Adler 205-374

[leatherisfun]

Go as slow as you can and try to maintain the same speed while going around the turn. Guide the piece, don't fight it or force it. Practice is the key to getting better at such tasks. Make good work of that scrap pile.

[llucas]

Go as slow as you can and try to maintain the same speed while going around the turn. Guide the piece, don't fight it or force it. Practice is the key to getting better at such tasks. Make good work of that scrap pile.

My pile of stitched scrap is getting quite high, lol. The thing I liked about the YouTube video above was the definitive process related to needle and shuttle hook position. Unfortunately, it does not seem to apply to my Adler 205-374. For example, in the video with the needle slightly beyond bottom dead center he could change direction with the needle buried and not drop the stitch -- and the presser foot lift lever or pedal picked up both feet at that juncture. When my Adler is slightly above bottom dead center only the outer feet lift -- and without both feet lifted with the needle still in the leather the direction cannot be changed for a 90 degree turn without marring the leather as the center foot is still holding firm. Frustrating. Thanks for the answer and feedback.

Edited March 7, 2016 by llucas

[leatherisfun]

If you are making a 90 degree turn, leave the needle buried, life the foot, turn piece. You might have to turn wheel by hand to get it into the position you need without overshooting. Otherwise the above applies.

[TinkerTailor]

My pile of stitched scrap is getting quite high, lol. The thing I liked about the YouTube video above was the definitive process related to needle and shuttle hook position. Unfortunately, it does not seem to apply to my Adler 205-374. For example, in the video with the needle slightly beyond bottom dead center he could change direction with the needle buried and not drop the stitch -- and the presser foot lift lever or pedal picked up both feet at that juncture. When my Adler is slightly above bottom dead center only the outer feet lift -- and without both feet lifted with the needle still in the leather the direction cannot be changed for a 90 degree turn without marring the leather as the center foot is still holding firm. Frustrating. Thanks for the answer and feedback.

If both feet don't lift off the material when you step on the pedal lift or press the knee lift, something is not adjusted right. At any point in the stitch you should be able to stop the machine and lift both feet well clear of the material with the foot/knee lift. (this can cause skipped stitches if done at the wrong time)

The bobbins and shuttles of these machines are basically identical and they make stitches pretty much the same. That corner technique should work.

It could be that your feet are a little out of time if you are noticing a difference from videos, have you checked if it is to spec?

User Uwe on here has some adler videos on youtube that show close up slow motion of a machine in proper timing:

Edited March 7, 2016 by TinkerTailor

[Uwe]

I also made a separate video on just the alternating foot lift adjustment for the Adler 205. The procedure adjusts the alternating feet to make sure they lift the same amount as they walk.

Also, both feet should definitely lift off the material when you use the manual lever or the foot-operated foot lift. If they don't, something's wrong with your foot lift mechanism.

[llucas]

Thanks, Tinker and Uwe. The foot action on my machine follows the profile in Uwe's video. I will double check the lift issue, but as I recall for part of the cycle the lever or pedal does not lift the center foot. I'll confirm this and get back to you. I used Uwe's video on adjusting the foot lift to 10mm. There was a difference in my machine in that there was no spring between the two adjustment blocks, and the lift mechanism gave me trouble thereafter -- because the adjustment block (lift block?) directly above the foot lift adjustment block needs to be adjusted also? I posted on this issue in the past on this discussion, but for some reason several posts have disappeared.

Edited March 9, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

Ok, I checked the lift lever action in relationship to lifting the center foot. On a single thickness 8 oz leather scrap both feet will lift above the workpiece using the lever or foot pedal. However, after the needle penetrates the leather and all the way through the movement of the feed dog, center presser foot and needle toward the rear if I stop and use the lift lever the center presser barely lifts above the surface of the material. At any other point in the cycle the center and outer feet lift to the same level. On a piece of double thickness leather (about 1/4") the center foot will not lift above the material during the time the needle is in the leather. Clearly it is out of adjustment on this feature.

