Need Help And Or Advice On A Large Sewing Machine Table...

[cdurkinz]

Hi guys, I've been reading on this forum for a while now but finally had to post. Ok, so here goes:

I am an upholsterer, and I sew literally anything and everything that someone wants me to sew. Boat interiors, boat canvas (covers), car interiors, furniture, pillows, etc... etc..

So when I'm at work my business partner has a pretty sweet setup, he has a 4' x 8' sewing table that he made himself, with a Consew 206RB-3 in it, which is a good machine, and this setup works pretty darn well when sewing bigger things. So right now we are in the middle of a big job, we are sewing an outdoor Smoke Room enclosure for a Bar a couple towns over, and this thing is just massive. We are talking canvas that is 27' long, and 118" or so wide, and needless to say it is quite a pain to sew, even on the big table at work. Now because of how swamped we are, many times I bring work home with me, so I'm taking it home to try and get some of it done at home, where I have a Pfaff 145-H4 on a standard size itty-bitty sewing table that every machine seems to come with now days, and it's just too small. Even when sewing much smaller things like seats and stuff it just feels too small to me and I have decided on upgrading.

Therein lies my problem, because finding large sewing tables is ridiculously hard. I have only found ONE large table for sale, which remarkably, is actually cut for a Pfaff 145 (545, 1245 etc) and it's the only bigger table that I have found, aaaaand, it's at a decent price. (fate?) Now the only problem I see with it, is it's still only 3' x 6' which is still on the small side after working on my partner's nice big table, but I'm leaning towards buying it purely so that I won't have to undertake the burden of making my own. BUT, I hate wasting money and the shipping alone for this table top, is literally half the price of the table top itself, turning a decently priced table top into a "hmm, I could probably make that myself," type of thing.

Now, although I love making my own stuff, I am a bit of a perfectionist and since I've never used a router in my life, even though I do have access to a pretty nice one, I worry that I could mess up routing the hole where my Pfaff 145 will sit, and then I would have to stare at the abomination, that I made, for hours on end while sewing until it drives me nuts and I redo it costing me even more than what it would cost to just buy the one I found and pay for the shipping. Having said this, I have made lots of things out of wood, I am decent at woodworking, and I'm positive I could figure this out eventually, but again I've never used a router, and this seems sort of complex? Is it really that hard? (routing the hole for the machine and belt that is)

I have found a great thread about a DIY table, right on this very site actually. Although it's a couple years old, and for a smaller table (ugh), it's actually for my exact machine, and makes it look doable.

So I guess I'm looking for advice. Has anyone else made their own larger sewing machine table? Does anyone know where to find them? Has anyone just made additions onto their tiny standard size sewing table making it quite a bit bigger? What would you guys do?

Thanks!

Chris

Edited April 22, 2015 by cdurkinz

[amuckart]

The secret to routing slots for a sewing machine is to use a template and a good plunge router that you can set the depth on (especially for the corners).

I've made complex router templates out of 4mm masonite/hardboard before and that has worked well. I drew up the plans in inkscape (free SVG editor), printed them, checked the dimensions and stuck them to the hardboard. I used a stanley knife to carefully cut the shapes out, going over it with multiple passes, not trying to do the whole cut at once. You could use a scrollsaw or a jigsaw if you're really good with one, but a knife is more accurate if you're not. Slots are easy, just clamp a straight edge on to the material, clamp a couple of stops to that and route between them.

All of the big loft-style sewing tables I've seen have been custom built for the space they're in. They're not inherently complex things to build if you've got the tools. There's no reason you couldn't build one with a hand saws and a hammer & nails, but power tools would make it quicker. The only tricky bit is getting a consistent slope away from the machine at the right angle to help the outfeed but not so steep that the fabric just slides down it.

[Colt W Knight]

...duplicate

Edited April 22, 2015 by Colt W Knight

[Colt W Knight]

Learning to use the router, you can fabricate just about anything you want. I do ton of custom routing work, and I always make templates first. The trick with a router is learning how to control the cutting and taking small bites. The templates and a bearing guided bit do all the hard work.

*Note - I have a lot of tools, so I use them - but this can all be done with hand tools easily.

First - where your eyes and ears -

Draw what you want to route - If you have stepped holes you will need to make multiple sets of template ( when you do this, add index holes, so you can screw them down to the table and always be lined up)

ums/mm308/coltwknight/From%20Scratch/102_4442.jpg[/img][/url]

Glue your template to hardboard - Or just draw on the hardboard and skip this step.

cut and shape - The nicer you make this 1/4" template - the more professional your table will look.

