the photo above - it looks to me like they're all "134" (in 16, 19, and 23 to match the 69, 92, and 207 threads I bought). Is there any reason NOT to use the needle Bob sold me?

No, you can trust Bob. The system 134 (and DBx1) is equivalent to several other systems. Just make sure that the machine sews properly with those needles. This corresponds to the needle system in the manual.

[CowboyBob]

The 135x5x7 are round points for cloth & vinyl,the 135x8's are D point (diamond) for leather.If you use or were to use the longer 135x17 needles they would break easier since this is a needlefeed machine,that's why it came from the factory with the shorter needles .

[JHLeatherwood]

1 hour ago, CowboyBob said:

The 135x5x7 are round points for cloth & vinyl,the 135x8's are D point (diamond) for leather.If you use or were to use the longer 135x17 needles they would break easier since this is a needlefeed machine,that's why it came from the factory with the shorter needles .

Perfect - thanks for all your help.

So the 5 after the x means round point, and the 8 means triangle point. Thanks for clearing that up.

[JHLeatherwood]

9 hours ago, DonInReno said:

While you don’t have a walking foot machine, setting the hook and needle is very similar.   Check out all Uve’s videos, but this one explains the relationship between hook, needle gap, and needle height you’re looking for.  Moving the needle bar up or down is a pretty simple matter of loosening a screw and moving the bar a little.

<snipped the video>

I'll look Uve up and see what I can learn. Thanks for the tip.