Cobra Class 4

[Ken Nelson]

Wizcrafts I don't know what to say other than that is unfortunate.

If I may, without offending anyone, what would it cost to purchase a servo that will do what so many are wanting one to do? In other words, have the range of speed control that seems to be a problem?

If I remember correctly, when I started, the price of a closed needle machine capable of sewing 3/4" was give or take around $4500 + shipping, with a clutch motor, speed reducer and no attachments. If you had problems controlling your sewing machine in those days, you were basically told there was a learning curve and in time you would master it with a lot of practice.

At that time, gasoline was $1.00 a gallon. A side of Hermann Oak skirting was $110.00. This afternoon gasoline in our town is $3.49. Monday I got in some Hermann Oak skirting and it cost me $175.00 a side.

I wonder how many people have bought sewing machines the last 3 or 4 years because they are so much less expensive than they were 12-15 years ago. I think if you would figure in inflation on every thing I buy for my shop, a good 441 clone would cost at least $6000.00 in 2000 dollars. SO my point is this, if you want a better servo motor, you can spend quite a lot of money on one and still be ahead of the game if you compare 2000 prices with the prices of today and figure in inflation. It would seem to me, if there is enough demand for an improved servo motor for sewing machines, someone would build it. One benefit I really see on my Class 4 is the ability to set the top speed. I have not had a problem at all controlling the speed in the 3 years I have had it.

That said, I will agree that the Chinese do have a problem with quality control on some of the stuff they manufacture. I get told on a regular basis that these 441 clones are a pile of junk. In fact, recently I was told it was apparent that I use a hook and awl machine to sew the skirts on my saddles. They were sewn on a Cobra Class 4 machine. Maybe the "expert" talking was not as all knowing as he thinks he is. POINT- I think they are a good machine!

I really think there is an opportunity here for someone to do himself or herself a lot of good by improving on the servo motors being widely used today. Next question is how many people are ready to pay the extra for an American Made servo that is doing what so many need or want it to do.

Ken

[Steven Kelley]

If I may, without offending anyone, what would it cost to purchase a servo that will do what so many are wanting one to do? In other words, have the range of speed control that seems to be a problem?

$100. I bought one to replace the clutch motor on my Adler 205-370. It is Nick-O-Sew brand. I found it on Ebay. It has dial speed control, instead of digital. The speed control is fantastic. I liked it so much I bought a second one to put on my Cowboy 4500. Much better control at slow speed than the original motor that came with the 4500. I'm sure it's made in China and marketed under many different names, so there could be many copies of it out there. Steven and Bob might even offer the same motor, I don't know. If I were buying another machine today, I would request this type of motor instead of the digital servo.

Here is the motor on their website for $155...... http://nickosew.com/details.php?id=331

Here is their listing on ebay where it's $105 shipped........ http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Nick-O-Sew-NKS-5500-110V-Servo-Motor-BEST-QUALITY-/110911183534?pt=BI_Sewing_Machines&hash=item19d2d25aae

Edited July 23, 2012 by Steven Kelley

[Handstitched]

G'Day From Western Australia,

It does sound like something is a miss on the linkage on the motor perhaps (?) Sounds like something needs adjusting?

This is my 441 clone:

http://www.qstitch.com.au/Page/leather-saddlery-sewing-machines

( I didn't pay that price ... mine was cheaper

It has a 3/4 HP motor, and I have really put it through its paces. It can really sew that thickness.)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/40990121@N05/7010739149/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/40990121@N05/6864625162/in/photostream/

If you can see by the pic, its a direct metal rod type linkage to operate the motor, not a chain, but there is a chain for the foot. I have adjusted that so I don't have to press too far to drop the foot.

Although I don't have a servo or speed controller like the Cobra , I've learnt how to speed up and slow down the machine.( after much practice). The harder I press down on the pedal, the faster it goes , and vice versa.

I've done so much sewing on it now, I'd be lost without it, and I have my machine adjusted just right and set up for me and me only ...and no-one else. If anyone else used my machine, it may seem totally foreign to them compared to their own machine.

Perhaps when you get your new machine, you can adjust it and have it set up to the way you want it.

Hope there is at least some help on here for you, and I wish all the best in the future,

HS

[particle]

It does sound like something is a miss on the linkage on the motor perhaps (?) Sounds like something needs adjusting?

Unfortunately, in regard to the motor this thread is referring to, there is simply nothing to adjust. Yes, you can move the chain along the actuating lever, but it has NO notable effect when we're talking about such an absurdly small range of travel. The foot pedal hangs under its own weight. Having the chain tighter or looser simply means the foot pedal starts off higher or lower in relation to the base of the table - it has no effect on the 'adjustment' of the motor. Perhaps if you left the foot pedal resting closer to the table, you could prevent the pedal from pulling downward too hard on the actuating lever since the pedal would hit the base of the stand before the actuating lever hit the end of its range of motion. I've thought about doing this in case my kids start stomping on the foot pedal when I'm not in my garage (where I keep my machine).

