steveleather Report post Posted March 8, 2016 After researching quite a bit I am still Very undecided on what model machine I should choose. I have a variety of leather from 8/9 oz veg tan to 1 oz lining leather. I would like to use the machine for belts, wallets , holsters, vests, chaps, bags, upholstery etc so my projects vary. I was leaning towards a heavy duty such as the cobra class 4 but fear it's too heavy duty for thinner leathers and other fabric. Any opinions on whether I should choose a heavy duty like the cobra, or should I choose a med duty style. Keeping in mind I would like to see two layers of 8/9 oz veg tan and also desire the ability to sew reverse, edges of wet molded holsters so need to be able to sew in close quarters And want a servo motor Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sonydaze Report post Posted March 8, 2016 I'm not optimistic that you will find one machine to encompass all of your sewing needs well. You probably need to think about two machines or prioritize what is most important for you to sew and get a machine that does that part well. Servo motors are great, if the machine(s) you get don't have them already, it is easy to change them over from a clutch motor. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveleather Report post Posted March 8, 2016 Thank you, thats my struggle I wish there was one that did all but have come to realize I will probably need 2 Thank you, thats my struggle I wish there was one that did all but have come to realize I will probably need 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dikman Report post Posted March 8, 2016 Sonydaze is right, there is no "one size fits all" when it comes to sewing machines. Edges of holsters can be pretty thick, depending on style, and need a bit of grunt to get through, as well as suitable clearance under the feet. A machine that can do that is going have trouble with light material. Looking at what you want to do, I would think a heavy duty flat bed and a lighter cylinder arm might do, but I'm sure other, more experienced users should be able to be more specific. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveleather Report post Posted March 8, 2016 Ok thank you both, this seems to be the consenses Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikesc Report post Posted March 8, 2016 (edited) I would think a heavy duty flat bed and a lighter cylinder arm might do,I'm certainly not "more experienced" compared to many ( allright ..almost everyone here ) here ..But I'd have thought that was a typo.. "heavy duty flatbed" ? Surely a "heavy duty cylinder arm" walking foot( punch through almost anything, and handle any shapes, and can have "table" added ) and a "medium weight flat bed"..walking foot.. ( for "garments" and simple "non enclosed" stuff like medium weight belts etc )..? How often would you need to punch through half to three quarters of and inch ( or more ) on a flatbed..? I run leather garments ( prototypes ) on flat beds ( one industrial compound feed, and one "heavy domestic double feed"..and another industrial flatbed doublefeed)..and am in the market for a heavy cylinder arm compound feed ( again for prototypes )..Plus..I just bought a patcher ( 29K51 ).. ( I blame Constabulary for the latter;) ) Just because..and it is the subliminal effect of reading his "sig"..or that is what I told my wife Edited March 8, 2016 by mikesc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sonydaze Report post Posted March 8, 2016 You might want to go though the different items that you want to sew and evaluate what machine would be best for each of them...hopefully a pattern will evolve that shows you what what type and how heavy to buy. Over time I have ended up with 5 different machines that I use frequently and 5 more different types that I use occasionally. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brmax Report post Posted March 9, 2016 I have some of the same considerations, with some flatbeds running 92. So what comes to mind for me is thread change, and that's if the machine will use it "easily". I find the cylinder arms will for the most part or any with shuttle will use many larger sizes, I think as a green horn anyway. But how much of a pain is tension setting and really! can the hd springs ease off enough for say 92 for doing some other task I do. That's where I'm at and seriously interested in your great question, I think it can be a universal question for cyl or flat bed machines. great question Floyd Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pcox Report post Posted March 9, 2016 Cowboy 3200 & consew 1206rb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveleather Report post Posted March 9, 2016 Ok Yes i have samples to test. This question is totally Blind there may be a thread already but what are pros and cons of cylinder bed vs post bed Ok Yes i have samples to test. This question is totally Blind there may be a thread already but what are pros and cons of cylinder bed vs post bed Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveleather Report post Posted March 9, 2016 Pcox, funny u mention that I have those two specific models written down as potential candidates Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dikman Report post Posted March 9, 2016 Mikesc, you're quite right. It's not a typo, though, 'cos that's how my brain was working when I wrote it (!), but I must admit that afterwards it occurred to me that doing a thick holster edge on a flatbed would be difficult if the work had a curve in it, like a Western holster. So yes, a heavy duty cylinder arm and a light-medium flat bed makes more sense (and even a lightweight straight stitcher could be useful at times). Hmm, that's three, perhaps I'd better shut up! Steve, no comparison between the two! Most of the post beds that I've seen have a roller wheel instead of a presser foot, and you really want a walking foot for leather work. Post beds are probably more specialized than cylinder arms (shoe uppers, hat bands etc) and tend to run lighter thread. In my (limited) experience mine doesn't like thick leather at all! Stick to a cylinder arm. