Allergies in dogs and their going off food.

[Klara]

Yes, I am always surprised by videos from U.S. shows. In France the percentage of obese people is smaller in general, and even more noticeably in dog show rings. 

I dare say the attitude towards dog shows is different in FCI countries (of which I know France, Germany and Switzerland): Dog shows are not considered sport, but events for evaluating the dog. Which is why every owner gets a slip with the judge's opinion of the dog and a mark, from excellent to satisfactory (?). And in some cases even owners not interested in dog shows must do them: In Germany for a dog to be allowed to breed within the club, in France to get his official adult pedigree (which also is permission to breed). In FCI countries sighthounds need two "very good" to be allowed starts in international lure coursing events.

Rika has all the show results she needs,  now I am just doing a bit of tourism to places that interest me (hopefully there will be a show in Carcassonne next year). If we take home a ribbon, that's a nice plus

Btw, Rika also sleeps with me.

 

[Sheilajeanne]

16 minutes ago, Klara said:

Yes, I am always surprised by videos from U.S. shows. In France the percentage of obese people is smaller in general, and even more noticeably in dog show rings. 

What NOT to wear to a dog show:  

As for working titles, I was definitely planning to put at least and IGP1 on Eska, but age and health got in the way...   Anyway, she got her BH, the basic Schutzhund obedience title 5 days after being hit by a car, when she dashed out into the street, instead of waiting for me to open the car door...  

Ah well, she's a great companion, and watching her and the cat have their morning sparring match is very entertaining!

Chuck, what breed are the dogs in your photo?

 

Edited December 18, 2023 by Sheilajeanne

[Sheilajeanne]

4 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

neither one of you would have a dog of your choice if it wasn't for breeders.

Chuck, the problem with that is there's this thing called the 'breed standard' that the breeders are supposed to follow, and if they don't follow it, the breed can get messed up pretty fast: The dog must not be timid, shrinking behind its master or handler; it should not be nervous, looking about or upward with anxious expression or showing nervous reactions, such as tucking of tail, to strange sounds or sights. Lack of confidence under any surroundings is not typical of good character. Any of the above deficiencies in character which indicate shyness must be penalized as very serious faults and any dog exhibiting pronounced indications of these must be excused from the ring 

At one American German shepherd show a few years ago, breeders asked the people running the show to stop making announcements over the P.A. system, as it was causing their dogs to spook.   

Did you know the border collie people fought very hard AGAINST being recognized by the AKC, as their breed is above all else a WORKING breed? Other collie herding breeds (rough collie Shetland sheepdog) have been destroyed by the conformation show ring, and are no longer capable of working.   The rough collie now carries so much coat that if it tried to herd in an area with lots of scrub, it would get caught up in the bushes, and likely get stuck!  

Edited December 18, 2023 by Sheilajeanne

[chuck123wapati]

6 hours ago, Sheilajeanne said:

Chuck, the problem with that is there's this thing called the 'breed standard' that the breeders are supposed to follow, and if they don't follow it, the breed can get messed up pretty fast: The dog must not be timid, shrinking behind its master or handler; it should not be nervous, looking about or upward with anxious expression or showing nervous reactions, such as tucking of tail, to strange sounds or sights. Lack of confidence under any surroundings is not typical of good character. Any of the above deficiencies in character which indicate shyness must be penalized as very serious faults and any dog exhibiting pronounced indications of these must be excused from the ring 

At one American German shepherd show a few years ago, breeders asked the people running the show to stop making announcements over the P.A. system, as it was causing their dogs to spook.   

Did you know the border collie people fought very hard AGAINST being recognized by the AKC, as their breed is above all else a WORKING breed? Other collie herding breeds (rough collie Shetland sheepdog) have been destroyed by the conformation show ring, and are no longer capable of working.   The rough collie now carries so much coat that if it tried to herd in an area with lots of scrub, it would get caught up in the bushes, and likely get stuck!  

neither one of you would have a dog of your choice if it wasn't for breeders.  you seem to love to complain.

The pups are American bullies and a Beagle mix we rescued form the kennel

[Sheilajeanne]

Things need to change, Chuck. If no one complains, nothing will get done.

They are ruining the breed I love.

 

(I guessed those were American bullies. I've seen quite a few - people do schutzhund with them.)