Sadly, these particular motors just have a really crappy switch built into the motor and there is nothing you can do about it (without risking ruining the switch itself by monkeying with the light-blocking blade inside the switch). The only real option is to replace the motor (or just live with it, always knowing there is something better out there that works properly), which is a shame to have to do on a brand new machine. I'm still trying to decide if I want to go through that trouble or not. For now, I just keep the motor speed set at 7 or 8 and hand-crank when I get close to corners or tight curves, and maybe turn it up to 12-15 for belts and then hand-crank when I get to the tip. For reference, max motor speed is 40. In a perfect world, I could leave the motor at 12-15 for any object I'm sewing and control the speed properly with my foot.

As a customer, I would have gladly paid a little more for a motor that works like everyone expects it to. I wouldn't be happy with a $50 dimmer switch for my dining room light that only utilized a tiny fraction of the lever's range of motion, and I'm certainly not happy when we're dealing with a machine that costs thousands of dollars.

For the record - I love the machine. I've done two batches of holster orders (around 30 items total) with it and am VERY pleased with the machine itself. But they really need to start shipping with a better motor, or at least give customers an option to upgrade before it leaves the store.

[SafeAirOne]

Re: Servo motor speed control--Wizcrafts was on the right track; DDahl solved the problem in a very simple manner in another thread here on Leatherworker a few months back, but amazingly, the solution was generally ignored.

Fortunately, Larry from Southwest Florida Holsters didn't ignore the solution and posted a 'how-to' on his website and also spread the word to a few other forums, including this thread on hotrodders.com, where I came across it. I modified the solution a bit (detailed at the end of the hotrodders thread), but the principle is the same.

My motor now goes from a speed of "1" up to "15", the max I have set, EVENLY OVER THE ENTIRE RANGE OF TRAVEL of the speed control arm, not just in the first 1/4 inch like it used to!

All the links above contain the answer to your optical speed controller sensitivity problems on the various servo motors.

--Mark

Edited August 7, 2012 by SafeAirOne

[Mastersaddle]

I have a CB4500 that has the digital servo, and it works. It is a little touchy at low speed and sometimes hard to control when you want to go one stitch at a time. When I bought my 205-370, it had a clutch motor, which I immediately decided to replace. Knowing I didn't really like the digital motor that much for the speed sensitivity and I hate having to push all the buttons in a certain order just to change the speed, I decided to try one of these..... http://www.ebay.com/...item19d16009d6. It seemed to be a simple servo with dial speed control, and for $100 bucks I thought I'd give it a shot. All I can say is the speed control at super slow speed is FANTASTIC. I could not be more happy with the motor, and for $100, it's a steal. I'm sure some Chinese manufacturer sells these under dozens of different names, and I wish this type motor was an option on the 441 clones, instead of the digital servo. Maybe Bob and Steve even sell this same motor.

i am starting a saddle making business, my friend (an old saddle maker) purchased Cowboy cylinder bed stitching machine from a Germany dealer, and strongly recommend to me. But German is so far, I can get used Durkopp Adler 205 machine here..............but which is better, Durkopp 205 and Cowboy 7441AE (http://www.cowboysew.com/product1.htm)? Appreciate for your hep.

[Steven Kelley]

i am starting a saddle making business, my friend (an old saddle maker) purchased Cowboy cylinder bed stitching machine from a Germany dealer, and strongly recommend to me. But German is so far, I can get used Durkopp Adler 205 machine here..............but which is better, Durkopp 205 and Cowboy 7441AE (http://www.cowboysew.com/product1.htm)? Appreciate for your hep.

I would call Bob at Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines (http://tolindsewmach.com). He is the Cowboy dealer in the US. He can answer all your questions. From my very limited experience with Cowboy and Adler, I would say that comparing the features, quality, performance, etc. and considering the Cowboy is going to be about half the price of a new Adler, and have a lifetime warranty, go with the Cowboy. My Cowboy 4500 and Adler 205-370 sit back to back in my shop. I sew on the Cowboy 90% of the time, just because I like it more. The Adler is a fine machine, just not worth twice the money in my opinion.

My advice -> Call Bob. His number is 866-362-7397.

[particle]

I just thought I'd follow-up with this thread in case someone stumbled across it and never found the updated thread containing a servo fix. I was one of the early people complaining about the servo motor sensitivity. I loved the sewing machine itself, but was unhappy with the lack of control I was getting out of the servo motor in stock form. No worries though - Steve and his team have come up with a fix that makes the servo motor function like it should. If you have any concerns, please don't hesitate to call Steve.

Here is the thread that discusses the servo motor fix:

http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=41916&view=findpost&p=260742

[Cobra Steve]

I would like to thank everybody for your support regarding the servo motor issue. We will always do our very best to make sure that our reputation will never be compromised. Thanks, Steve

[Greystone]

May I ask ???? a moderator to

close and or link this to the servo fixed thread

GREAT INFO AND THOUGHTS