Tosch

TwinOaks, thanks for your sympathy!! I did,too, - and felt better. Russ, you are a genius! I followed your advise - and it works! Now let's have a chat. Thanks! Tosch

Since I have installed the latest java version (Java 6 update 13: 6.0.130) about 2 months ago I cannot log in to the Live Chat anymore. When I installed this java version I de-installed all other Java software I have followed repeatedly all the steps suggested w/o success. If someone has any idea what I might try I would appreciate if you could let me now. I am not a computer expert but normally can follow instruction where to go, what to open, where to click etc. What I tried repeatedly without any success is the following : When I try to log in for the LIVE CHAT I get 1) a board message "sorry, your browser is not not java enabled, please visit our java support page" 2) a pop-up message " installation of a active-x element from this site to your computer has been stopped for security reason", click here to show your options…. When I do that and click on "install active – x element" I do get an IE security warning: "This software has been blocked , because the editor could not be verified" and I get nowhere… When I go to the java support page - I verified that I have the latest java version - I used : To find out if Java is working on your system please visit: Test your Java Virtual Machine (JVM) - it failed so did go to 1)Enable Java through your Web browser Internet Explorer 4.x and Up 1. Click "Tools" --> "Internet Options" 2.Check the box next to the Java version 3. select the Security Tab and select the "custom Level" button 4. Scroll down to "scripting of Java applets" 5. Make sure the "Enable " radio button is checked 6. Click ok to save your preferance. Everything was already set … so I did go to 2) Enable Java through the "Java Plug-in Control Panel" SOLUTION To see whether your browser is configured to use Java or not, first open Windows Control Panel. From the Start menu button, select Settings, then Control Panel to open the Control Panel. You should see Java Coffee Cup logo icon in the Control Panel. 1. Double click the icon to open Java Control Panel 2. In Jabva Cntrol Panel click the Advanced tab 3. Click + icon next to Default Java for browsers 4.Make shure the box next to IE..is checked 5. If it is not checked , click the checkbox to enable Java for your Web browser. 6. Click Apply. If you do not see the coffe cup icon in the Windows Control Panel , you do not have the latest version of JAva installed on your computer. Everything was already set … so I did go to 3) Clearing your Web Browser Cache For Internet Explorer 4.x and Up 1.Click "Tools" from the Internet Explorer menubar 2. Click "Internet Options..." 3.Click the "General" Tab 4Click the "Delete Files" button in the "Temporary Internet files" section 5I.f you still have a problem, repeat the steps above and restart the computer. I have done every thing including step 5 at least x times the last months …. If you have read so far and still feel you like to share an idea.. Thank you very much!!!

If you are in North America, maybe they can help you: U.S.A. Stübben North America 1018 Wounded Knee Lane 22974 Troy, VA Call Toll Free 001 800 550 1110 Call Free Fax 001 800 760 1110

I used the search button for you and came up with this : http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?s...aid+padded+seat Hope it helps. Tosch

Where do you commonly measure seat lenght? From the inner top edge of the cantle to - the top of the handhole? (compare Nikkel's and Bowden's websites) or to - the back/base of the horn? (Verlane's booklet on Western Saddles) both in the wood not wood plus rawhide Has there been a shift from one point of measurement to the other over time - or is one measurement more commonly used by tree and saddle makers and the other more by riders? Or - no industry "standard", so you best state which measurements you are talking about? (I am aware of thigh length and pitch of fork and cantle, and influence of cantle height ...) Thanks. Tosch

Chuck, I did not intent to hint anything - just trying to help out a bit. Tosch

Chuck, maybe you want to have a look here http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=906 Hope it helps. Tosch

Chuck, you might want to try the search button - meanwhile this link might be of some help http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=4178 Tosch

Hidepounder, when you follow this link http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?s...=2913&st=20 , scroll down to my post of May 14, 2008, and open the file "David Genadek rigging position 1 .pdf" . In the second picture you will see that David G's 5/8 rigging position is what probably commonly is called a 7/8 position. Don't know whether it makes a difference but just wanted to point it out. In this link about flat-plate riggings http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=906 also the strength of correctly constructed in-skirts has been addressed. Here http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=4210, too. Tosch

For what it is worth I have stumbled across this side http://saddlesthatfit.com/Services.htm that might answer some of your ??? in part. They charge USD 225 per horse and rider, and somewhere else they say an individual fitting takes 3-4 hours. To my understanding the websites indicate their customer target group are recreational riders. They sell used saddles from a group of selected factory makers, organize saddle fit clinics and offer a 3 day Advanced Saddle Fitting course for the Equine Professional where they ask the participants to first read : "The Pain Free Back And Saddle Fit Book" by Dr. Joyce Harmon. Regarding their own training their homepage states "We've worked with industry experts, and studied equine bio-mechanics and history to re-discover the equine knowledge that everyone had before cars; when everyone depended on their horses for their livelihood. It isn't simple, but it isn't rocket science either. We believe that with a little guidance and practice everyone can – and should – learn the basics of the 'scientific-art' of saddle fit. ..." Tosch

