Italian Suffering. Dolce Vita.

[glmr]

Hello.

Some days ago I started to think about sewing machine for leather, which should be cheap and able to sew 4-5mm of leather (I mean total thickness). I checked out all the planet and found that here in Italy it is a big problem.

New machines (Juki, Cowboy, Adler etc) are from 2000 euro, so I'm afraid to die from hunger without incomes. For other possible solution I made a small review. Here it is:

1. used industrial machine. from 500 euro

pros: it works, but...

cons: post-apocalyptic condition. screams "kill me!". the motor should be changed to 220V (+150euro). shipping cost.

So, it is possible solution but I need to hunt one every day and/or spend a lot of money.

2. Tuffsew and clones. for 300-400 euro.

pros: compact size. reachable price. it sews sometimes.

cons: it doesn't sometimes

as I can see it is just waste of money or not?

3. Consew CP 206R from USA. for 600 euro, including shipping, VAT and custom fees.

pros: compact size. quite reachable price.

cons: lack of reviews. and even lack of videos. the motor needs an adapter for 220V

Anyone knows if this machine exists in a while?

4. Sailrite Ultrafeed. for 1300 euro.

pros: compact size. it works. it sews

cons: damages the leather by its teeth. comes here for 1300 euro and not less.

So, 1300 euro and waste of leather. Do you remember about hunger and death?

5. vintage full-metal machine. for almost 0.

pros: cheap as dirt. able to work even after nuclear explosion.

cons: no walking foot. no spare parts. forever.

Maybe it is possible to attach servomotor to such machine? Do I need a speed reducer?

6. miracle. for ...

pros: sometimes it happens.

cons: there are no miracles.

Any ideas?

Please, help me!

[Uwe]

Having a machine shipped from America seems like a waste of shipping money. You have nearly a dozen countries within daytrip distance from where you live, with a good supply of name brands like Adler, Pfaff, etc. There must be a few machines coming up for sale every so often with a major fashion center like Milan nearby. Avoid shipping if you can - it's a risk with these machines and many get damaged during shipping because many private sellers don't know how to package them properly.

It may take a little time to get the perfect (or even a good-enough) machine. Start with one that just works and is cheap, then upgrade when you've earned enough money with it and you know what you really want in a machine. Make sure you can get a service manual for your machine before you buy it - it's very important when it comes to fixing things yourself. No matter what machine you start with, you'll want to upgrade eventually. Sewing machines can be addictive and you learn a lot once you start using them.

Old is good when it comes to leather sewing machines. If you read the posts on this forum you'll soon see a pattern of just a dozen or so machines that have been around forever, copied many times, and have a good supply of parts and accessories. Look for an old Adler 67/167/267, Consew 225/226, Singer 111, or something along those lines. If the machine works and you take care of it and don't abuse it, it will last you forever.

Check ebay and also the local/regional online for-sale sites where people sell things that are too heavy to ship (washing machines, etc.) That's were many people sell sewing machines. We have Craigslist.com here in north America - there must be something similar in Europe. Register on the site, develop some good search terms and subscribe to searches in order to get notified via email when a suitable machine comes up for sale. You'll be one step ahead of the casual shopper who only checks every couple of days. The good machines at bargain prices often sell within a matter of hours, not days.

Good luck with your search, let us know what you end up getting.

[LumpenDoodle2]

Hello glmr, an old Singer sewing machine is cheap, and will get you started for sewing thin/soft leather. Not a perfect solution, but I've been there, and neccessity is definately the mother of invention.

It took me a year to find a Singer 29K patcher within my budget, and I still had to make a 270 mile round trip to collect it. My walking foot machine I finally found a couple of months ago. It's not as heavy duty as I would like, but it will do untill a better one turns up.

As Uwe has said, keep checking your local papers, internet, etc, and consider putting out wanted adverts too. Something will turn up, and the money you save in shipping, you can buy a better machine.

Working within a tight budget is never easy, but with patience you'll end up with the machine you really want.

[Constabulary]

I have an ADLER 37 with top + bottom feed in a very good used condition. It has a treadle base but a motor can be added w/o problems. The Adler 37 is more or less a "clone" of the Singer 31-19 or 31-47 so you still can find parts for it f.i. at College Sewing in the UK or Ebay.com. Bobbin case, presser feet, tension assembly and so forth are still available. This machine has reverse mechanism and the max. stitch length is 5mm. It has no timing belt, it is "rod driven" so you don´t have to worry about a melted timing belt after an atomic explosion or so.

I would sell just the head if you can find a table / base for it locally. That would make shipping much cheaper. I live in Germany so no custom fees or taxes.

Maybe you are interested in either the head or the whole machine setup.

Edited August 25, 2015 by Constabulary

[glmr]

So, I checked some machines on Italian market. 99% have post-apocalyptic condition and/or industrial motor for 380V. Changing the motor will cost about 150-200 euro, so the final price will be about 600 euro. For the same price I can buy Consew CP 206R from USA. Or wait for miracle when someone comes from USA to Italy and brings me Ultrafeed for reachable price.

Any advice?

PS: Constabulary, I wrote you in PM.

[Tejas]

Or wait for miracle when someone comes from USA to Italy and brings me Ultrafeed for reachable price.

