Springfield Leather Company - That Time They Told Me To Get Lost.

[cody1200]

I would agree if you want better service from an American company move to America. USA USA USA

[RavenAus]

I would agree if you want better service from an American company move to America. USA USA USA

Or, you know, actually give your customers what they pay for, or don't sell outside your country! Funnily enough, not every leatherworker in the world is American, and to get ME to move there would take more than a Hollywood stars income. You like your country, fine. Don't treat the rest of the world as second class because we don't live there.

[BuckarooBasics]

I'm an American and my recent experience with Springfield Leather was terrible.

[Spinner]

For the majority of my orders SLC does pretty well. Only issue I have ever had is with their Bomber Brown leather.

They have one clear picture on the website but the lots vary so widely on the product that I had to stop ordering it.

At first I thought they had screwed up an order but after trying to get the same leather as I received the first time,

4 subsequent orders were all filled with slightly difference color/grain pattern yet the customer service said it was the same.

Can't have inconsistency like that so I source it elsewhere now but still order from them for stuff I know will be the same like 'roo lace and pre-dyed HO.

[DavidL]

Spring field is trying to increase their profit margins. They buy in huge lots (4000sq feet for one veg tan minimum order from brazil last time I emailed) from low end tanneries in developing nations for really low prices. Then they turn around and sell them at a huge markup. no surprise there. The only thing is the products he gets are so poor quality that a lot of the pieces have things like mosquito bites, holes, brands and really bad characteristics, majority low end and fewer that are okay. No high end leathers, mostly at cheap leather for beginners or the non discerning craftsman. The one I received had at least 200 mosquito bites and it was "A" quality. Anyone who checked it would have noticed immediately it was scrap.

They try to pawn off some of the bad stuff into peoples shipments knowing that there is a 25-40 percent change that the person will call to get it replaced depending on how bad the hide is and they take those odds. Bottom line they don't care about the customers and make up for the bad quality by acting like it was a mistake and they send you a new hide thats one of the good ones. In your mind you think its great customer service.

Not blaming them though, thats just how bad some of these hides from undeveloped countries tanneries are and there is no other way to get rid of them and they won't admit its garbage quality otherwise it will scare away customers. So if you call in they give you a good one and pay for shipping too.

Out of the people that bought from SLC there has to be a bunch that had to get something returned or didn't bother calling in.

[plowboy73]

Yep we buy from them because we're non discerning crafstmen and beginners. Look we all do this craft because we love it we don't always need a perfect canvas and sometimes we do. We get what we pay for and I'm pretty sure we're watching our profit margins too?

[Pablo27]

I shop at SLC and it has been ok, like so many of you I shop there for the price, and for that price you get what you pay most of the time. I have Never had a perfect shopping experience anywhere! It only takes one person in shipping to be lazy or not doing there job to send the worng stuff out not a whole company. I had to let customers go in my previous business, 98% of the people want premium service or product for Dollar Store prices. But if I don't like somewhere I don't shop there, period. end of story. I am probably wrong here but it sure seemsl like to me if a customer has the time and effort to spend all the time to try and degrade a business in a public forum that maybe that customer wasn't worth keeping anyway. Just sayin.

Paul

In God we trust

[Turner Leatherworks]

As a cop for ten years, I learned that there are always two sides to every story...the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

I have been ordering from them and had to return Herman Oak sides twice (was not up to my standards), and had a couple of other small hiccups along the way. I even had Kevin on the phone today, along with DeAnna (from purchasing)...both super nice. They have always been polite with me (as I have been with them). I plan to continue to do business with them on supplies...I will go to Tandy and pick out my leather by hand (because I am picky...and I know it). If they ever plan to not do business with me, then I will go elsewhere for my supplies...your experience changes absolutely nothing with my opinion of them...but it was a neat story non-the-less.

And one more thing...

NO SOUP FOR YOU!

[craftsman827]

I just started doing business with SLC. I placed 3 orders so far & I'm pleased with their products.

I'm not a newby to leathercraft, been working with leather for over 40 years, & I have used many different suppliers over the years.