[Handstitched]

Heres my mad mutt  .  A Border Collie X Kelpie . She won't win any shows,  she's as mad as a cut snake , but totally awesome   I brushed her out yesterday, that was over due, a lot of under growth and she's molting, its Summer here atm,   , OMG , she was like a kid that didn't want their hair cut , and she hates the lead . If she sees me with a lead , its a game for her,  its a case of " catch me if you can  HA HA HA !!! ...." , so I have to be a bit sneaky .  She has a face only her Mother would love , lol   

HS

 

[TomE]

52 minutes ago, Handstitched said:

Heres my mad mutt  .  A Border Collie X Kelpie . 

She is a lovely dog!  We had an alleged Border Collie, Bess, who we thought might have some Kelpie blood.  She developed autoimmune polyarthritis at 3 years old and by age 6 years succumbed to long term immunosuppression with steroids to control the arthritis.  She was a wonderful farm dog while the arthritis was under control.  Now I have a 10 YO Border Collie that is completely blind and a 2 YO Border Collie that we recently adopted.  They keep me entertained while doing chores.  The blind dog knows his way around the farm, more or less, but is becoming forgetful.  Guess you know what my favorite breed is.

 

Bess doing her circus act with a weanling foal.  

[Klara]

7 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

neither one of you would have a dog of your choice if it wasn't for breeders.  you seem to love to complain

So you deny that there's responsible breeders and more, let's say, profit-oriented ones? Nobody has anything against breeders that do a good job and breed functional dogs. But I didn't buy my puppy from a breeder who told me "racing around destroys the heart, I only let my dogs play in small fenced areas so they can't develop any speed". That kennel has produced many beauty champions.

And the true tragedy is not even with profit-oriented breeders (I am writing breeders, puppy-mills are another story), but with the rules of dog shows and show titles and with judges that don't judge according to the standard but want always more extreme features. Like 95 cm high Irish Wolfhounds, when the standard says "average (! not minimum!) 85 cm for males". If all IWs would have to show at least some ability to chase prey, the problem would solve itself.

Form follows function!

 

 

 

 

[Klara]

4 hours ago, Handstitched said:

She has a face only her Mother would love , lol   

What are you saying? She's beautiful (seriously,  especially the face) and I'd take her in a heart beat, IF I had any use for a working farm dog...

[Handstitched]

47 minutes ago, Klara said:

What are you saying? She's beautiful (seriously,  especially the face) and I'd take her in a heart beat, IF I had any use for a working farm dog...

Her name is 'Abby',  local farmer had a litter of 6 , totally unexpected , apparently.  They just gave them away.  We got her shortly after our last dog a Goldy, passed away some years ago . All she wants to do all day is play,given the chance,  a stick ,rubber bone,  a  ball whatever.  It took a long time  for me to get used to her as I thought it was too soon  to get another dog after losing our Goldy , but now I couldn't go without her.  I must admit she does have quite an appeal.She can give me the cutest  ' innocent' looks.  She has her moments as well. Our old washing machine moves about in fast spin, I'm standing there holding it in place, what does she do?? Jumps up and holds it with me ,  Holy crap!! funniest thing I ever saw, had me in stitches !!  LOL . Just wish I had my camera. 

4 hours ago, TomE said:

She is a lovely dog!

Thank you   No matter whats happens to our 4 legged friends, we do the very best for them , even in ill health. Dogs like these need space to run, no good in a city environment . She even rounds up our two cats, typical sheep dog. That was the first thing she did when she arrived when she  was a pup, round the cats up ,  the looks on the cats faces was priceless , lol .

HS

 

 

[chuck123wapati]

13 hours ago, Handstitched said:

Heres my mad mutt  .  A Border Collie X Kelpie . She won't win any shows,  she's as mad as a cut snake , but totally awesome   I brushed her out yesterday, that was over due, a lot of under growth and she's molting, its Summer here atm,   , OMG , she was like a kid that didn't want their hair cut , and she hates the lead . If she sees me with a lead , its a game for her,  its a case of " catch me if you can  HA HA HA !!! ...." , so I have to be a bit sneaky .  She has a face only her Mother would love , lol   

HS

 

what a cutie she is I'll bet she is a big bunch of happy energy.