I mainly ran into the term "Professional Saddle Fitter" when surfing US websites. The only American qualification/certification institution I saw can be seen here http://www.saddlemakers.org/id112.htm. Although they do not list a "saddle fitter" certification - saddle fitting is part of becoming a certified retailer - I seem to remember they had that , but I might be wrong. In the German speaking European countries to gain formal trade recognition (on any trade) one has do to a apprenticeship (generally around 3 years). It is a regulated training/schooling. Most of the time is spent in the workshop but a good amount of time is spend in school where one gets the theoretical background. And it is regulated what you learn in the first year of the apprecenticeship, in the second, in the third - and of course you have to pass a final exam. If you want to become a master in your trade you have to work for a few years in your trade first, then go back to school - and of course take another exam. And to take on an apprentice you have to be a master in your trade. But this applies to trades (saddlemaker, car mechanic, airplane mechanic,..). And not to the important but "small" (lack of proper term) area of fitting a saddle. I have not heard of a saddle fitter certification here. Although I could imagine that you could spend a day or two with a saddlemaker and he/she provides you with his/her own certification. Or you might think you know a bit more then the next person and call yourself a saddle fitter, and when you get paid for it you are probably a professional saddle fitter....

The best advise is - call Timberline and talk to them! They were nice and friendly when I pestered them with my amateuer questions for 2 hours when I stopped by. Just explain what you want and like. Ask for Randy who runs the company, or for Aaron (his brother?) if I remember his name correctly. When I called them before I visited I simply asked to talk to someone knowledgeable about trees - and got to talk to Randy. I assume they are still nice and friendly. Their phone # is 435-789-8228. Tosch

Well, the catalogue says Santa Fe tree. So let us assume it is one. Seems like Timberline builds a Santa Fe tree. Scroll a bit down here http://www.sawtoothsaddle.com/saddles.php?cat=Old-Time close to the bottom of the page are 2 saddles said to be built on a Santa Fe tree. Sawtooth saddlery is in the same town as Timberline and they get their trees from Timberline... Tosch

Congratulations to both of you ! Elton , thanks for posting the pic! Darcy, can we see your's, too? Thanks in advance! Tosch

Art, we both know you are a displaced German! We just allowed you to be born in the US Have a great day Tosch

I am from Germany Living in Switzerland Tosch

Bloss a weng ! I had lived a bit north of Schweinfurt for 3 years and later in Ansbach for 1 year. But I am originally from Hamburg... I am positive you will feel at home here. Tosch

Grüss Gott und oh je, nun sind auch die Unterfrang'n angekommen .... Die Leute hier sind sehr nett und hilfsbereit!! Also keine Scheu nach Tipps zu fragen und Bilder reinzustellen. Fühl Dich wohl - und 'ne gute Zeit! Tosch

Joanne, since Dennis' site is under construction Rod and Denise have also explained how to use the cards: http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=10369 . Tosch

Joanne, Just a thought: IF you had the Dennis Lane card system at you hands you could measure your horse with the cards. Then you could make complementary cards of the horse's back shape and check the fit of those at the correct spot of the saddle's underside. I bet Darcy and/or one of the other forum members attending would be so kind and point out to you where at the saddle's underside/ the saddle tree you would have to measure the fit with your cards "representing" your horse's back. I keep my fingers crossed for you to find a saddle and of course to have fun!! ( And say hello from me to Darcy !!! and to the forum members you are going to see there!!) Tosch

Hi Cheryl, Welcome to the board! Do yourself a favor and and have an indeph look through the topics in the categories "Choosing the rigt saddle for the horse" and "saddle supplies, tools, and trees". There are lots of topics about how to fit a tree. Pay special attention to the topics discussing the "Dennis Lane card profiling cards". Hope this helps to get you started. Tosch

Does someone has an email address for Billy Cook, OK, ? I cannot find any, nor can I find a website. If possible the CEOs email, I wanted to let them know that on Germany's ebay fake (or I would be too severely mistaken) Billy Cooks are being offered - from India, and not for the first time. For anyone interested here is a link: http://cgi.ebay.de/16-BILLY-COOK-WESTERN-S...A1%7C240%3A1318 and here another: http://cgi.ebay.de/16-BILLY-COOK-WESTERN-S...A1%7C240%3A1318 If you have an email address let me know (PM) or let Billy Cook know directly if you want. Tosch

How about burying the saddlebags in saw dust or sand for a while? Tosch

Hi Terry perhaps you will find what you are looking for here http://www.ralide.com/store/customer/home.php?cat=26 Tosch

Hi Joe, One pic should show the whole catalog page with trees and saddles build on these trees and another pic with just the trees (forks) and an explanation regarding the Montana tree. If the tree is what you might be looking for, I know that Sawtooth Saddle Company gets its trees from Timberline Saddle Tree Company in their hometown of Vernal, UT. So they should be able to give you information regarding specific measurements. Hope this helps. Tosch