Two of my orders to SLC had veg tanned sides, first 3/4 oz. than 5/6 oz. sides, both were up to par !

I don't know if you ordered via the internet, or by phone. I found the best way to order from them is by PHONE !

You can tell the salespreson just what you want, & expect. Just my 2 cents worth. HAPPY TOOLING !

Edited October 16, 2014 by craftsman827

[JLSleather]

And now, for something completely different...

Seems like I mighta talked to a dozen different girls down there at SLC. What say, we take a poll -- see kin we git them to print a calendar.. Girls of SLC...

What.. jus' sayin ...

[Oldtoolsniper]

Spring field is trying to increase their profit margins. They buy in huge lots (4000sq feet for one veg tan minimum order from brazil last time I emailed) from low end tanneries in developing nations for really low prices. Then they turn around and sell them at a huge markup. no surprise there. The only thing is the products he gets are so poor quality that a lot of the pieces have things like mosquito bites, holes, brands and really bad characteristics, majority low end and fewer that are okay. No high end leathers, mostly at cheap leather for beginners or the non discerning craftsman. The one I received had at least 200 mosquito bites and it was "A" quality. Anyone who checked it would have noticed immediately it was scrap.

They try to pawn off some of the bad stuff into peoples shipments knowing that there is a 25-40 percent change that the person will call to get it replaced depending on how bad the hide is and they take those odds. Bottom line they don't care about the customers and make up for the bad quality by acting like it was a mistake and they send you a new hide thats one of the good ones. In your mind you think its great customer service.

Not blaming them though, thats just how bad some of these hides from undeveloped countries tanneries are and there is no other way to get rid of them and they won't admit its garbage quality otherwise it will scare away customers. So if you call in they give you a good one and pay for shipping too.

Out of the people that bought from SLC there has to be a bunch that had to get something returned or didn't bother calling in.

Off topic from the OP but:

Do you read what you write?

Spring field is trying to increase their profit margins. They buy in huge lots (4000sq feet for one veg tan minimum order from brazil last time I emailed) from low end tanneries in developing nations for really low prices. Then they turn around and sell them at a huge markup. no surprise there.

Wow they personally tell you their business model. That's impressive.

[The only thing is the products he gets are so poor quality that a lot of the pieces have things like mosquito bites, holes, brands and really bad characteristics, majority low end and fewer that are okay. No high end leathers, mostly at cheap leather for beginners or the non discerning craftsman. The one I received had at least 200 mosquito bites and it was "A" quality. Anyone who checked it would have noticed immediately it was scrap.]

Can you share a picture of one of these mosquito bites? I'm surprised that would survive the tanning process or that someone could in fact determine that a blemish was in fact caused by a mosquito bite.

[No high end leathers, mostly at cheap leather for beginners or the non discerning craftsman.]

What are you saying here? If we buy from them we are__________?

[They try to pawn off some of the bad stuff into peoples shipments knowing that there is a 25-40 percent change that the person will call to get it replaced depending on how bad the hide is and they take those odds. Bottom line they don't care about the customers and make up for the bad quality by acting like it was a mistake and they send you a new hide thats one of the good ones. In your mind you think its great customer service]

You are who they personally decided to divulge their business plan to? You even know the percentage of non returns they have on a weekly, monthly or yearly basis? Which is it because those statistics matter to us Non discerning beginners.

I hate getting duped into thinking I got great customer service. Sounds like a great way to do business ship a junk hide then re-ship a good one at no cost to correct it. Yes sir paying for employees to man those phones, box up products, and ship them is all free. So are the boxes, tape, and printing labels. I bet UPS is in on it too, perhaps they only charge for every other box shipped.

[Not blaming them though, thats just how bad some of these hides from undeveloped countries tanneries are and there is no other way to get rid of them and they won't admit its garbage quality otherwise it will scare away customers. So if you call in they give you a good one and pay for shipping too. ]

I'm glad you don't blame them! I'm also glad you let us in on where those nasty mosquito bitten, Non discerning beginner hides came from. I'm betting you have been to those tanneries and seen the poor practices first hand.