[chuck123wapati]

9 hours ago, Klara said:

So you deny that there's responsible breeders and more, let's say, profit-oriented ones? Nobody has anything against breeders that do a good job and breed functional dogs. But I didn't buy my puppy from a breeder who told me "racing around destroys the heart, I only let my dogs play in small fenced areas so they can't develop any speed". That kennel has produced many beauty champions.

And the true tragedy is not even with profit-oriented breeders (I am writing breeders, puppy-mills are another story), but with the rules of dog shows and show titles and with judges that don't judge according to the standard but want always more extreme features. Like 95 cm high Irish Wolfhounds, when the standard says "average (! not minimum!) 85 cm for males". If all IWs would have to show at least some ability to chase prey, the problem would solve itself.

Form follows function!

 

 

 

 

I didn't say that I said this. "neither one of you would have a dog of your choice if it wasn't for breeders.  you seem to love to complain"

The difference between natural adaptation and breeding is what happens to the deformities, in the wild they die. If your breeder told you he killed the bad pups in a litter because they weren't perfect how would you react? That is how they did it back then!!! Its human nature to save babies no matter how dysfunctional they are and why deformities exist in the breeding world but not in the wild. Genetics in dogs is fascinating  but still humans cant master it.

This is my boy a year or so ago,   Curgans Gentle Ben II is his real name he has a seven generation  UKC pedigree. plus he has been dna tested  we get notices when he gets a new brother , sister or cousin. 125 lbs. of pure muscle, 22" neck. Stacks pretty nice for never being trained.

[Klara]

15 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

If your breeder told you he killed the bad pups in a litter because they weren't perfect how would you react?

If "not perfect" meant that the colour was wrong, I'd be unhappy. If a pug breeder tried to breed pugs with longer noses and killed the puppies with the shortest noses, I'd accept that. If a puppy had a misshapen leg or mouth, I'd applaud the breeder for euthanizing it (and I am NOT happy when breeders have a puppy with mouth deformities operated on and bottle feed it. As you said, in the wild it would die and that's how it should be. With the difference that in the wild it would slowly starve to death whereas a breeder hopefully puts the pup down quickly.) First and foremost a dog needs to be functional, healthy and able to enjoy live.

Incidentally, I don't agree with the people who keep alive their old dogs with dementia, incontinence and unable to stand up alone - I wouldn't want to exist like this and I won't do it to my dog.

[Handstitched]

16 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

what a cutie she is I'll bet she is a big bunch of happy energy.

Man, She certainly puts me to shame , lol  . I saw her Mum & Dad when we picked her up as a pup . The owners opened up a gate, and  OMG they ran across the paddock a gazzilion miles an hour, geez they were fast.  

Some farming locals that I knew had Kelpies that worked on a sheep farm , in shearing sheds etc.( quite a common theme here)  If the farmers & shearers got a roast dinner , so did the dogs . They work just as hard as the farmers if not harder. 

Your dog looks fit and healthy  Is that your Ford in the background? And you have green grass ??  I envy that

HS

[chuck123wapati]

On 12/20/2023 at 1:28 AM, Handstitched said:

 

Your dog looks fit and healthy  Is that your Ford in the background? And you have green grass ??  I envy that

HS

he is very healthy lol, he is what you would call a deterrent, he keeps my family safe and me from possibly having to use a firearm. I live in a penitentiary town as well as having worked there so i tend to be more careful of safety of my home. My green grass is dead for the year but it will be back lol and that is my neighbors Old Ford, those old high boys are sweet aren't they? I had one years ago.

[Sheilajeanne]

My uncle, a dairy farmer, had an ancient green Ford, with the long metal shift on the floor. The darn thing just wouldn't quit - I forget how many years he had it for! Okay, he was a licensed equipment mechanic before he decided to farm full time, so he knew how to keep it running! 

Here's what the puppy mills do when they have a defective pup:    Of course, she gave birth to several pups with the same defect, but hey, the normal ones (that still may carry the recessive gene for this) got sold to unsuspecting buyers! (The picture was taken by Humane Society staff who raided the mill, and put it out of business.)

