Singer 111G156 - Timing Belt Replacement

[Constabulary]

Hi Folks,

I´m not new here, I registered about 1 year ago already but this is my 1st post. I´m not sure If I have to introduce my self somewhere, If so I will do later.

I´m currently working with an ADLER 104 with roller foot and I just bought a Singer 111G156 (walking foot).

The mechanics of the machine is quite clean but the timing belt is torn so I have to replace it. Otherwise is seems to be in okay condition. Well, its probably not as I have no experience with a walking foot machine. So I have to figure out what is going on with this machine.

So the 1st question is - how can I replace the timing belt?

From my understanding the easiest way would be to remove the hand wheel and then remove the axle bearing and then squeeze the belt through the hole. I´m probably wrong with that so I would appreciate to get some advise from some experienced mechanics.

I will post some pictures of the machine later today.

[Geneva]

The attached file will be of help with your problem.

111W156.pdf

[Constabulary]

Awesome - thanks a lot Geneva! Seems my assumption was right!

BTW - does someone know what the difference between the subclasses 155 and 156?

And why is mine a 111G and not a 111W? Probably because it was made in Germany? I somewhere red that some Singers where made in Germany.

Edited August 4, 2013 by Constabulary

[Wizcrafts]

The Singer 111(letter)156 is the only sub-class that has a reverse lever.

[Constabulary]

I see! Yet, I have not noticed that the other subclasse have no reverse Lever.

Is it possible to tell the age by the serialnumber of the machine?

Edited August 5, 2013 by Constabulary

[Wizcrafts]

I see! Yet, I have not noticed that the other subclasse have no reverse Lever.

Is it possible to tell the age by the serialnumber of the machine?

Here is where you can look up the date of manufacture for Singer sewing machines

[Constabulary]

Mine is not listed there - probaly a Made in Germany machine?

[gottaknow]

The Singer W series serial numbers were first used in 1911. They are scattered with other series, (depending on model) right up through around 1959. I would put the date of your machine based on the high number in the early to mid 50's.

Regards, Eric

[Constabulary]

Thats what I thought too. Thanks anyway. I hope I get this machine back to life very soon. I hope the manual will answer my "timing questions" when I have installed the belt again. But belt has not arrievd yet.

BTW - what an AWESOME forum!

[Constabulary]

Belt finally has arrived and meanwhile I decided to repaint the machine and apply a new decal. Looks quite nice, I think.

I had to remove some parts to get all the old dirt, grease and dust out of some spots. I think I messed up the timing of the hook. I hope I can fix it with info from the manual.

Edited August 25, 2013 by Constabulary

[Constabulary]

Now its time for timing. But how to start?

As I said I had to replace the timing belt. I just put it on an tried make settings by reading the Manual but my technical English is not very good and the pictures in the manuals are too dark do not help me very much.

So I first tried to set the stitch length, that was the 1st thing that did not work. Maybe I misunderstood something. I pushed the left pin on the bed and turned to handwheel towards me. No movement at all, the only thing that happened was that the safety clutch poped out.

Okay, I knew there is a video on youtube of how to put it back in. I figured that my clutch has no slotted screw but instead it has a flat bolt. So I tried it on my own. This ended up in removing the clutch from the shaft. And I figured I can just pop the clutch back while putting a lever (screw driver) between the 2 pins and push it back in - worked well. I hope I did not damage anything doing it this way. However the V shaped metal tongue is back in the V shaped notch and there is no play, it fits tight in there!

So thats the point where I'am - the belt is still off and the clutch is set again.

At this point I think it would be the easiest way to time the machine. So I think when I but the needle bar and the feed dog in a certain positions and then but the belt back on it probably should work.

Good Idea or bad Idea? Anyway, I have no clue of what to start with so I really could use some help.

Edited August 27, 2013 by Constabulary

[CowboyBob]

When you put the new belt on the pulleys you need to make sure the take up lever is all the way to the top & then just to the left of the clutch there's a collar with an arrow that lines up with another arrow on a piece of tin,so you line up these 2 arrows & takeup @ the top & slide belt on & it should sew,except in your case you'll have to retime since you moved some things.

[Constabulary]

It now feeds well but yet does not catch the lower thread. Seems I have to move the hook towards the needle a little bit. Hook seems to be at the right position but not close enough to the needle.

[Constabulary]

IT'S ALIVE - IT'S ALIVE!!! HA HA!!!

Seems it was the little hint with the two arrows. I just timed the hook a little bit again and - it sews!

Yet, it only sews by turning the wheel by hand but it makes nice stitches and feeds well. Now it's time to oil it thoroughly.

But for some reason something moves up & down the reverse lever a little bit but that is probably because it needs oil at some spots.

Not sure if I´m done but I will report after oiling it.

For now THANK YOU SO MUCH Geneva, Wizcrafts, Gottaknow & CowboyBob but I may have some other questions later.

[Constabulary]

reverse lever movement solved - it just needed oil. Everything runs so smoooooooooth now. Can´t wait to sew with it....

[Constabulary]

One more thing...

When set to the longest stitch of 5 SPI (should be about 5mm stitch length) the machine produces 6 stitches per inch (about 4mm stitch length).

Is there a way to adjust the stitch length to that it makes 5mm stitches (5 SPI) at the chosen position?

See picture (2,54 cm = 1 Inch)

Edited August 28, 2013 by Constabulary

[Constabulary]

Finally found it, it is mentioned in the manual at "To Adjust The Reversing Mechanism". Why there?