I'm sure you can show us pictures of all of this and offer some sound guidance to help out us Non discerning beginning craftsman so we don't get sucked into buying any of these bad hides.

Put something useful together and help us please!

[JLSleather]

I've ordered stuff from them and been pleased with my purchase. I've also ordered and been mad enough to chew nails. They have always been pretty good about 'fixing' the orders I wasn't happy with - but how much time do you want to spend on the phone getting what you should have already received!@3@#!

I explained this is roughly those terms, and they HAVE done better recently.

Now, about that calendar...

[Oldtoolsniper]

In reading what the OP typed It sounds like neither side is happy with the other. It happens, it a free market place and perhaps both should just move on. They did offer alternatives and did not appear to be rude. They admitted that they cannot meet the OP demands, I'm not sure what else they could do.

Customer service is tough. I'm old enough to remember ordering by mail order from a black and white catalog. We wrote letters back then and waited. If it wasn't right you sent it back with a letter and waited. We used checks too.

I work part time selling firearms and until you have been "behind the counter" what some customers want and what can be provided is worlds apart. Your not going to drop a "perp" at 200 yards with your .380. Perhaps this individual needs to go shop in Hollywood.

Free markets allow us to shop and buy anything we want from whomever we want. It also allows the seller the ability to say I can't satisfy your needs at this time, I would recommend you go to X,Y or even Z and try them. In this case it seems as though they did that.

The original poster had a bad experience and posted about it. I completely get that.

As a new guy to leather working when I read all these posts it implies that Springfield Leather is a place to avoid because they have a track record of ripping off customers with bad hides.

Is this true? Their catalogs says they have been in business for over 40 years. How can they be in business that long by providing bad customer service?

[JLSleather]

Well, I don't know that length of time in business has much to do with quality, or even service. Not speaking of any particular company, a long track record could mean great service, or could mean we make enough gouging customers that we can afford the bad publicity!

One example .. there was a roofing (shingling) company running around. GREAT service -- price, speed, courtesy, all great. That same company.. in business about 50 years, is now useless. The original roof guy has long since retired and moved away - and this bunch of boys they have now, I wouldn't want on my property, much less working on my house.

Don't matter where I order stuff - if it aint what i paid for they git it back. This of course drives up costs for everybody.. they gotta charge YOU more for paying someone to ship and restock MY order. Don't kid yourself.. the "company" is not taking that.. they passing that along the line.

More important, where you at in Iowa? We're up here in Fort Dodge. And we agree that you can't take down an attacker at 200 yards with the .380 -- I personally think it has something to do with the humidity in Iowa, but that may not be quite accurate either.

C A L E N D A R .....

[DavidL]

Off topic from the OP but:

Do you read what you write?

Spring field is trying to increase their profit margins. They buy in huge lots (4000sq feet for one veg tan minimum order from brazil last time I emailed) from low end tanneries in developing nations for really low prices. Then they turn around and sell them at a huge markup. no surprise there.

Wow they personally tell you their business model. That's impressive.

[The only thing is the products he gets are so poor quality that a lot of the pieces have things like mosquito bites, holes, brands and really bad characteristics, majority low end and fewer that are okay. No high end leathers, mostly at cheap leather for beginners or the non discerning craftsman. The one I received had at least 200 mosquito bites and it was "A" quality. Anyone who checked it would have noticed immediately it was scrap.]

Can you share a picture of one of these mosquito bites? I'm surprised that would survive the tanning process or that someone could in fact determine that a blemish was in fact caused by a mosquito bite.

[No high end leathers, mostly at cheap leather for beginners or the non discerning craftsman.]

What are you saying here? If we buy from them we are__________?

[They try to pawn off some of the bad stuff into peoples shipments knowing that there is a 25-40 percent change that the person will call to get it replaced depending on how bad the hide is and they take those odds. Bottom line they don't care about the customers and make up for the bad quality by acting like it was a mistake and they send you a new hide thats one of the good ones. In your mind you think its great customer service]

You are who they personally decided to divulge their business plan to? You even know the percentage of non returns they have on a weekly, monthly or yearly basis? Which is it because those statistics matter to us Non discerning beginners.