I use double sided duct tape to hold templates together - Here I made perimeter template - then duplicated it to make the cutout template - That way I had a template for both

*notice I use a bearing guided router bit to exactly duplicate the template

For the work I do - I make 3/4" working template and save the 1/4" template as a master template - 2 reasons 1) the 3/4" template allows me to take smaller bites with the router to get cleaner lines. 2) MDF wears out, so I like have master templates to continually make working templates over time. For a one time job, this is over kill - however, if you are new to routing its is outstanding practice because MDF is super cheap, and screwing up your table is not.

Straight lines require no template, use a wooden straight edge

[Colt W Knight]

* You can buy both top and bottom bearing bits and use whatever is most convenient for you.

Whenever possible - Use forstner bits and saws ( band saws for outside trimming and something like a scroll saw or jig saw for inside cutting) to remove excess material. A router shouldn't be hogging off material, it works more like a planer or jointer - take small bites.

Set the maximum depth on the router, then just work your way down 1/4" at a time - This is where a plunge router is handy, a fixed base router you have to turn off, unplug, recalibrate, and repeat. The plunge router, you simply flip a lever.

Need to route a slot, use a fence - just remember to take small bites. It may take a few passes to get through

Edited April 22, 2015 by Colt W Knight

[Colt W Knight]

Sorry to take up so much of your thread - I just wanted to show some techniques for precision routing utilizing templates.

[cdthayer]

I do repairs and alterations to large fabric items. On one occasion, I re-sewed every top stitch on a mesh swimming pool cover that was about 30x20 feet in size. The mesh fabric and the webbing lattice straps were all good, just the stitching thread had all failed with age. It had 1 1/2” webbing straps top and bottom to sandwich the webbing on centerlines of about every five feet both length-wise and width-wise. Each webbing had three stitch lines across its width.

I don’t know when the next job is going to come in that requires an extra large table, so I opted not to go to the expense of buying or building a large sewing table knowing it might set for long periods of time not being used. And then there’s the problem of housing a structure that large.

For the pool cover job (and a couple of truck tarp jobs), I rigged up a temporary table each time just for the job. I set my regular Singer H-leg Power Stand (111W153) up out on my patio, and assembled temporary table surfaces both ways from the needle. I just used whatever scraps that I could come up with, including an old bench, a metal door, an old treadle stand, a couple of saw horses, a sheet of used roofing tin, a couple of 1x6 boards, and a large tub. It isn’t pretty, but it gets the job done. I sloped the surfaces from high to low to help with feeding the fabric. More time was spent rolling, rerolling, and positioning the item than actually sewing. I could sew about five feet before I had to get up and reposition things. I had no helpers.

BTW- I’ve heard that a Whitetail Deer got tangled up in it this past winter and did some damage to the mesh fabric before they could get her out of it, so I may be seeing it again sometime.

CD in Oklahoma

[cdurkinz]

Thanks a lot for the replies!

@Colt, making templates sounds like a great idea. I could probably use my current table's hole to trace out the template too... I guess my main question would be, does the template have to be a little larger than the actual hole will be? The router has a guide that comes in contact with the template so that the blade doesn't just cut right into it I believe, so wouldn't this space between the guide and the blade end up making the cut-out smaller than my template?

@Cdthayer, That is probably what I am going to have to do for this job, unfortunately. I don't have enough time to put it aside and worry about a big table right away, and even if I bought the table that I found online, it will most likely take a couple weeks to get here, so thanks for the suggestions! Btw, I had to laugh when I saw your picture, if only because I feel your pain!

Honestly, I wish I had the money for a Long arm sewing machine to go with the big table haha. Rolling the canvas and stuffing it through the tiny throat on these machines is not much fun!

Edited April 22, 2015 by cdurkinz

[Colt W Knight]

You are talking about guide bushings, those screw into the base of the router. If you use guide bushings, templates have to be wider to allow for the width of the guide bushing (pain in the ass), take it off and use a bearing guided flush cut router bit. They cut identical to the template, and are much more handy the guide bushings. Guide bushings are better served making matching inlay.

[cdurkinz]

Ahh, ok good to know! Thank you.