Just in case you are not aware, Sailrite Ultrafeed sewing machines are walking-foot machines but not compound walking-foot machines.

[Uwe]

The Consew CP 206R isn't a true triple/compound (top+bottom+needle) feed machine either, just a top+bottom feed. The needle does not help move the material. A sewing demo video of the Consew CP 206r is not confidence inducing in my mind.

In contrast, the confusingly similar named Consew 206RB (slightly strange sewing demo video) looks similar at a superficial glance, but it's a totally different design, a factory strength machine with a proper compound feed. An ugly but functional used Consew 206RB is much more desirable for leather work than a shiny new Consew CP 206r, in my opinion.

I started my sewing adventure with a Consew 225. It was not pretty when I picked it up at the local thrift shop, but it worked and was a great machine to learn with and work on (early video I made with it). After getting the mechanics to work smoothly, I eventually gave it a cosmetic overhaul as well. I posted it in the for sale section here after I got my hands on a nice Adler 67.

Make sure you read the fine print of the machines design specs and closely inspect video footage (if available) of the machines you're considering.

[glmr]

Yes, I know they are both without needle feed. But I suppose that bottom and top feed should be enough for me. Anyway - triple feed's price is too much for me.

[DrmCa]

OMG! Can't you get a 220V servo motor from the ebay for less than it would cost to change a 380V motor to 220V?

Buy the head and K-legs/table top without a motor, then buy a servo separately and you are all set.

And you absolutely need a walking foot machine if you do not want leather marked by the feed dogs. Been there, done that, not going back.

And if you are on a tight budget, I suggest buying a cylinder arm machine as you get the best of both worlds: can stitch tubular and flat.

Edited August 25, 2015 by DrmCa

[glmr]

are you kidding? Less expensive cylinder arm machine has a price about 500euro+50shipping+150servomotor. Total will be 700 euro if I'm lucky. For a machine which is old as a mammoth shit and without a warranty and replacement parts.

[Uwe]

Henry Ford once said: "If you need a machine and don’t buy it, then you will ultimately find that you have paid for it and don’t have it."

It sounds like you already made up your mind as to what machine you will buy. It may not be the machine you need in our collective opinion, but it's all part of the learning process.

[glmr]

I just checked my chances to earn after spending.

I forgot to tell - I'm going to sew totebags. No outer stitches, inside only. Visible stitches by hands only.

[Darren Brosowski]

As a seller of machines I have a problem in that I am honest to the point of being brutal and it can put customers off but I would rather see them walk out the door than buy a machine that will not do the job required.

4-5mm is a thickness that many machines can handle but it is not the only consideration

What thread size do you want to use?

What type of work are you making?

What type of leather?

Craft or production?

Answers to those questions lead to others.

Forget the Sailrite as it is a glorified domestic machine.

Talk to the European guys on the page as they may have a machine to suit - they are lovers and collectors as well as sewers - but they can also piont you to good dealers.

[glmr]

For sure it would be better to buy industrial machine for leather. But for this moment I'm forced to use domestic machine, just because all money went for laser cutter. Also I don't have industrial volumes. Soon I'll show what I made.

Edited September 2, 2015 by glmr

[25b]

Forget the Sailrite as it is a glorified domestic machine.

This is just not true. I own a Sailrite and use it daily for leather and also heavy, thick tactical nylon fabrication and it works great.

Not going to get in an argument on here, but I cannot let that statement stand unchallenged because it is incorrect. No, it's not going to sew through an inch of leather, but that does NOT mean it's just a "glorified domestic machine". The Sailrite can handle a LOT more than a puny "domestic" machine can.

Oh, and I do not sell machines so I don't have any reason to not tell the truth about them, so...if anyone has any questions about Sailrite machines, send me a PM and I will give you accurate information instead of rhetoric and hyperbole.

[Darren Brosowski]

Apart from the walking foot mechanism the internals of the Sailrite are all off the shelf parts developed by the Japanesein the 1960's for domestic machines. Most of these parts are still in mass production for various machines built in China and Taiwan.

It does many jobs well but for the price you can get a proper walking foot industrial with large bobbin and wide range of inexpensive feet.

I know this because I am a dealer and have imported several of the base Sailrite machines from Taiwan and tested them extensively but they are expensive for what they can do. If someone needs a portable machine for canvas, webbing, nylon etc. then they are worthwhile but please do not tell me I know nothing about them.

Tweaked up a bit a good 1960's Japanese cast iron domestic machine will sew nearly as thick but lacks the walking foot.

This is just not true. I own a Sailrite and use it daily for leather and also heavy, thick tactical nylon fabrication and it works great.

Not going to get in an argument on here, but I cannot let that statement stand unchallenged because it is incorrect. No, it's not going to sew through an inch of leather, but that does NOT mean it's just a "glorified domestic machine". The Sailrite can handle a LOT more than a puny "domestic" machine can.

Oh, and I do not sell machines so I don't have any reason to not tell the truth about them, so...if anyone has any questions about Sailrite machines, send me a PM and I will give you accurate information instead of rhetoric and hyperbole.

[25b]

I stand by what I said. I use one every day and I know what they're capable of. They ARE NOT "just a glorified domestic machine."

But you go on ahead and keep trying to convince people otherwise. I've got orders to fill...which will be built on my sailrite.