horsewreck

This topic can be discussed at so many levels, so here are a few of my scattered thoughts on the subject. As far as what percentage of total production the big tree makers have, I could not hazard a guess. Ther are several tree factories that turn out a lot of trees and they sell to all manner of saddle builders. A good quality production tree can be as good or better than a halfast custom hand made tree. That having been said I think a well designed well built hand made tree is better than just about any production tree. One function of a custom tree maker is to make trees that might not be available from mass builders, and we have the perception that the quality will be better as well. We have the same perception of the custom made saddle. Our perceptions of both the tree maker and the saddler can be faulty. Large scale tree and saddle factories develope lines of product that can be made and marketed in mass, which gives them the edge on price. Quality of these products can often be good. Terms used to describe saddles and trees can cunfuse as well, custom, hand made, shop made and so on. To my way of thinking a custom made saddle is one that starts with the customer and their idea of what they want, from there the saddler orders the tree and such, then builds the custom saddle. The tree used in the custom saddle can be a stock production tree, a semi-custom tree, a custom production tree, or a hand made boutique tree, as long as the specs. and quality is what the customer ordered.

Even though the Stohlman books are high priced, they are the best books on the subject. GOOD LUCK!!

Get the Stolhman books, read them, and if your first saddle is to be a plain affair, you don't need a lot of tools. As far as hand stitching a complete saddle, I made my first saddles without a stitcher and it is very rewarding. If we want to learn and make a good product your best tools are at the end of your arms, and the top of your neck..... Good luck

With over thirty years of building gun leather and such I am happy to report that in most parts of Texas there are more of us than them..... Life is good don't give it up without a fight.....

I have had at least four delrin stamps made and I like them real well. My first one came from hidecrafters and is a very large oval stamp (2 inch) made of white delrin it must be ten years old. My last few of different sizes came from Jeff at Grey Ghost, and I have had good luck with them as well. Metal stamps are not without their problems some can rust and an unplanned trip from the work bench to a concrete floor can damage them as well. Bottom line, for the money DELRIN!........

Billymac, Frank has it about right, I would only add that the tannage is the same on all their skirting and tooling leathers. I have used quite a bit of the sp grade leather and on balance I have been happy with it. Wickett uses steer hides from canada and their sides are always unbranded and tend to run large. Imperfections in leather can be range marks, but they sometimes are damage done to the hide during tanning either way you can work around these flaws. Hope this is of some value to you.

Lee, The ASMA just mailed out their newest version of the green book. I have been getting it from the time they started putting it out, that said I don't use it as my only guide to pricing as materials costs change during the year and other factors change operating costs. We consider the green book well done but we also stay aware of what other established shops charge for various repairs and try to compete while still making a good profit. Many shops under value their work!......

I just happened across this topic and thought I would reply to the question. I have been building and selling holsters for over 30 years, though my main product is saddlery. In those years I have not carried any special holster liability insurance. I have built for CHL holders, mounted action shooters, collectors, ranchers, law enforcement, and so on. each holster is custom made to the buyers wishes, so I am contracting to build what they ask for. That having been said I do inform them of any potential safety issues in what they are asking me to build. Most of this discussion concerns retention of the firearm, safety of the basic design, comfort, and practicality of the carrying location and position of the weapon. We will point out any safety issue we see in what they want and will try to direct them toward a design they can carry happily for many years. If a person requests us to build an unsafe holster we will decline the job. We even remind even the "experienced" of the basics like put the holster on the belt then put the gun in the holster. If as the original author stated a holster needs to be broken in that is best done with an empty gun. The problem with liability insurance is how much is enough if you carry a half million dollars what keeps the damaged person from seeking a million? Disclaimers are something that can be used and often are used in the saddlery buisness, where you state in writing that the activity is inheritly dangerous and the user is responsible for checking and maintaining their equipment. Anyone wanting to use a disclaimer should consult a lawyer. I hope this is of some value...........