Is this adjusted by adjusting to the relative thickness of materials using the slot and hole on the upper left region of the faceplate? The older service manual for the 205-374 describes how to adjust the center foot to the thickest material to be sewn. Or, should the adjustable block that is engaged by the flat bar when the lever is lifted be adjusted slightly downward to achieve greater lift height for the lift lever? I should note that my foot pedal for lifting the feet needs a chain instead of the cable the last owner used -- when I use the pedal it does not lift high enough to disengage the upper tension plate, although it will release the feet to engage the leather. Also, when I manipulate by hand the long arm on the back of the machine to which the cable is attached, it does not lift the adjustable block for disengaging the presser feet bar high enough when fully depressed downward to open the upper tension adjuster plates. Looking at the adjustment blocks on the outer presser feet bar, it appears the adjustable block directly above the one used to adjust the outer presser feet height is not quite low enough for the presser foot activation lever to engage sufficiently to lift the outer presser foot bar high enough to disengage the tension plate. Does this maladjustment also affect the height of the center presser foot when disengaged by the lift lever or foot pedal?

Edited March 9, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

I attempted to adjust this block:

It did indeed cure the problem of being able to lift the center presser foot above the material. However, because I do not know how far the distance should be above the block below it, things seem to be further out of adjustment on the presser feet. Right now, when the center presser foot touches the feed dog, the tip of the needle is 15mm above the top of the feed dog. Frustrating. I can't find the answer in the service manual.

[llucas]

To complicate things, now the presser foot rod sticks in the "up" position rather than smoothly moving up and down, no matter how much the upper knob is turned to adjust the tension. The machine is now worse off than it was before, and completely out of adjustment for the presser feet. The hook timing is good. The timing of the feet is not. I oiled everything and quit for the evening.

Edited March 10, 2016 by llucas

[shoepatcher]

llucas,

Call Allen Weaver. He can walk you thru it just like he has on other things.

glenn

[llucas]

llucas,

Call Allen Weaver. He can walk you thru it just like he has on other things.

glenn

Next on my list. Thanks. He is indeed a great resource.

[llucas]

After tinkering with it a little further Allen Burkholder from Weaver returned my call and walked me through it. Here is his process for the Adler 205-374:

1. Rotate wheel to bring needle about 1/16” into the feed dog. Keep the upper presser tension adjustment knob under tension; don't remove it or the spring.

2. Loosen both blocks on presser foot bar let everything drop. Snug up.

3. Rotate with handwheel to highest position for outside feet.

4. Measure outside feet – need 9mm.

5. If not 9mm, bring needle a little lower into the feed dog, loosen lower block and adjust block down and retighten accordingly until 9mm is achieved.

6. Rotate until center presser foot is at its highest point and measure. Need about 8mm there.

7. If center foot is out of measure, loosen upper block and adjust center foot by prying it with screwdriver or finger on back of foot into correct measurement. Tighten upper block while holding foot in place.

8. Cycle the machine by hand and remeasure.

Worked like a charm! Allen is a fountain of knowledge on this machine. I can now bury the needle; lift the feet clear of the leather and turn a 90 degree corner without skipping a stitch or changing the length of the stitch.

Edited March 11, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

I just watched another Cobra Class 4 video on YouTube. Like the Al Bane video above, the Cobra cycles so the needle hits the leather before the center foot. Is this desirable? On my machine and other Adler 205 series videos I have seen the needle and center foot hit the leather about the same time. Is this a tomatoes/tomatos kind of thing, or does it make a difference in stitching; turning corners; etc.?

Here is the video:

I am assuming the Ader 205-370 series can be adjusted to do this (needle hitting the leather before the center foot) if it is a desirable feature.

Edited March 14, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

Here is another video, this time the Cowboy CB4500. In this case (at about 3:00 on the video) the foot/needle action seems to be the same as my Adler 205-374 where the needle and foot hit the leather at about the same time. Is one adjustment better than the other? Your thoughts on the question?

[Wizcrafts]

Here is another video, this time the Cowboy CB4500. In this case (at about 3:00 on the video) the foot/needle action seems to be the same as my Adler 205-374 where the needle and foot hit the leather at about the same time. Is one adjustment better than the other? Your thoughts on the question?

I set my CB4500 so that the needle and inside foot meet the top grain at the same moment, or as close as I can get. This insures that reverse stitches will hit the same holes, or at least come close to it. It also keeps the inside foot on the grain side until the needle has fully cleared the leather on the upstroke, minimizing the forward pull from the ascending needle. Getting the lifting of the inside foot and lowering of the presser foot timed is important for maintaining predictable stitch lengths.

[llucas]

Thanks, Wiz. Very helpful. Setting my machine up with the help of Allen Burkholder from Weaver put the needle and foot hitting the leather about the same time. This also cured the problem of unequal stitching in reverse. As it is now set up, in reverse the stitches hit the same hole but I was wondering about the value of the needle hitting the leather before the foot. Great help on this forum.

