Stitching questions

[Rawhide]

Hilly,

I think it's the pre waxed thread. I posted this exact same problem back before the crash of 07. I have since switched to barbour's cord, and have not had a problem since. You can pull as hard as you like, and the cord won't seem dirty.

Marlon

[Hilly]

Oh, Hilly- make sure you say "Hi" to me in April at the show! I'm so excited to get to put faces to names of friends!

Will do!

Ed- You're right, glovers needles are intended to pierce lighter weight leathers, and yes, they are very sharp. They do work great for handstitching, though, and are easier to use than a sharpened harness needle.

I'm guessing Hilly and I have similar problems sewing because we lack regular hand strength. Sewing with pliers takes up time, and it's awkward. Hilly, are you stabbing the hole with the awl, sewing a stitch, stabbing, sewing, or are you poking all your holes ahead of time? Some leathers seem to want to close faster than others, so if you can get into the habit of using the awl while sewing, that might help.

Johanna

Johanna, I stab one hole at a time, and then put in a stitch. Takes forEVER, but it's the best I can manage. I just think my hands are getting pretty bad.

[Hilly]

Hilly,

I think it's the pre waxed thread. I posted this exact same problem back before the crash of 07. I have since switched to barbour's cord, and have not had a problem since. You can pull as hard as you like, and the cord won't seem dirty.

Marlon

Thanks, Marlon.

Can you give me an idea of what the different cord counts are good for? I noticed that there's 3,4,5,6 & 7 cord. Also, different twists - left and right (but we won't worry about that now).

http://campbell-bosworth.com/catalog/index...e2d4987195ad393

I'm looking for the sizes to do, say, knife sheats, holsters, notebooks/photo albums, brief cases, wallets, etc. I don't want to buy a spool for $45, to find it's not the size I want. What size do you normally use, and what do you use it on the most? And where do you buy yours, and how much does it cost?

Thanks,

Hilly

[JRedding]

Hilly, Don't know if it helps and it sounds like what I do is highly irregular, I avoid having difficulty hand sewing by matching my needle size to the thread I'm using, and my awl size to the needle I'm using. Think of setting up to hand sew similiar to setting up a sewing machine, with matching components, the thread has to fit the project it's intended for and the needle and awl have to be an appropriate size so the thread passes through with no more difficulty than a machine would contend with. Occasionaly a needle hangs up and pliers are needed but if every stitch requires them something is making it hard on you. I think what I do that's irregular is I don't hand sew with heavy waxed thread if it's going to be seen, I sew with the same thread I use in my sewing machine, the reason, I use it is I handsew horns and cantles on my saddles and I don't like it if you can tell the difference between the machine stitch and the handsewn, that's what I strive for anyway. Sewing machines don't use waxed thread, and no one questions the durability or quality of a good machine stitch so why use it to handsew, a two needle handsewn stitch is probably a stronger stitch than a loop type stitch a machine uses so why not use the same thread as you'd feed a machine. I'll probably catch some flack about this but I just looked at it one day and thought "you'll never make it look as good as a machine can do if you keep using that big ugly thread" so I quit, that was many years and several hundred saddles a go and it's stood the test of time. Just how I do it, maybe it'll help somehow

[ETW Grumpy]

I get waxed Irish linen thread here:

http://www.royalwoodltd.com/cat14-17ar.htm

I use the 4 ply for wallets and the like. I make my wallet backs out of 8 oz and the 4 ply works well. It's $11.50 a spool. I have yet to use a whole spool of one color.

I also find that sometimes I have to use needle nose pliers to pull the harness needles through.

Hope this helps.

[Timbo]

Hey Hilly, here's a thought, I was just on Brettuns Village website and saw this, but they have a pack of multi-purpose household needles for 4.00. There are alot of different needles in the pack and you could order a couple and then if you really like them order more. But one of the types of needles included are the curved mattress needles. Here's my thought: If you can get most of the curve thru the hole it might be easier for you to pull thru as you won't have to have so much grip on the needle. You might even be able to grasp it with the crook of your thumb and pull it on thru. One other though would be if grasping it with your thumb and pulling thru works, you could cut the thumb off of a leather glove and wear it for a little more grip on the needle. (or don't waste a good glove and make your own, it's kinda what we do ain't it??)

It's just a thought and I thought of your thread when I saw them.

By the way, if it works, I'm pretty sure Osborne makes them too and they would be a better quality. They also make 'S' curved needles that could work for you as well.

