Cowboy Cb-4500 A Dud?

[Ferg]

I certainly agree with you on sewing "Wet/Damp Leather". With my couple years of sewing with two different machines I have no idea why you would want to unless the leather being sewn was/is very hard. The feet make marks on dry leather I can remember what it looks like when damp.

If the OP's video was placed on You Tube, shame on you. Bob and Bobby do everything asked of them and then some, they know what they are doing. An individual not having sufficient expertise to run a new machine should not be trying to put someone out of business with the reputation of these folks.

Hope everything is working for you.

ferg

[Tree Reaper]

I've had my 4500 for a couple of years and I'm still learning how to use it.

These machines aren't plug and play and pilot error is at the top of the list when something happens.

It takes time and mistakes to become proficient and you better have patience if you buy any machine.

Bob's service is second to none and there's always lots of additional help on this forum.

I'm very happy with my CB4500 and the service I have received from Toledo Industrial.

I would recommend the machine and the dealer to anyone interested in buying a machine.

[Red Cent]

The holster/welt problem is not solved with the accessories. Wet the holster at the front and use clamps etc to flatten the holster when you sew. If you don't the holster will naturally try to turn/twist down from the foot pressure kicking/flexing the needle out or in and jamming it into the machine.

I believe most all of us have been through correcting operator error caused by our ignorance or common sense. Some of the most obvious suggestions that are brushed aside turn into being the problem when analyzed.

"277 Thread with a Size 200 Needle

Is the most commonly used thread size in leather crafting from saddle and tack, boot and shoe,

gun and knife, and all other kinds of craft and industrial applications."

http://www.tippmannindustrial.com/images/pdf/Needle-and-Thread-Guide.pdf

I sew cowboy competition holsters and concealed carry holsters and I use 277 polyester top and 207 polyester bottom. If you want to hear how my Cobra 4 is set up now PM me.

[SethJ]

Ok let me clarify before the nazis all come out. I'm NOT bad mouthing the " Bobs". Its just frustrating like I said.

My youtube video is hardly mainstream and was for the purpose of showing the Bobs...and you guys...not to tell the world.

anyhow....after A LOT of experimentation this week I have a lot of the issues worked out I think.

THREAD seems to be a big issue!White 277...no probl;em,...like a dream. BLACK 346,...no problem,..just run a tad slower. The white 346,..forget it lol. I may try another brand.

I was able to sew a holster welt,..most of the problem was ME holding the piece at an angle in the foot,.,,,causing some deflection of the needle,..missing bobbin pickup etc....

Dryer leather does seem to sew better,..less feet print and other "white thread / dye issues)

Many of the issuses were a cummulation of a buncha little things,....I think a bunch of you guys suggestions helped a LOT so THANK YOU!

And THANK YOU Bob,..and Bob....I know Bob Jr has been down with the flu,..so I been trying not to bug him,..lol

Let me say this,...the 4500 runs AMAZING when you do your part. Its just a LOT of stuff to watch out for,..and i find I have to adjust tension when going from thicknesses. And a few other adjustments. I forgot what you call it,..but where the needle goes thru the lil hole in the like foot part,...mine was maligned,...and one of my presser feet was bent from a previous wreck and deflection,....so I straightened those out,..and shredding has stopped. Also whoever said to run the thread thru the tension guid twice,..like in and back out,..that helped tremendously!!!!

So all in all its running pretty good,..lots of little things coming together to create a calamity of problems.....most ATTRIBUTED TO USER ERROR! DOH*

Oh,.by the way I'm in Louisiana. Heres a holster I was able to get done the other day with the machine.

theres some other stuff on my page I recently did with the machine too,..cellphone cases etc... feel free to look www.facebook.com/sjfineleathers

and iif you want to friend me personally,....spook spook the sniper thats my facebook.

I havent been on much because I had a client wanted a saddle this week and i've been bowed up working on that.

DIDNT I READ SOMEWHERE about sewing shearling with the 4500? A Different needle of something? Something about the shearling getting snagged????

Edited January 20, 2014 by SethJ

[SethJ]

did this on the 4500 too.....

Ok back on topic,...yea I thought I'd heard somewhere that maybe I have to use round point needles when sewing shearling to skirting??

[SethJ]

Seth,

This is not a note on how to fix the issue, but rather a 3rd party, no dog in this fight, observation. I can understand your frustration and initial knee-jerk reaction that the machine is bad. That may be the case, when this is figured out in the long term, but have to state that it appears that Bob, Bob Jr. and Ryan are all trying to help you in correcting this issue, regardless of the cause. Their reputation and history of excellent customer service and care are very evident in their communication, even though there has been, dare I say less than, fair videos put on youtube declaring that the issue is the machine. This is not a condemnation of what has transpired, but viewing this with some clarity from an outside observer.

I have a considerable amount of Cowboy product in my shop and, yes, have encountered some occurrences that have also frustrated me, but have always had the support and guidance in getting those issues resolved.

I sincerely hope that you find resolution to the issue and am relatively positive the responses you are getting from the 3 people mentioned above, will provide that.

Good luck and hope to hear how everything turns out.

Shooter

Oh I completely agree....but at the time I started this post,...I was almost suicidal,..lol,...thank goodness i've worked some of the issues out with the help of Bob Sr and Jr,...and a hell of a lot of trial and error. And YES I think a big part of finding a solution was help from the members in here,...many very helpful posts!!!

[SethJ]

I certainly agree with you on sewing "Wet/Damp Leather". With my couple years of sewing with two different machines I have no idea why you would want to unless the leather being sewn was/is very hard. The feet make marks on dry leather I can remember what it looks like when damp.

If the OP's video was placed on You Tube, shame on you. Bob and Bobby do everything asked of them and then some, they know what they are doing. An individual not having sufficient expertise to run a new machine should not be trying to put someone out of business with the reputation of these folks.

Hope everything is working for you.

ferg

SHAME ON ME? Listen buddy....I posted a video so I'd have a way to visually communicate with Bob Jr,...nothing as vindictive as trying to hurt his business,..but I hardly feel the need to explain myself to you. thanks. Edited January 20, 2014 by SethJ

[Wizcrafts]

As for sewing wet leather, the Cowboy 3200, 3500, 4500 and 5500 all have stainless steel presser feet, feed dogs and throat plates, which will not darken moist veg-tan leather. I occasionally sew still-moist holsters to get as close to the shaped areas as possible with the stitches. Then I finish the shaping and let it dry with a blue gun inside, or the actual gun, wrapped in Saran Wrap. I usually back off the top pressure spring to relieve the force on the presser feet. I also sand the sharp bottom edges of the harness feet, then polish them on a buffer. All of this reduces the foot drag lines, but never completely eliminates them. A wide modeling spoon also helps smooth out presser foot tracks.

[Ferg]

SethJ,

Don't get all fired up at me. You are the one putting the video on You Tube. Sorry I don't buy the explanation, you could have sent the vid to Bob. I am sure you were frustrated. Everyone of us that bought a machine with little knowledge of what to do with them has had some of the same experiences. There are folks on this board who have been stitching/sewing leather as long as I have been messing with it. I laced most things before buying the machines. Folks with good hands and fingers do some fabulous work with hand stitching, I simply cannot do it anymore.

Hang in there, it gets more fun in the future.

Wiz,

I wasn't talking about the marks from types of metal. I was referring to the indented marks left by the feet etc.

ferg

[Techsew Ron]

FYI you can post a video to youtube and set the share settings to "unlisted", meaning only the person you send the video link to will see the video and it will not show up in search results or general youtube listings.

best regards,

Ron