[llucas]

I am practicing on scrap using the Beast. After the help from Allen at Weaver adjusting the feet I am doing ok on the long straight runs. Where I am still having difficulty is the 90 degree turn. Still trying to figure out the optimum location of the needle in the cycle for turning the corner or putting the machine in reverse. The videos on YouTube have helped, but the cycling of my machine is slightly, ever so slightly different.

Here is the holster experiment from above (before it was finished) that is the first thing I sewed with the Beast. Of course, in my newbie status I did not know the middle foot should lift with the needle in the leather when the lift lever or pedal is used -- that is now fixed. The strap in the holster I sewed this morning.

You experienced Makers will see from the strap where I am still having difficulty. In the upper left corner where I started the stitch run as the second stitch starts the knot from the bobbin is on the surface. On the right hand side of the strap I managed to turn the corner by stopping close to the corner as the needle was descending. At that point I moved the needle as close to the leather as I could with the wheel and moved the stitch length lever up and down until the needle was centered on the corner and plunged the needle using the hand wheel to slightly past bottom dead center; put the stitch lever down, lifted the feet with the lever and made the 90 degree turn; lowered the feet and continued stitching to the next corner; then, same process for the next corner. So far, so good as I stitched the next long run. When I arrived at the next corner (lower left in photo) it got away from me at the corner and the feet position would not allow me to use the stitch lever to move the needle to a better spot. So, I put the needle back into the hole (slightly), lifted the feet and turned the corner, put the feet down and stitched. This left a big loop on the bottom as I continued. Frustrating being a newbie.

On the plus side, the experimental holster using the old English Bridle conditioned up ok (after not knowing what it was and trying to wet mold it!) using Fibbing's Leather Balm And Atom Wax. It is not something good enough to offer a customer, but it is ok for personal use. The learning curve moving away from hand stitching and only using moldable unfinished veg tan continues.

Edited March 15, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

After tinkering with it a little further Allen Burkholder from Weaver returned my call and walked me through it. Here is his process for the Adler 205-374:

1. Rotate wheel to bring needle about 1/16” into the feed dog. Keep the upper presser tension adjustment knob under tension; don't remove it or the spring.

2. Loosen both blocks on presser foot bar let everything drop. Snug up.

3. Rotate with handwheel to highest position for outside feet.

4. Measure outside feet – need 9mm.

5. If not 9mm, bring needle a little lower into the feed dog, loosen lower block and adjust block down and retighten accordingly until 9mm is achieved.

6. Rotate until center presser foot is at its highest point and measure. Need about 8mm there.

7. If center foot is out of measure, loosen upper block and adjust center foot by prying it with screwdriver or finger on back of foot into correct measurement. Tighten upper block while holding foot in place.

8. Cycle the machine by hand and remeasure.

Worked like a charm! Allen is a fountain of knowledge on this machine. I can now bury the needle; lift the feet clear of the leather and turn a 90 degree corner without skipping a stitch or changing the length of the stitch.

Also, I gave some incorrect information here. I double checked with Allen this morning. The center foot should also be at 9mm -- not 8mm. The adjustment sequence is the same; lift height for both feed should be the same.

Edited March 15, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

O.k., more adjustments made and after feedback by another belt maker I changed to a 25 needle and switched to 277 on the top and 207 on the bottom. Here is a test of double layer 7 oz veg tan, free handing and practicing turning the corner. Five stitches per inch. There is some marking of the leather by the new open toe presser foot -- I plan to slightly ease and polish the edges and bottom of this foot. 

Criticism/critique is welcome. What do you think of what the Beast is producing at this point? Is it ready for prime time?

Here is the bottom stitch.

 

Here is the top stitch.

Edited March 25, 2016 by llucas

[llucas]

The above photos are not great. Here is a better angle to see stitch placement. The stitches are above the surface as the presser foot does not have a ridge to press the stitch level, but on any project I do there will be a groove/crease for the stitch line.

Again, your observations or criticisms are welcome. Is the Beast far enough along to risk sewing a belt on it? Or is it not quite ready? What adjustment would you do differently to improve the aesthetics of the stitch? It is difficult for me to judge as I prefer the look of the hand stitching I have used until now.

 

Edited March 25, 2016 by llucas