However, though I adjusted it I do not get full 5 SPI out of it when forward + reverse have the same stitch length.

I can even adjust it to a longer forward stitch but then the reverse stitches are shorter.

Is there something like "secret screw" that only knows the advanced Singer Mechanic?

Edited August 31, 2013 by Constabulary

[cdthayer]

Mine is not listed there - probaly a Made in Germany machine?

I'm working on getting an old Singer 111G156 limbered back up to sew too. I put a new timing belt on it after I got the rusted safety clutch freed up enough to operate. I've been fiddling with it to get oil soaked into dry joints, and adjusting things as I go. I'm getting 6 SPI and a lift of 3/8" so far, but I'm hoping to improve that.

I'm surprised that your machine has a "W" serial number. I thought that the "G" series were made in Karlsruhe, Germany, and that that factory had used "PA" through "PY" numbers. My serial number is PB157568, so since Singer took over the Haid-und-Neu factory in 1958, I'm guessing mine was built some time in 1959. From what I understand, they were already using "PC" numbers in 1960.

I'd heard that the "W" numbers came out of the old Wheeler & Wilson Bridgeport factory. I wonder if you have a Connecticut machine with a German tag on it?

CD in Oklahoma

[Constabulary]

I don´t know!

Maybe the housing of the early West German Singers were delivered from the US and later on they produced the housings in Germany.

I only noticed one part on the entire machine that is marked with SINGER GERMANY and that is the small curved metal part that holds the bobbin case in the hook. Everything else has no evidences of "Made in Germany". Most parts are marked with SIMANCO.

I oiled the machine over and over again until only clean oil drips out of it.

BTW - has some one an extra drip pan for the 111W / 111G? Mine had no pan.

[cdthayer]

I read through Eric's thread Rebirth Of A Singer 211G155 and caught the tip about feeling for the take-up lever to be all of the way up. Then I rechecked my timing marks on the bottom shaft. I was one tooth off, so now I'm starting over. Thanks a bunch Eric! There's also a lot of other good information in that thread that will help me immensely.

My machine has been tweaked a lot of times. Here's what I've found so far:

The timing belt was missing completely.

The safety clutch was mounted onto the lower shaft with neither set screw in the notch.

Does it matter which set screw is in the groove?

The needle bar is set too high. Only the bottom mark shows when down full stroke.

The existing needle in the machine had the top cut off to match the length of a 135x17.

The eye-to-top of the needle matched the 135x17, but the tip was longer.

The tension release pin is not cut or worn, but will not reach the tension release lever. It is barely even with the housing when the lever is completely up.

The hand presser bar lift has a 3/8" gap to travel before contacting the lift bracket.

The pinch screw on the bracket is wallowed out badly and needs replaced if I can find one.

The knee-lift linkage is missing beyond the push-up rod and rocker arm.

Both inside and outside presser feet have been broken and braised back together.

As you can see, I have my hands full with this one.

CD in Oklahoma

[Constabulary]

The tension release pin is not cut or worn, but will not reach the tension release lever. It is barely even with the housing when the lever is completely up.

I`m not exactly sure but I think I had a similar problem.

Maybe this helps.

In the tension post of the tension assembly is a small pin that pushes the lever of the tension assembly against the pin that comes out of the housing.

And there is also a disc with a small bar in the middle that fits into the gap of the tension post which sits in front of the tension disc plates.

I gave bar in the middle of the disc a small punch so that is pushes the small pin in the assembly a bit more towards the lever and that solved my problem.

Not sure if I described it good enough. But then you take off the screw and the spring of the assembly you will see the small disc with the bar in the middle....

maybe the pictures help

[cdthayer]

I'm talking about the pin that goes through the machine head, from the lifter bracket on the back, to the front of the machine. It then activates the arm on the thread regulator to release tension. The pin in the thread regulator is fine, if I could get some action out of the other pin.

I lowered the lifting bracket and reset the lifting bell crank, and have my one half inch lift now, but it didn't help with the tension release problem. I'm not sure that I have everything set as it should be (these adjustments are not in the User/Adjuster manual, so I'm just winging it), and I have a stiff spot in the revolution of the machine. I'm not sure if it's an adjustment, or if I still have a dry joint in the machine somewhere. I doubt that this machine has operated for several years. I oiled everything to dripping again and will let it set for a while again to see if it's a dry joint that loosens up.

Thanks for your help on this.

CD in Oklahoma

Edited October 4, 2013 by cdthayer

[gottaknow]

Seems to me in that thread CD I mentioned the adjustment of the tension release and a picture, perhaps not. I'll be interested to see your progress. And yes, it does matter which screws sit where when you time your top and bottom shafts. That info I believe is in another rather lengthy thread about a 111. Enjoy!

Regards, Eric

[Constabulary]

I see... Then it is probably the Tension "Dics Release Lever Slide" (what a word) that is worn.

It pushes the pin against the Tension Disc assembly when you lift the lever.

BTW - I have a parts list for the 111G156 but it has no pictures and I have a parts list for the 111W155 with pictures. If you are interested I can post them here or send them by Email.

Edited October 5, 2013 by Constabulary

[Constabulary]

lets see if I can attach some PDF files

111w155 Parts List.pdf

Singer 111G156 Parts List.pdf

Edited October 5, 2013 by Constabulary