Advice-Customers Driving Me Out Of Business

[aaron61032]

I have yet to find the line between customer service and going out of business. I am getting sick of offering refunds because my customers are not intelligent enough to take proper measurements. So I am left with a few options: close the business, no refunds policy, or no custom orders. Could I get some advice from some experienced entrepreneurs?

[TXAG]

That's what I do (no refunds). It's their responsibility to take proper measurements exactly as I instruct them to do...if they don't, they get to pay for another of the same item. Sure makes them take measuring more seriously and use MY instructions instead of whatever they were wanting to do...and yes, I make this absolutely clear upfront, before I even begin working on their item(s).

Edited February 5, 2014 by TXAG

[BDAZ]

While my leather business is just getting off the ground, I have had at least half a dozen successful start ups and 1 successful public offering. I think one of the problems with selling your own leather products is that we tend to be too close to the product and there may be a tendency to be too "nice".

I think you need to have a very clear return policy and make sure all your customers read it and either sign or click on an agreement button. Bottom line is "We screw up, we eat it, you screw up, you eat it". Knowing that going into the transaction will save a lot of grief after. If it is a very good customer and they make an honest mistake you could offer them a discount on a replacement. Eating customer mistakes is the short road to bankruptcy.

Cya!

Bob

[JLSleather]

Yeah, they gotta answer for their own information. I've had people misspell their friend's name (supposed to go on that belt). People give you the wrong barrel length for their "custom" holster (yeah, the barrel goes INTO the frame). And everybody gives the wrong measurement on the belt - some of them intentionally. Yes, even after you told them how to measure. And you asked if they're sure.

With collars, perhaps you cut a strip the same weight as you're using for the collar. Mark it every inch. Have them put it on the animal getting the collar, and tell you the number.

Then, you'll STILL need to be prepared for the person who KNOWS it's their fault, but will try to get you to "fix" it anyway. Add $1 to the cost of the collar to cover the strip and the note that says you really mean they need to give you the correct size.

[NVLeatherWorx]

As mentioned by the rest of the group: very clear policy on returns and the process, very specific direction where measurements are required, and a "no haggle" policy to support it. I won't haggle over the price of your inability to follow directions that I have provided you with. I also make it very clear that any images that represent colors are subject to being different in person as every computer monitor presents them differently, and I also am very straight forward on anything that has a Monogram, initials or a name. If it has been personalized with any of that or even a special note, it is able to be returned. If it isn't what you wanted but it is what you told me to do and you verified it, too bad. You want it done again, you are paying for it again. By the way, you need to also make sure that it is understood that part of your policy is that if they feel there is an issue or damage to their items and they need to return them for repair or replacement that they do it at THEIR expense (non-refundable). My policies include the statement that I will inspect every item believed to be damaged or faulty and compare it to the photos that I took of it prior to packaging. If the damage is the result of mishandling by the carrier then they need to open their claim that way and I will do what I need to do once that is settled. If I find the item to be correct as requested and no evidence of damage or other issues, I let them know and send it back to them. Final decision is the law of the land and it ends there. If they are still unhappy with it then they need to go back and review what they asked for and I always keep a complete record of every conversation and message just for this purpose. Makes my filing a pain but once someone figures it out that I am not going to play these little games of trying get two for one they get over it real quick.

There is no room for nice when it comes to this stuff. Just make it clear up front exactly what is and is not acceptable regarding your business operation and require an acceptance to your rules as part of the process. And always keep a copy of everything related to a client for tracking and discussion materials.

Hope this helps.

[Dwight]

I only do dog collars when the customer supplies me with an old one that the dog wore and was the proper size.

I measure the "most obviously used" hole in the old collar, . . . make the new one with 5 holes, . . . that measurement I did is for the center hole, . . . and I give them two holes on each side 1 inch apart.

I'm not a dog person, . . . so I can't tell anyone how to measure a dog for a collar. But I also haven't had one come back yet.

May God bless,

Dwight

Edited February 6, 2014 by Dwight

[Studio-N]

I only do dog collars when the customer supplies me with an old one that the dog wore and was the proper size.

I measure the "most obviously used" hole in the old collar, . . . make the new one with 5 holes, . . . that measurement I did is for the center hole, . . . and I give them two holes on each side 1 inch apart.

I'm not a dog person, . . . so I can't tell anyone how to measure a dog for a collar. But I also haven't had one come back yet.

May God bless,

Dwight

This works for people belts too.

