Help with old Singer cylinder arm machine

[Metalhorseman]

Hello everyone!
Been lurking for many years on site . That’s how I found where to buy my Seiko STH-8BLD-3 a few years ago.Just found an old Singer Cylinder arm machine 107G253 on Craigslist for $75. It’s a straight/Zigzag machine ,Bought it from a guy that had a huge warehouse . Anyway couldn’t pass it up , I know it’s not a walking foot machine but it might help me sew canvas and vinyl bags.Can’t find a whole lot of info on machine but it’s sister machine is 107G201 from the 50’s I believe. It was kinda dirty been used a lot .Things were kinda jammed with thread . Some missing screws and parts damaged. I was able to get stitch adjusting knob freed up .but was having tension issues from underneath,partially started taking things apart and cleaning , oiling but not too much . 
 I know enough not to start loosening screws and take pics before hand . Started turning hand wheel by hand and could hear this clicking noise found the #20 needle that was in it was rubbing the hook assembly. But not sure how to move away . I bought #14,16,18, 20 needles for it , wanna sew Tex 69,92 bonded polyester if possible. 
I know there’s lots of professionals on this site , been reading so much ! It’s easy to get sidetracked. Find this site Very Informative! Has anyone seen this machine before?
Can anyone give me procedures on how to go thru machine and set up correctly? and how to move the needle away from hook assembly. I’ve been studying all the screws and mechanisms.
I printed out a maintenance manual, it’s like copies of a xerox pages Hard to make out details.. I am mechanical and detailed oriented and have loads of enthusiasm! Will try and post pics ..

Thank You in advance for any help ,, Wayne 

sorry Wizcrafts I’m not sure where to post, if you need to change I would appreciate that ! Thank You

Oh darn, Guess I’m going to need help to reduce size of pics …more reading I guess 

 

 

Edited March 12, 2023 by Northmount
Resized and posted heic pic as jpg

[DonInReno]

That’s really cool - great buy!
 

I know I’m not helping much, but the first thing that came to mind is wondering what would happen in normal use to make a hook get closer to the needle.  Did a needle break in a weird way and bend the tip of the hook?  Did someone try to replace the hook and this aftermarket part is not able to fit no matter what?  Did the needle shaft get bent?   Hopefully it just needs an adjustment - for the last 60 years all types of people,  both knowledgeable and not, have tweaked and adjusted it.

If it doesn’t come up, as you take things apart or adjust them, Singer likes to use two different types of set screws, both flat tipped and pointed.  Pointed set screws are designed to fit in a slot that keeps them from slipping around the shaft, but allows it to be adjusted anywhere along the groove.  A pointed set screw shouldn’t be found on a round shaft or even a shaft with a flat.  Not having ever seen one of these I’d first look for a set screw that might hold the hook on its shaft- it might be a couple of screws spaced around the hook.  The hook’s shaft will ride in a bushing - many bushings are held in place with a set screw and that might have moved - heck that might be the adjustment.   If there is no room for adjustment, but there’s a washer or shim between the hook and it’s bushing, the washer may be the adjustment, but that’s just one wild guess not knowing anything about these.  Maybe the adjustment is in the needle bar frame?
 

Im looking forward to seeing how this mechanism works.

Edited March 12, 2023 by DonInReno

[Northmount]

2 hours ago, Metalhorseman said:

Oh darn, Guess I’m going to need help to reduce size of pics …more reading I guess 

See this link for some helps on resizing photo files, plus lots more info on the web. 

And some info on heic photo files

[Constabulary]

The predecessor is the Singer 107w50. I think it shares a lot of parts with this machine. Yours just has a more modern casting. I think it is late 1950´s -1960´s made. The predecessor flat bed version of your machine is the 107w1, 107w2, 107w3 and the like. The flat bed machines for sure share some parts with the cylinder arm version a s well.

I´m almost certain that the instructions for the 107w50 will help you a lot with your machine.

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/364298/Singer-107w50.html?page=6#manual

 

Edited March 12, 2023 by Constabulary

[Metalhorseman]

Hey Thanks for the Replies! 
Any and Everything helps . I guess I can only post one pic at a Time.

Thanks Constabulary ,, lots more reading .

Needle rub.HEIC

[Wizcrafts]

52 minutes ago, Metalhorseman said:

Hey Thanks for the Replies! 
Any and Everything helps . I guess I can only post one pic at a Time.

Thanks Constabulary ,, lots more reading .