I hate getting duped into thinking I got great customer service. Sounds like a great way to do business ship a junk hide then re-ship a good one at no cost to correct it. Yes sir paying for employees to man those phones, box up products, and ship them is all free. So are the boxes, tape, and printing labels. I bet UPS is in on it too, perhaps they only charge for every other box shipped.

[Not blaming them though, thats just how bad some of these hides from undeveloped countries tanneries are and there is no other way to get rid of them and they won't admit its garbage quality otherwise it will scare away customers. So if you call in they give you a good one and pay for shipping too. ]

I'm glad you don't blame them! I'm also glad you let us in on where those nasty mosquito bitten, Non discerning beginner hides came from. I'm betting you have been to those tanneries and seen the poor practices first hand.

I'm sure you can show us pictures of all of this and offer some sound guidance to help out us Non discerning beginning craftsman so we don't get sucked into buying any of these bad hides.

Put something useful together and help us please!

I've been to villages in asia and seen the poverty and corruption there.. Workers get low pay and the health and wellbeing of the workers are at the bottom of the list. Have you been to 3rd world countries its not pleasant.

Not bashing anyone, but the company is good for what it is, catering to every day craftsmen - the equivalent to home depot for home improvement just that leather is a raw material that is difficult to get same quality. The people on this forum I wouldn't say are non discerning craftsman, probably the opposite considering they actively searched out this forum. People that do events for kids, or for the campsite, things like that quality isn't a huge concern, marks scratches, brands they wont bother returning it in. In cases like warranties the majority don't get the item fixed (if we are talking about cheap electronics or something thats not worth the hassle). The same goes for mail in rebates the company knows that less than 50 percent will go through the mailing process to get a 5 dollar rebate (they forget, or are busy).

If you own a business and quality and reliability is what you want its a no brainer to just buy straight from the source and cut out the middle man. If you want one or two hides and questionable quality then springfield leather is your place. The fact that they do replace it no questions asked is great and makes it better for the customer. They employ a similar strategy like the mail in rebate, they know first hand that the item being shipped out isn't the best quality sometimes and they know that whatever percent 30, 40, 60 percent may call in to get it replaced. Whether they do it knowingly is a different story

I can take a picture of the hide if you want, I assure you it has at least 200 mosquito bites. Not unexpected that out of 4000 sq feet a few are at the D range. In a tannery they sort them out A,B and special. SLC gets tannery run which is an assortment of hides. If I was in that position I would insist that a majority are A and B as its nearly impossible for then to all be perfect. Plus they obviously don't throw out the leather, instead probably group the C and D in the B category, which is where you get people saying they have holes in their leathers or in my case mosquito bites.

From what I got from the owner kevin after I inquired if I could get lower pricing for bulk order he told me that the pricing was relatively good for the price he buys them at, he also says in order for me to get the same pricing that he gets at his store I would have to order the tannery minimum order which was 4000 sq feet from brazil.

Anyone can figure out another persons business model to a certain degree. Mc donalds, nike, ect you can find their form 10 k online entailing most general information.

Edited October 16, 2014 by DavidL

[Tannin]

Yeah, agreed, that is disrespectful. Don't hear that kind of thing much these days. Not missing it.

[Oldtoolsniper]

[The people on this forum I wouldn't say are non discerning craftsman, probably the opposite considering they actively searched out this forum. People that do events for kids, or for the campsite, things like that quality isn't a huge concern, marks scratches, brands they wont bother returning it in. In cases like warranties the majority don't get the item fixed (if we are talking about cheap electronics or something thats not worth the hassle). The same goes for mail in rebates the company knows that less than 50 percent will go through the mailing process to get a 5 dollar rebate (they forget, or are busy). ]

In reading this I have to again ask if you read what you write?