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveleather Report post Posted March 9, 2016 What about presser feet leaving marks, do people stick with smooth feet I feel veg tan could be ruined potentially Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nascenta Report post Posted March 9, 2016 (edited) Hi all. I've arrived at the same place in my research. I'm going to do what dikman has suggested. I am buying an old singer 31-47 as my straight stitcher (picking it up Saturday for $300 cnd) and then acquire a cylinder arm when i can afford it. There is a pfaff 335 in my area that has tempted me but at $1900 cnd, I can't swing it! The driver for these purchases is a wife who is tired of me testing the limits of her beloved Bernina 801 and a small budget. PS. This forum has great people. Thank you one and all. Your posts have been a godsend for my decision making. Edited March 9, 2016 by nascenta Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brmax Report post Posted March 9, 2016 (edited) Its not in any way an easy decision it requires a choice, and we all either new or seasoned leather workers will do or have did it. Focusing on shuttle style as again, never put one in my hand, I see 69-415 and 69-277 this adjustment is great but no matter to change thread requires tension and possibly hook adjustment. I'm thinking flat beds here so correct me please if hook is not generally adjusted and where in the range can I be free of it. Where I was heading there is the long and short arm is only a choice for length for projects and I really need to select leather weights or make a tension change. ( basically, I understand leather conditions can be optimized with experience ) I'm really where a cylinder arm is needed but choosing between beneficial use in my present work or more in some desired leather work. For example using 92 thread and changing to 277 for next day needs and then back following day, I'm confident I can do it just haven't yet so a tip here can help. Hope not to screw up the thread here or jack it all up, making the choice with a bit more knowledge sure makes it easier for myself. Good day there Floyd Edited March 9, 2016 by brmax Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizcrafts Report post Posted March 10, 2016 What about presser feet leaving marks, do people stick with smooth feet I feel veg tan could be ruined potentially No matter what the brand and transport mechanism, narrow presser feet will always leave a more visible track than a wider set. This is the physics of downward pressure applied to differing surface areas. Further, if the presser and alternating feet on a walking foot machine have sharp squared bottom edges, the tracks are more obvious than a set that is chamfered and buffed to a shine. Hard leather is more resistant than soft top grain leather is to marking from the feet. Dry is more resistant than moist leather. What can be done to reduce the marking on top? Use the smallest needle and thread that gets the job sewn properly. Bonded nylon and polyester thread is rated in pounds of pull before it breaks. If you are sewing a wallet, you can do it with 11 pound test #69 bonded nylon thread, using a #18 leather point needle. You could also choose to use #138 thread and a #23 needle, requiring much higher overall tension and foot pressure. Sure, it looks more impressive. But, it takes more ergs of energy to get it done. So, by using the least good size of thread and needle you can also reduce the thread tensions and the foot pressure. Less marking, but still well stitched. QED. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dfrensdorff Report post Posted March 10, 2016 I was in your same boat ........ bought the Cowboy 3200 ...... a very nice machine that worked perfectly for wallets, spur straps, belts, guitar straps and the like......I did have a need for a flat bed for as I make waxed canvas and leather tool rolls......ended up with a Ferdco 206HL (which is essentially the same machine as a Consew 206RB) ....... I know you are looking for one machine that will fit the bill for everything, but not sure it exists...you will be sacrificing something on either end of the spectrum.........Don Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveleather Report post Posted March 11, 2016 How about the Cb227R Medium Weight Sewing Machine Cylind... A company rep suggested this, how does this machine weigh in Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizcrafts Report post Posted March 11, 2016 How about the Cb227R Medium Weight Sewing Machine Cylind... A company rep suggested this, how does this machine weigh in This has a standard compound feed walking foot mechanism. It sews firm materials ranging from about 2 ounces up to about 24 ounces, with thread sizes 69 through 138. The seller may be able to tweak the shuttle clearances to let it clear #207 thread. This would probably make it sloppy and iffy with smaller thread. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Brosowski Report post Posted March 13, 2016 The 31 is great for the light work and is the second best flat bed Singer built - the 42-5 is the best.For heavier work with thicker thread a CB3200 or CB4500 is the other machine you need.Sewing machines are like any other tool - no one tool does all jobs - so you need more than one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