Needle rub.HEIC 1.22 MB · 1 download

I'm afraid that only Apple device users can see what you uploaded. I cannot open that filetype on my Windows 10 PC. It would be better if you can save the photo as a standard .jpg filetype and upload it again. It will probably be a smaller file that way.

[Metalhorseman]

Ok Thanks Wizcrafts, will try again....

[Tejas]

Converted, cropped and attached.

[Northmount]

3 hours ago, Metalhorseman said:

Ok Thanks Wizcrafts, will try again....

Some more info for you about posting photos.  See this link for resizing files.  Also there is much more information and tools on the web for resizing photos.  And see this link with some info about heic files.

[Metalhorseman]

Thank You Tejas !

Have some more questions 

figured out how to move hook assembly horizontal or North as some say .. now that I have it all out of wack ,lol. From my understanding you have to start by getting straight stitch dead on , and can not get it still off an 1/8”. Took apart bight adjustment knob and found at the end of the pin is a worn spot /Divet in the metal.. could this be why I can’t dial in straight stitch ? Divet is not as much needle travels in the west to east movement. 
Was reading for hours and one guy gave this lady a procedure to adjust machine in a certain order .. wish I would have mark it some how to read again , think I read 20-30 pages yesterday .

hey Tejas think u can work magic again on my pic ? 
Also is there a certain correct distance gears need to mesh on the hook assembly shaft when I get back to adjusting needle bar height and hook to eye distance?

Thanks Wayne,

back to reading 

Northmount , I’m using my iPhone work phone , Xs max if that matters ,, maybe I can get computer savvy guys at work to show me what ur telling me , I’ll read again though.. Thanks 

Worn spot.HEIC

Edited March 13, 2023 by Metalhorseman

[Metalhorseman]

Thank You Tejas !

Have some more questions 

figured out how to move hook assembly horizontal or North as some say .. now that I have it all out of wack ,lol. From my understanding you have to start by getting straight stitch dead on , and can not get it still off an 1/8”. Took apart bight adjustment knob and found at the end of the pin is a worn spot /Divet in the metal.. could this be why I can’t dial in straight stitch ? Divet is not as much needle travels in the west to east movement. 
Was reading for hours and one guy gave this lady a procedure to adjust machine in a certain order .. wish I would have mark it some how to read again , think I read 20-30 pages yesterday .

hey Tejas think u can work magic again on my pic ? 
Also is there a certain correct distance gears need to mesh on the hook assembly shaft when I get back to adjusting needle bar height and hook to eye distance?

Thanks Wayne,

back to reading 

 

Sorry for double post,, I did the email to myself way !!!!

[DonInReno]

The order of adjustment of a hook on almost any industrial machine is to first install a new needle, then bring the needle to bottom of its stroke, then keep turning the handwheel until the needle raises the thickness of a nickel, or 3/32”.    At this position the very point of the hook should be at the center of the needle and 1/16” above the needle eye.  If you’re making a 1/8” zig zag then the hook would be 1/16” to one side of the hook, then the next stroke it would be 1/16” to the other side.   The needle bar is adjusted up or down as needed. The hook is now timed with the needle.

Then the distance (gap) between the tip of hook and needle is adjust to be as close as possible without touching.

Many sewing machine adjustments aren’t intuitive, I’d suggest not adjusting anything further until you know for sure what it does - many machines have been adjusted in the wrong ways until they are are very hard to sort out.   I’m guessing the person before you couldn’t figure it out and whatever they did isn’t helping.  I wouldn’t mess with anything zig zag related until the hook is figured out - just set it for as close to a straight stitch as it will do and that will be close enough.  I looked a bit and have yet to see an online service manual for this machine or the 107w50 that describes hook adjustment and what set screws to use.

On the one picture showing the needle and hook assembly - the surface finish of the  flat surface is terrible - I’d be very surprised if it was made by Singer.   There is a chance that this hook is a poorly made replacement part that has never worked properly.  First I’d find a manual that shows the proper adjustment, if it won’t adjust properly then look closer at a replacement part.

 

[Metalhorseman]

Hey Don , ya I put new #20  needle in ,when I loosened up screws to slide assembly a tad away from needle. I was following the manual that said to remove to arm that holds the one side of hook assembly that just touches the most northern side of assembly and it kinda spun around more then I was hoping.  Now it's all loose and not engaging with other gear.figured I can slide gear back where it was.  I'll try again after work tomorrow and see if i can post another pic or two .Machine does rotate alot smoother now that needle isnt touching anything which is a good sign I think .lol Any idea where I would find a list of of what needle sizes I could run in this machine ? Missing a few throat place screws ,those little buggers can't be found at ace hardware !