Tim

[Warren]

Hilly,when I sew I put the backside needle through first and pull it out of the awl hole. Then I put the frontside needle into the hole just enough so it won't fall out. On the top of my awl handle I have a small indention. I place this against the needle and use the awl handle to push the needle as far as possible through the leather, then grab it on the other side and pull it out. It's similar to using a sewing palm and I don't have to switch the needles from one hand to the other as much. It really sped up my sewing when I started doing it this way. Hope this helps.

Warren

[Rawhide]

Hilly,

I use a number 5 cord for just about everything. The twists\ identifies which way it's twisted together, but that only matters if you are using it in a sewing machine. I think Left twist is for most sewing machines. I've had really good success with this cord. Now if I can just get my stitches to look uniform, I'll be in business. By the way. I bought mine from Campbell too. It comes in a spool of almost 1100 yards. That's probably enough for my lifetime.

Marlon

[barra]

Please forgive me if I cover what someone else has said. I'm going cross eyed after a 16 hr shift..

To easily form nicely laid down stitches it is imperative to match the size of the thread with the needle and the awl blade used to the needle. IE: only use an awl that has a blade large enough to make the hole large enough for your needle. No smaller and you will be using needle nosed pliers each stitch and any larger it will look unsightly.

When I was learning to hand sew on Gig harness traces and each trace is 5' 6", and has 4 rows at 8 to the inch, my boss filed a little grove on the top of the awl ferrule so that if I kept the little grove uppermost then the awl blade was at the correct angle. Try and not push the awl completely thru as the haft/ferrule can leave an unwarranted indentation in your leather. Also try and not twist the awl blade after you have pushed it thru in an effort to make the needle go thru easier. The reason you should not do this is because it defeats the purpose of using the diamond awl blade and makes the hole round and not diamond shaped. You will not lay your stitches down with that angled look that is indicative of good hand stitching.

Someone mentioned burnishing the bees wax with brown paper (lunch bags or grocery bags are fine). This is a good idea. The brown paper can also be used periodically as you sew (it helps clean up manky threads that get dirty just from the oils in your hands)

Save the dirty lump of beeswax for your brown/black threads and keep a nice clean block for white thread. I use old fly spray can lids as wax molds. (beware some lids have a little hole in them so line the bottom with cooking foil. I find this makes a nice sized ball of wax for my sized hand.

for some extra grip you can get those little rubber finger thimbles that bank tellers use to count bank notes or just cut the thumbs and index fingers off a pair of old rubber dish washing gloves. The little rubber thimble will help your grip.

I too have little indentations in all my awl handle that I can use to push the needle most of the way thru.

The most common harness egg eye needles I am aware of come from a company called john james and come in various sizes.

Barbours is probably the most common brand of linen thread. The rolls of thread come in various cord sizes. You will see 3 cord, 4 cord, 5 cord etc. Now to really confuse things, each of those cord sizes also has a correspoding ticket number. As an example you may have a roll of 3 cord "ticket 18" and then have a roll of 3 cord ticket 25. Both are 3 cord as both have 3 individual plys twisted together to make the final thread but on the 3 cord ticket 25, the 3 yarns used to twist up the final thread are finer than if it was 3 cord ticket 18. In other words, the higher the ticket number the thinner the thread.

As a saddler and harness maker it was common to use 3 cord ticket 25 on most bridle work. On items like a headcollar/halter a 4 cord was used. When you hand stitch something the finished item has to be strong but the thread used must not be overly big. As an example the pre waxed threads you get in most leathercraft kits are waaaaay bigger than needed. Overly thick thread looks unprofessional.

I would say a 4 cord would be fine for most holster applications. You may already be doing what I will now add but I have added it just in case your not. When you thread your needles, get your knife and drag the blade accross the thread to taper of some of the fibres. make nice long tapers and then wax. Pierce the needle thru the thread an inch or so back from your nice fine (now waxed) taper, slide the thread up to the eye of the needle and pass the tapered thread thru as far as it will go. Pull up on the needle and you will have formed sort of a larks head knot. You can now tow the Queen Mary and the needle won't come off. This avoids having a large bump of thread that is larger than your needle that you are trying to pull thru you awl hole.

I know some people who hand stitch and don't use needles at all. Taper/wax and stick a drop of super glue on the end of your thread. When set, stitch away.

I hope I made sense and did not waffle too much. As said 16 hr day.

Barra

Edited February 14, 2008 by barra

[Hilly]

I would like to take the time to say thank you to all of you that replied. I have learned a bit, and that's what's so great about these forums, and the people that post here. I never expected all of the responses I have gotten, and that just shows what caring and thoughtful people you all are.

Have a great day,

Hilly

Happy Valentines Day, everyone!