Would this be what I'd want? http://www.homedepot.com/p/Diablo-1-2-in-x-1-in-Carbide-Top-Bearing-Flush-Trim-Router-Bit-DR50102/100660681

The router I have access to is a plunging router, I believe. It's made by craftsman.

Edited April 22, 2015 by cdurkinz

[amuckart]

Ahh, ok good to know! Thank you.

Would this be what I'd want? http://www.homedepot.com/p/Diablo-1-2-in-x-1-in-Carbide-Top-Bearing-Flush-Trim-Router-Bit-DR50102/100660681

The router I have access to is a plunging router, I believe. It's made by craftsman.

Yes, that's what you want. There are two types of flush cut router bit: ones with the bearing at the shaft; and ones with the bearing at the tip. For this job you want one with the bearing at the shaft, which that ones has.

To use a bit like this you need to cut the bulk of the material out first so you're just using the router bit to create the finished edge. Just make sure that whatever material you end up using is thinner than the router bit is long.

[Colt W Knight]

Ahh, ok good to know! Thank you.

Would this be what I'd want? http://www.homedepot.com/p/Diablo-1-2-in-x-1-in-Carbide-Top-Bearing-Flush-Trim-Router-Bit-DR50102/100660681

The router I have access to is a plunging router, I believe. It's made by craftsman.

I use that exact bit when I build guitars.

Yes, that's what you want. There are two types of flush cut router bit: ones with the bearing at the shaft; and ones with the bearing at the tip. For this job you want one with the bearing at the shaft, which that ones has.

To use a bit like this you need to cut the bulk of the material out first so you're just using the router bit to create the finished edge. Just make sure that whatever material you end up using is thinner than the router bit is long.

It doesn't have to be thinner material if you take multiple shallow passes, but to do this, you have to have a tall template to give the bearing a surface to ride on.

[amuckart]

It doesn't have to be thinner material if you take multiple shallow passes, but to do this, you have to have a tall template to give the bearing a surface to ride on.

I was a bit unclear. You can't (or rather, shouldn't) try and cut materials that are thicker than the cutting edge of the router bit + bearing are long because doing so requires only partial insertion of the shaft into the collet of the router and if you get that wrong it can go very badly very fast when the bit is spinning.

[brmax]

Plus 1 on the tall template if using the bearing guide, as doing the corners and hinge areas aren't as deep and needing the tall template height.

I have used a straight edge, say a 1x whatever and run against it and by putting some sort of stop for the corner, so you could return to do them at the angle for the lower depth.

In any case the first is going thru the formica and would need to be 1/8 deep and following with small increases.

clamps and stop block are your friend.

Go for it

Edited April 23, 2015 by brmax

[cdurkinz]

You guys sort of lost me. On the corners for a sewing machine table, it needs to be routed because you have to leave much of the wood there for the machine to sit on, I only want to take out about a half inch deep, and I'm going to be using wood that's like 1.5'' thick, I guess I'm just not understanding what you mean by:

Just make sure that whatever material you end up using is thinner than the router bit is long.

[amuckart]

Router bits have cutting edges that are a certain length, say 1 1/4". With a router bit like that you can cut material 1 1/4" thick. If you want to cut material 1 5-16" thick you have to leave 1/16" of the shaft sticking out pf the bushing on the router. This is invariably a Bad Idea.

If you can get a 1 1/2" bit, then you can use up to 1 1/2" thick material for your table top. That's more than enough for what you want to do. 1" is plenty for table tops like this.

[brmax]

Good morning!

No matter this is not the time to attempt a 1.5" plunge cut out. imho

Edit: preferably 1/4" cut is more than enough in each step, the consistent down pressure and control of the router is practiced through time. Go for it on some other material a little, " A key is only going one way in the wood grain" practice you will see.

From a manufacturing point i believe plunge cuts are more easily performed In particle, and mdf. but remembering a lot of process are machine controlled routers.

Tip:The bearing is for following the pattern without burning the wood from 20,000rpm bits as a bushing guide does.

Measuring from the circle edge of router base that rides against a temp guide to the bit is practiced, as some bases are not same on both sides.

Good day there, & getter done

[cdurkinz]

Router bits have cutting edges that are a certain length, say 1 1/4". With a router bit like that you can cut material 1 1/4" thick. If you want to cut material 1 5-16" thick you have to leave 1/16" of the shaft sticking out pf the bushing on the router. This is invariably a Bad Idea.