You imply that the only people who buy from SLC cater to kids and campfire types and have no idea about what quality is.

I've seen pictures of holsters made on this website. Are those for the campfire kids?

Yes, please post a picture of a mosquito bite on a hide. Explain how you determined it was a mosquito bite and not from a Dermestid beetle?

Where did cheap electronics and warrantees come from in this conversation?

Why did you not return the mosquito bite riddled hide? You can't say you did now because you just told me you would provide a picture if I asked, I'm asking.

I've been to thirty five countries compliments of my previous employment. This has nothing to do with that.

Edited October 16, 2014 by Oldtoolsniper

[barehandcustoms]

SLC has always provided me with good leather and excellent customer service. I order the same leather from them all the time and only had to call once in the past. They corrected the issue and I continued doing business with them.

[DavidL]

They shipped me another hide free of charge and let me keep the unusable hide - Its unsellable anyways.. Roughly 70- 100 mosquito bites just on a 1 square foot piece. Total was 13 square foot and most of it was covered.

When it comes to their selections of leathers, a lot of it I personally wouldn't touch . The exception probably being the H/O leather, Horweens and the suedes if I had to choose. The goods that are bottled, tools ect are okay though. The Hermann oak can be bought one hide at a time from the tannery and the price is gets cheaper than SLC. Horween is also cheaper to buy from the factory. Manufacturer > Retailer.

A business owner will always get the most profit for there inventory as they can. So it may end up cheaper for them to take a gamble and put C quality hides into "B" shipments and hopefully they don't request a refund. The same concept is with mail in rebates, they say they will give you 10 dollars in cash back if you mail in the request form, get a envelope, stamp and then take the time to send it. Most people are too busy for it, forget, or they don't want to spend the time to do that. Very similar to what SLC is doing, it could just be coincidental though.

Its hard to believe a company that size has trouble training staff that large holes in leathers aren't sellable and 200+ mosquito bites is not A quality leather. If they sold you a bad hide they probably know it unless they just throw them into the shipping crates without giving them a once over.

I could be wrong, to me a large portion of customer has to be people that aren't on this forum, that aren't getting their work critiqued or asking about different techniques. Then a good amount are regular buyers from this forum, and others are buying from other stores, hide house, waterhouse, RJF, ebay or straight from the tannery.

[JLSleather]

Okay, so tha's two votes agin the calendar, one fer it ...

CRAP.. I hope they don't git offended and stop sellin ta me

Edited October 16, 2014 by JLSleather

[Tannin]

:D you are an incorrigible reprobate JLS

[danli1980]

The Hermann oak can be bought one hide at a time from the tannery and the price is gets cheaper than SLC.

Have you tried ordering one hide from the HO tannery before? All I can see on their Web site says minimum order of 5 or 10. Did you call?

[JLSleather]

I think HO is a minimum order of 10 sides if all the same thickness -- otherwise 20 sides.

[DavidL]

sorry, I got Wickett and craig and HO mixed up.

[Oldtoolsniper]

DavidL

So getting two hides plus free shipping on one of them to Canada for the price of one is what you consider a good business model?

Still need to give us a guide on how to get the best hides we can and where we are getting them from.

If you look at my posts they are for the most part contributing to the forum. I take clear pictures and explain why and what I am doing.

I even remember where and how I buy my leather. If there is a minimum I'm pretty sure I can keep that clear too.

So you know those are mosquito bites, explain it so I can benefit from it. Do the Mosquitos feed on the hides after the cow is skinned or is this feeding taking place before? I mean are they somehow sucking blood from a skinned hide or do they chew on them to eat the flesh?

I have read a lot of posts on this forum and you Sir, seem to dispense a lot of information as though it were a fact and you have the knowledge others are seeking. I see that when you are directly questioned you give no answers and no support for your facts. You supply pictures that are at best murky and unusable for anything other than to say your camera is bad and you have poor photography skills.

Are you really a US Citizen running for office?

Answer one question at a time.

How do you know those are mosquito bites?

Edited October 16, 2014 by Oldtoolsniper