 

[SUP]

When I see people breeding dogs and cats for specific things, it infuriates me. Let them continue to evolve the way they have through the years and stop getting exaggerated forms of anything -noses, backs, whatever. Unless it is for health, it is not right. Pure breeds bred with care and integrity are fine but all those naked cats and Persians with scrunched up noses like the Bulldogs and all that is explained so much in detail here are nightmares! I remember in 2003, having a long discussion with my Genetics professor about how such selections of specific features and characteristics  through genetic manipulation would be possible in humans by 2020. I had thought it would not happen until at least 2040 - good to be proven right about humans. - in dogs and cats, it's been happening all through, in a rough and haphazard way.. Can see it happening in humans as well - blue eyed babies, babies with big butts, babies with... you get the picture.  I suspect 'intelligence' will be the least in demand.

I, for one, always get my pets from shelters and they have always been darling; would not win prizes at shows but are our babies and perfect for us. Our current dog, Pepper,  wants to be  a cat - after seeing our now deceased cat filling soil post-poop, she does the same! Only she wisely does it some distance away, while mom or dad pick up after her!  Then sneezes all the way home. Ordered some face masks for her. Only found one seller. Let's see if she agrees to wear them.

 

Edited December 21, 2023 by SUP

[Sheilajeanne]

Dogs bred for specific things - this is amazing! (And Sup, I know you're okay with it, but some people think we should just let all the dogs become mutts.  Yeah, no more bird dogs, no more police dogs or herding dogs. )

I agree with you about those poor naked cats, and other cats that are bred for unique traits that can actuallly be harmful. Scottish fold cats, the ones with the folded ears, suffer from severe arthritis at an early age, because the defective gene that causes the folded ear also affects the cartilage in their joints. You cannot breed two Scotch Fold cats together - the kittens will die shortly after birth, as the double recessive gene is lethal: All Fold cats are affected by osteochondrodysplasia (OCD), a developmental abnormality that affects cartilage and bone development throughout the body. This condition causes the ear fold in the breed and studies point to all Fold cats being affected by it. Fold cats therefore have malformed bone structures and can develop severe painful degenerative joint diseases at an early age.^[2] Due to these health conditions, breeding Fold cats is prohibited in several countries and some major cat registries do not recognize the cat breed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Fold

Purebred Persian cats can't groom themselves properly and must be brushed daily to keep the coat from matting. They also have trouble eating due to the squished in faces. 

 

 

Edited December 22, 2023 by Sheilajeanne

[Handstitched]

18 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

he is very healthy lol, he is what you would call a deterrent, he keeps my family safe and me from possibly having to use a firearm. I live in a penitentiary town as well as having worked there so i tend to be more careful of safety of my home. My green grass is dead for the year but it will be back lol and that is my neighbors Old Ford, those old high boys are sweet aren't they? I had one years ago.

Not sure what my dog would do if a intruder got in, ask them to play with her toy  bone and scratch her belly  I guess , but she does let us know when someone is coming on the property , all hell breaks loose , as annoying as it can be at times , its a good thing. 

I've often said that there are two seasons here in Oz, ' alive & dead' , lol

Yeh, I like the Ol Ford   

HS

[chuck123wapati]

20 hours ago, SUP said:

When I see people breeding dogs and cats for specific things, it infuriates me. Let them continue to evolve the way they have through the years and stop getting exaggerated forms of anything -noses, backs, whatever. Unless it is for health, it is not right. Pure breeds bred with care and integrity are fine but all those naked cats and Persians with scrunched up noses like the Bulldogs and all that is explained so much in detail here are nightmares! I remember in 2003, having a long discussion with my Genetics professor about how such selections of specific features and characteristics  through genetic manipulation would be possible in humans by 2020. I had thought it would not happen until at least 2040 - good to be proven right about humans. - in dogs and cats, it's been happening all through, in a rough and haphazard way.. Can see it happening in humans as well - blue eyed babies, babies with big butts, babies with... you get the picture.  I suspect 'intelligence' will be the least in demand.

I, for one, always get my pets from shelters and they have always been darling; would not win prizes at shows but are our babies and perfect for us. Our current dog, Pepper,  wants to be  a cat - after seeing our now deceased cat filling soil post-poop, she does the same! Only she wisely does it some distance away, while mom or dad pick up after her!  Then sneezes all the way home. Ordered some face masks for her. Only found one seller. Let's see if she agrees to wear them.

 

don't worry now they have started on people they will let dogs alone for awhile.https://vigilantnews.com/post/covid-vaccines-integrate-into-human-dna-study-finds/?exp=1703259852743