If you can get a 1 1/2" bit, then you can use up to 1 1/2" thick material for your table top. That's more than enough for what you want to do. 1" is plenty for table tops like this.

Ahhh ok I think I understand now. Ya, I won't be doing any of that. I just need the router to form the rounded corners where the sewing machine sits, which is like 1/2" deep or so. I will be removing most of the material beforehand with a jigsaw.

Edited April 25, 2015 by cdurkinz

[amuckart]

Ahhh ok I think I understand now. Ya, I won't be doing any of that. I just need the router to form the rounded corners where the sewing machine sits, which is like 1/2" deep or so. I will be removing most of the material beforehand with a jigsaw.

I would use the router around the whole circumference. You'll get a far better result that way. Take most of the material out with a jigsaw, leaving a small amount inside the lines, then take it back to the lines with the router.

It does mean you'll need two templates, one for the full thickness cut and one for the corners.

First route full thickness with a template like this:

Then route the corners half (or whatever) thickness with a template like this

That will give you a hole like this:

You'll need a way to ensure the templates are perfectly lined up but that can be done by making sure the outsides are exactly the same size and clamping a builder's square on to the the table.

[Trox]

Hi,

My Dürkopp Adler 267-373 table has a table top that you can build on extra size to. You put in long steel bolts in pre drilled holes and add the extra table pieces, see pic. It will not be extremely big, but you can at least double the size when needed and take it off when not. Perhaps something to think about when a big table is not needed all the time. This is a Norwegian table system, I am sure it will be similar tables available other countries too.

Tor

[cdurkinz]

I would use the router around the whole circumference. You'll get a far better result that way. Take most of the material out with a jigsaw, leaving a small amount inside the lines, then take it back to the lines with the router.

It does mean you'll need two templates, one for the full thickness cut and one for the corners.

First route full thickness with a template like this:

g3887.png

Then route the corners half (or whatever) thickness with a template like this

g3896.png

That will give you a hole like this:

g3906.png

You'll need a way to ensure the templates are perfectly lined up but that can be done by making sure the outsides are exactly the same size and clamping a builder's square on to the the table.

I was actually wondering about this, I have to imagine the cut from a jigsaw might not be as nice as the cut from a router, so thanks for that.

Edited April 26, 2015 by cdurkinz

[cdurkinz]

Hi,

My Dürkopp Adler 267-373 table has a table top that you can build on extra size to. You put in long steel bolts in pre drilled holes and add the extra table pieces, see pic. It will not be extremely big, but you can at least double the size when needed and take it off when not. Perhaps something to think about when a big table is not needed all the time. This is a Norwegian table system, I am sure it will be similar tables available other countries too.

Tor

At least in the US, it is very hard to find ANY tables other than the standard little ones that come with pretty much every machine. I really like that idea for your table, I was actually already thinking about making some hinged pieces that I can fold out when I need to. One piece that can extend out from behind the machine for long canvas to ride on, and another that might flip up in the front to connect with the tables I currently use. I'll post some pics.

This is how I had it setup for the loooong canvas I just sewed, and it actually worked great.

http://imgur.com/8OUQFmx,M8q6xF4#0

http://imgur.com/8OUQFmx,M8q6xF4#1

(I actually had yet another table to the left of the drafting table because this stuff was so long)

[dirtclod]

I guess i'm missing something here. Why do you need to build a table for your machine ? When all you need to do is build a table any size you want the same height as the table you have. I've seen tons of pictures of upholstery shop set ups and that what they do.

[J Hayes]

I guess i'm missing something here. Why do you need to build a table for your machine ? When all you need to do is build a table any size you want the same height as the table you have. I've seen tons of pictures of upholstery shop set ups and that what they do.

+1

That's what the guy who made my boat cover has set up. His has to be 20 ft on the out feed side and 12 ft wide, it's pretty awesome to see, sews with a Consew 206RB. One could even use 8 ft folding tables....

Edited April 27, 2015 by J Hayes

[amuckart]

That's what the guy who made my boat cover has set up. His has to be 20 ft on the out feed side and 12 ft wide, it's pretty awesome to see, sews with a Consew 206RB. One could even use 8 ft folding tables....

I've tried that and it didn't work well. They weren't quite the right height, the out feed had no slope away from the machine and they were much too light so the drag of the fabric could pull them over.

If you're building something for a permanently placed machine, you may as well build it directly into the table and not have to deal with the join between the machine table edge and the big table edge.