Sylvia Report post Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) I've been spending quite a bit of time reading old, out of copyright, articles and books on leather and design. In one particular book, the author writes about design and proportion. Something caught my eye ... my right brained eye. I didn't equate the curves of Sheridan carving with this before until I saw the simplified drawings on page 48, figure 64. See the book here: http://books.google....der&pg=GBS.PA48 Mathematicians amongst us probably recognize the term "The Golden Ratio." Some of you may even recall the formulas and logarithms involved. I personally would rather forget those math classes. But they say that "education" is what remains after you forget what you learned in School. So here I am staring at page 48, I see it..... The spiral created by the Golden Ratio. Suddenly much of what Mr. Paul Burnett said in his tutorials about "continuing the curve" and not "straightening out the lines" made a LOT of sense! For those who are not cognoscente of the term the golden ratio... or it's significance in art. I invite you to explore the topic at this site. http://cuip.uchicago...lnarain/golden/ Peruse the information under activities, especially "The Golden Ratio in Art" Basically, in quick and dirty language... The Golden Ratio is a Greek term for perfection in proportion and symmetry. (phi, (φ) ) It's also a mathematical formula. It can be applied to the face of a beautiful woman, to the items in nature and to buildings. The result of the "math" is a spiral something similar to the spiral we see in a snail shell or nautilus. I'm sure this epiphany lit up both sides of my brain as I came to the realization of what this meant in designing and carving any design in leather. I began to think about how these 'spirals" are repeated through out Sheridan style carving. I don't have a particular reason for sharing this other than to spark a moncum of understanding in those who like myself struggle with designing anything in Sheridan. Edited March 3, 2012 by Sylvia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dirtclod Report post Posted March 3, 2012 I won't ever understand the math part your talking about ! But looking at the pictures in the book and seeing them, things make sense to me. Thanks for posting the link to the book. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 3, 2012 I won't ever understand the math part your talking about ! But looking at the pictures in the book and seeing them, things make sense to me. Thanks for posting the link to the book. LOL, I hear you about the math.... I am the type of person that has to learn any math process long hand. Then once I get it... I can use a calculator. This drove my professor nuts. I got a lot of "Use your calculator" written on my papers. :D Then I took an autocad class and the teacher had us figure out board feet for a project simulation. "No calculators." LOL I was one of 2 people who could actually do it long hand. The "calculator generation" had no idea where to start..... sad really. The thing I neglected to include is that "The Golden Ratio" is also known as the formula for beauty. I think that is why when see some leather carvings, even though they are skillfully tooled,.... something seems "off" about it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bluesman Report post Posted March 3, 2012 that is incredible. I'm a math head and never heard of that. It explains wide screen tv. Thanks for the post Sylvia. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) that is incredible. I'm a math head and never heard of that. It explains wide screen tv. Thanks for the post Sylvia. It is pretty advanced math and it's usually seen in geometry and physics, if the professor covers it at all. It involves "imaginary" numbers... at which point my brain goes ":wtf:." I guess I must have learned something in those classes after all. Edited March 4, 2012 by Sylvia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bluesman Report post Posted March 4, 2012 It is pretty advanced math and it's usually seen in geometry and physics, if the professor covers it at all. It involves "imaginary" numbers... at which point my brain goes ":wtf:." I guess I must have learned something in those classes after all. Sylvia, Differential and Integral Calculus is advanced math. Beyond that is abstract alegebra and quantum physics. This is basic stuff taught in Algebra I. Never seen it in Engineering School. I would bet it plays a larger role in Architecture and design. None the less, way cool theory, mind altering concept. i like it. Jon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) Sylvia, Differential and Integral Calculus is advanced math. Beyond that is abstract alegebra and quantum physics. This is basic stuff taught in Algebra I. Never seen it in Engineering School. I would bet it plays a larger role in Architecture and design. None the less, way cool theory, mind altering concept. i like it. Jon Integral Calculus?!! *plugs ears and sings" La la la la la!! Edited March 4, 2012 by Sylvia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bluesman Report post Posted March 4, 2012 calc was simple. Abstract algebra hurts your head. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ladykahu Report post Posted March 4, 2012 This lady does some amazing video's that explain the 'maths' in a way I could understand http://www.youtube.com/user/Vihart?ob=0&feature=results_main#p/u/9/ahXIMUkSXX0 I love her elephants one too!!! Natalie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 4, 2012 This lady does some amazing video's that explain the 'maths' in a way I could understand http://www.youtube.c...u/9/ahXIMUkSXX0 I love her elephants one too!!! Natalie Wooo hooo... that is awesome Natalie. Perfect example of how the golden ratio works in nature. Thanks for sharing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elliot Report post Posted March 4, 2012 The thing I neglected to include is that "The Golden Ratio" is also known as the formula for beauty. I think that is why when see some leather carvings, even though they are skillfully tooled,.... something seems "off" about it. This has cleared things for me. Some things just look better than others, and now I see the why of it. Thank you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 4, 2012 This has cleared things for me. Some things just look better than others, and now I see the why of it. Thank you. You are welcome. I am glad it helped. Be sure to watch the video provided by Natalie... (and parts 2 and 3), it really shows the spirals in nature. And it's not too math geeky. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toolingaround Report post Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Hi everyone My brain freezes if a number comes anywhere near it. This video is awesome even I get it. Check out her other videos too! Cheers, Toolingaround Oops just noticed I've been beaten to the punch ......red face ..... Couldn't open the other video on my iPod didn't realize it was the same. Edited March 5, 2012 by Toolingaround Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 5, 2012 Oops just noticed I've been beaten to the punch ......red face ..... Couldn't open the other video on my iPod didn't realize it was the same. LOL that's alright Toolingaround, at least we know you were interested enough to look it up. That says a lot about your willingness to try understand it. I like that you embedded the video, too. That will help those who aren't as web savvy. I've been tempted to get out some graph paper and make some spirals and try to turn them into western floral from them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toolingaround Report post Posted March 5, 2012 LOL that's alright Toolingaround, at least we know you were interested enough to look it up. That says a lot about your willingness to try understand it. I like that you embedded the video, too. That will help those who aren't as web savvy. I've been tempted to get out some graph paper and make some spirals and try to turn them into western floral from them. Hey we would love to see any graph paper experiments that work out :-) Have a good one eh Toolingaround Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gringobill Report post Posted March 6, 2012 I've been learning to engrave metals and its all about scrolls in that medium so I've seen the Golden Mean discussed a lot in those forums. So when I read about it and all the math came up in the discussion smoke started coming out of my ears and I had to back off. But I asked my daughter with a MA in fine arts about it and she had learned about it in school. It's kind of like the Supreme Court trying to define pornography " We can't define it but we know it when we see it!" It's like one of the other posters said, "now we know why somethings just look better than others!" The cool thing is seeing how it occurs in nature. Bill Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 7, 2012 I've been learning to engrave metals and its all about scrolls in that medium so I've seen the Golden Mean discussed a lot in those forums. So when I read about it and all the math came up in the discussion smoke started coming out of my ears and I had to back off. But I asked my daughter with a MA in fine arts about it and she had learned about it in school. It's kind of like the Supreme Court trying to define pornography " We can't define it but we know it when we see it!" It's like one of the other posters said, "now we know why somethings just look better than others!" The cool thing is seeing how it occurs in nature. Bill That's the truth!! LOL Something just seems off it the curve isn't "continued as Paul Burnett said. Now we know why. I've still not experimented with the Curve posted above. one thing I notice is that you can use just the curve closest to the center of the spiral and it's the same shape as the entire thing. That means that the curve could be sized up and down without having to do a lot of editing in a program. maybe I'll start with slug cats. :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HellfireJack Report post Posted March 7, 2012 You might want to look up another subject Burnett discussed in his free tutorials. Hogarth and his lines of beauty. http://books.google.com/books/about/The_analysis_of_beauty.html?id=vw1BAAAAcAAJ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted March 7, 2012 You might want to look up another subject Burnett discussed in his free tutorials. Hogarth and his lines of beauty. http://books.google....id=vw1BAAAAcAAJ oooo a book so old it has esses (S) that look like effs. (F) LOL thanks for the link Jack Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jacobite Report post Posted April 15, 2012 (edited) You can make your own "Gloden Mean" calipers, which I suppose you could scale down to make a set to allow you to lay out your Sheriden patterns if you were working freehand rather than from a template. Edited April 15, 2012 by Jacobite Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted April 16, 2012 You can make your own "Gloden Mean" calipers, which I suppose you could scale down to make a set to allow you to lay out your Sheriden patterns if you were working freehand rather than from a template. Golden Mean calipers would be pretty cool. Thanks for the picture. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitchwizzard Report post Posted April 25, 2012 Golden Mean calipers would be pretty cool. Thanks for the picture. Like this?? Stitch~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted April 25, 2012 Like this?? Stitch~ Wow! Those are awesome! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spinner Report post Posted April 25, 2012 Golden Mean calipers would be pretty cool. Thanks for the picture. Available via Etsy: http://www.etsy.com/listing/74772932/golden-mean-calipers-small-114cm A New Zealander makes 3 sizes of metal calipers, look pretty nice too. Not a bad starting price either. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sylvia Report post Posted April 25, 2012 Available via Etsy: http://www.etsy.com/...ers-small-114cm A New Zealander makes 3 sizes of metal calipers, look pretty nice too. Not a bad starting price either. Hmmm... $45 shipped. I just couldn't do that. I would rather try to buy American anyway. Thanks though! I appreciate your looking out for me! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