[Chief31794]

I have a "measuring belt" for local orders, but I prefer to use an old belt as was said. For internet orders, I send detailed instructions on how to measure to include the picture below, I won't accept an order for the customer who says, oh I'm a 34 I don't need to measure, if they won't measure to my specifications, I don't take the order, I also have a strict return policy that states I will only issue a Return Authorization after they've shipped it back and it doesn't measure to what I was provided. I specifically state that I will not accept returns for items that "do not fit" only if they don't meet the customer's order measurements.

Dealing with the public you'll still have people who cannot be satisfied, that means no repeat orders, but the good thing is I don't want a return order from them.

Chief

[lightingale]

I've had to section off a special part of my whiteboard for remakes titled "for people who don't know how to measure".

As long as the dog collar or belt isn't personalized with a name or number, I usually take it back to list as "ready-made", and remake it for the customer (though I require them to pay for return and re-shipping with tracking, as it was their mistake).

It's extra work, but I don't want them to be disappointed, as I'm doing this more as a hobby than a business, and I believe that I've developed a pretty good reputation in the field.

Sometimes, even if it's the customer's mistake, they can still leave a negative review (which Etsy still has no way to dispute) or try to make you miserable with name-calling and harassment (even when you're trying to help them!).

The number of incidents where customers have provided wrong measurements has gone way down since I began including the attached diagram on every listing, but it's still not completely idiot-proof. Never underestimate the ingenuity of idiots! Some people make honest mistakes, and I can appreciate that it does happen once in a while (inches to centimeters for Americans vs. the rest of the world), but some of them just make you facepalm!

You're welcome to use the attached image if it can help. I created it myself in Photoshop, so I hereby make it available under a creative commons license!

Good luck!

[NVLeatherWorx]

@lightingale I like your addition to your whiteboard. I make similar notes on the paper trail that I keep on every order, especially those that require a measurement, just for the purpose of being able to "refresh their memory" when they call and say that something doesn't fit or that the design was not what they thought it would be. I provide every customer with specific detailed instructions on how to measure properly (as well as provide pictures for those who can't comprehend the written word) and I also provide graphics on all design elements. I require them to specifically note which design that they want by either enclosing it in a big circle and faxing it back to me or by providing the assigned pattern number (I give them all a unique number) in their email response. Every little detail is covered on these orders so when they come back having that "self created" issue, I have their exact wishes in my hands for their re-review. I am not concerned whether or not I get any future business from these people as I don't really have the time to waste going over their orders multiple times because they didn't pay attention to instructions or had a change of mind that they didn't communicate. I even send them updates and photos of how things are coming along which gives them ample opportunity to say, "hey, wait a minute, blah, blah, blah..." so we can move on the proper direction.

Regarding return of an item: if it has been personalized in ANY fashion that makes it a non-standard item, they own it as is and that is it. If it is something that I can list a ready-made item and it is in new condition (and I mean never even used once) then I will take it back and give them a refund. I will also probably not take any further requests from them because they have now shown their hand that they don't know what they want anyway and I need to focus on those clients who do and do it the right way.

For locals, I do everything personally when it comes to measurements so that if there is a mistake, it is mine and mine alone.

I do love that whiteboard idea though.

[Spence]

I do mostly dog collars and what works for me is being anal in describing how I want the dog measured. We go over it a couple of times. Luckily, I have dogs and most of my customers are large dog owners so I can spot an error pretty easily. Then when I'm satisfied that what I have is good enough (with five holes), I make out a very detailed invoice with all of the measurements and options the customer wanted. It works for me, 'cause I haven't had anyone want to return one. I'm sure there was one here and there that the collar didn't fit because they gave me the wrong info, but they were kind enough not to push for a refund or exchange.

[TexasJack]

A guy I worked for years ago used to say, "This would be a great business if it wasn't for those damned customers!"

It sounds silly, but there were some days when we'd say that to each other (not in front of a customer) just to laugh through the aggravation of the moment.

Do your leather suppliers take stuff back? Ummm, no. Point that out to anyone who complains.

The one who makes the mistake pays for it. THAT'S GOOD CUSTOMER SERVICE!

[sharkeyfinn]

with regards to haggling, i haggle upwards, if someone comes at me with" i'll give you 15 for the 20 item, i come back with 25 and thats where the price stays unless they are dumb enough to try again, then it goes up to 30 and so on ;-)

[cdthayer]

That's one way to do it. Another thing that works, is to just simply reject the offer and take it off of the market to keep it instead of selling it.

CD in Oklahoma