As has been stated there are some good books out there on the subject,videos as well. That having been said consider getting a kit such as the one sold by Bowden which has the tree of your choice all the hardware, wool, and two sides of leather. The pieces of the saddle aren't cut out so you are learning layout, cutting, and your first will be to your liking as far as tree style etc. Get some books and videos, maybe do some repairs or take a few old ones apart,then you will have a feel for your subject. Good Luck!

fender design does vary depending on the use and style of the saddle, certain shapes a narrow straight line fender was for example seen on cutter saddles while a ranch or roping saddle is more apt to have a wider fuller look. Saddles with exposed stirrup leathers have a straight line front line. That having been said, the design of a fender has to do with balance as far as the over all look of the saddle. When I first started working on saddles I traced off many fenders of saddles brought to me for repairs, if I found them interesting. I will still "borrow" a design I like but now tend to have several favorites I use over and over, but most are used on only one or two types of saddle (roper, cutter,barrel, etc). As far as fender design as it relates to the type of foot wear one uses I have addressed in another posting of yours. I hope this has been of some help to you.

Most of the charro saddles I have seen do have very short bars, have only a rim fire front rigging where a ring is hung on a loop of leather around the fork on each side, many have stirrup leathers that are very long going around twice ( I cut a set last year for a charro that had a finished length of @ten feet.). The style of roping is dally and the large wood horn is design for that purpose. Like any style the design varies, and I claim no special knowledge on the subject. The seats do run to the short side. I would not use a traditional tree if I were going to build one (which I won't). I would try to find some one who could build one using all we have learned about fitting horses in the last one hundred years. Bowden used to make a charro tree but have dropped it from their catalog. I hope this was of some help to you.

A few saddle makers put a boot drop or elephant ear on the bottom of the fender on some of their saddles. Fallis saddlery in colorado, Jack Carroll in Arizona, Dave Jones of Florida and others have used this boot drop in the past. Fallis I think is one of the few left that still put it on their saddles (check for a web site for Fallis). That having been said, if one has a saddle that the fender base catches on the top of their boot you can readjust the location of the bend in the fender leg (the bend where the stirrup hangs). Dampen the fender leg with water shorten the fender leg bend just enough to relieve the problem and stick a broomhandle through the stirrups while they dry out. Don't raise the bend to close to the bottom of the fender, only as much as you need to solve the problem. Or you can use this issue as an excuse to buy a new pair of buckaroo boots. That works for me.....

A good reference on saddle horn covering is Vol. 1 of Al Stohlman's saddle making book. It has various patterns for for different heights, caps, lean, etc. It would be hard to have one pattern for all horn shapes. I think you can get the book at Tandy stores, and it's worth the money if your self teaching yourself saddlery...

B. Bob has it just about right on. When I hear that stuff about dunking a saddle in anything I go nuts. Good new wool will make a saddle look a little high but that is short lived. As far as breakin I instruct people on how to do a wet and set on the stirrup leathers if they have a factory saddle (any good bench made saddle will come set). Other than that the only thing that needs to be wet is the saddle blankets (horse sweat not dunking). Then a good clean and oil from time to time. I have seen a few cheap saddles with no blocking in the skirts, but have never seen a serious saddle made that way.

Instead of stainless ring shank nails use galvanized nails, ring shanks tear up to much when they have to be removed during repairs. If your town has a old style hardware store they might have some of the old hot dip type galv. nails in @ a 3d. I got a box at a farm sale for a song. Blue tacks should at most lumber yards.....

I use the actual gun to shape holsters. Unload gun, Put on a light coat of gun oil, wrap gun in sandwitch wrap, dampen holster,put in gun, shape. On semi auto hand guns I like to tight up (bone) the ejection port pretty well. You may have your stitch line a little far out from the gun, if so is there a place to add a tension screw? I find that if you want a tight boned fit, case your leather overnight before you shape it.

I think most of the time it's not worth building on an older tree.The main reason to do so would be the tree suits you and your horses to a tee. That does not seem to be the case here, plus as you know trees have changed so much in the last 60 years. I will bet the tree could use more gullet width, plus most of those old saddles didn't have as much twist to the bars as newer ones, and it sounds like it doesn't have enough flair as well. If you are going to build a new saddle I vote for springing a few more bucks and getting a new tree...

While it is a fairly long process you go through it does get you there. When I first started making holsters I used a like process. After a couple of years building I figured out some short cuts and things start to speed up. Stay after it.

You might try Bowden Saddle Tree Co., they have wade and cliff wade trees in 15.5 &16" seats in stock. They are well made and reall straight. Priced at a little over 200 bucks.