making patterns with the computer

[David Bright]

Hello everyone,

First let me start by buttering y'all up. I have browsed the forum looking for an answer to my question and found none - but I have seen some some nice work! So it was time well spent.

Alright, my question;

Does anyone know of vector cliparts of stamping tool impressions that can be used to make stamping designs on the computer?

I am not a leather worker but I do make leather bags, that is to say that I design them and have them made. I work with four toolers who do really nice work but they are always asking me to come up with designs for the stamping patterns.

I have taken a few impressions and made them into vector art and been able to come up with some pretty cool designs in a few minutes. But I shudder at thinking about doing this for the hundreds (thousands?) of tools out there. So I am looking for any repository to get the digital art for free or to buy.

Otherwise, it's going to be a lot of time to create them... :-( so sad I know.

Which brings me to the next part - IF there isn't anything like this now, do y'all think there is any interest in purchasing such a collection IF I were to make it?

Thanks in advance for any response at all.

Dave

[MatthewD]

Are you talking like using a CNC machine to make the dies? So say I wanted a particular Celtic pattern for borders then I could make it in Illustrator and you could make the die?

[David Genadek]

David,

I have been playing with doing it in a Nurbs program namly Rhino 3d. I work with a guy who is really good on the program, Frank Woll and I have had him show me how to draw flowers but the notion of being able to twist and turn things easily is still a bit beyond the current technology. Frank can crank out a flower stem and leaves in about two minutes but for me I draw it faster on paper. It would be nice to have for altering designs on size runs of things though. It is on my when I have time list.

Another program that will probable end up being the one for this kind of work will be Moi3d. This is being done by the guy that invented Rhino. He didn't like the direction they were going in, too CAD oriented, so he went to work for Microsoft now he is back working on his original vision for a 3d drawing program.

The thing about computers technology though is that it can't replace knowing how to do it. If you get good at drawing manually then going to the computer could yield some great results. When people start carving the next step is to try to create a design so they clip and paste and patch something together. In my mind there is a process that should be followed if your drawing manually and the same process should be followed if you are drawing on the computer. I learned the process from Bob Brown who also taught this to Al Stohlmann. It is a simple process that really frees your creativity but for some reason no one has gotten it in a book yet, well Bob devoted a few pages to it in what was probable the original pattern pack. I expect it is not getting out there because it would make it so easy for people to make thier own designs that sales of patterns would go out the window.

David Genadek

[David Bright]

David,

I have been playing with doing it in a Nurbs program namly Rhino 3d. I work with a guy who is really good on the program, Frank Woll and I have had him show me how to draw flowers but the notion of being able to twist and turn things easily is still a bit beyond the current technology. Frank can crank out a flower stem and leaves in about two minutes but for me I draw it faster on paper. It would be nice to have for altering designs on size runs of things though. It is on my when I have time list.

Another program that will probable end up being the one for this kind of work will be Moi3d. This is being done by the guy that invented Rhino. He didn't like the direction they were going in, too CAD oriented, so he went to work for Microsoft now he is back working on his original vision for a 3d drawing program.

The thing about computers technology though is that it can't replace knowing how to do it. If you get good at drawing manually then going to the computer could yield some great results. When people start carving the next step is to try to create a design so they clip and paste and patch something together. In my mind there is a process that should be followed if your drawing manually and the same process should be followed if you are drawing on the computer. I learned the process from Bob Brown who also taught this to Al Stohlmann. It is a simple process that really frees your creativity but for some reason no one has gotten it in a book yet, well Bob devoted a few pages to it in what was probable the original pattern pack. I expect it is not getting out there because it would make it so easy for people to make thier own designs that sales of patterns would go out the window.

David Genadek

Actually all I am talking about is having cliparts that are done to the same size as a tool. Say that you have a basketweave impression tool where the size is 1/4x3/8ths. All I want is that impression as a digital file so I can use it to make a basketweave pattern on the computer. The tooler will still have to actually do the tooling with all the talent and skill that comes with it. All I do is suggest the pattern by being able to do it on the computer.

I want to make sure that you understand that i am not talking about the patterns for the pieces but instead the paterns for decoration. Nor am I talking about things like floral carving. Just the stamping tools.

here is an example of a something I did to illustrate the point. I traced a shell impression using the trace feature of Corel. As you can see it's not very good but it does make the point. The new image - the shell impression - can be now placed where ever I want in any direction. It can be stretched and skewed as well but I won't do that because it's important to work to exact sizes of the tools in order to give the toolers a pattern that they can reproduce accurately.

They say everything is created twice - one in the mind and once in reality, but the mind comes first. Personally, I have more ideas than ability to fulfill them. My tooling skills are rudimentary because I don't have the patience it takes to master the intricacies. For some reason however the toolers I work with are often stymied for ideas when I challenge them to create for me. I look at their sets of tools and visions of cool patterns play in my mind like a movie. But when I try and draw it or convey it on paper to them it never comes out as clearly as I see it in my mind.

I am thinking that this set of digital stamps so to speak would allow me the ability to show them exactly what I see.

well, I guess that no one knows of any thing already existing, unless they exist as part of the software mentioned. So I am going to try and find some folks to take on the grunt work of converting the real impressions to digital form for us designers who can't stamp a straight line.

Thank you all.

Are you talking like using a CNC machine to make the dies? So say I wanted a particular Celtic pattern for borders then I could make it in Illustrator and you could make the die?

No, I am talking about having the tool impressions as clipart files so that I can design stamping patterns on the computer. I use Corel Draw and what I would like to be able to do is to select from a set of digital stamps that correspond exactly to real stamps in order to design a pattern on my bags.

Then I give the toolers the design and they then know what to do and can embellish it or modify it according to their particular interpretation of what I want.

[william]

I love your idea and think this would be an added help to puting patterns together easier. Any thing I can help you with let me know.

[wolvenstien]

The best thing I can think of is to get a Tandy or HideCrafters catalog, and scan the pages with the impressions of the tools and then edit the scan to cut it up into individual pictures of each impression. Then with each in a folder, open your graphix program, and use each pic (saved as gif or jpg) and create your design from there. Some of the impressions you would have to crop real close, but using the impressions I would imagine you could make a decent design on the computer... It would take some time cropping each impression out of the scan and saving each one individually, but I think it might be worth it....

Since I have thought of this... I think I am going to do it myself to add some "leatherwork" to my website background....

Good luck

[David Bright]

The best thing I can think of is to get a Tandy or HideCrafters catalog, and scan the pages with the impressions of the tools and then edit the scan to cut it up into individual pictures of each impression. Then with each in a folder, open your graphix program, and use each pic (saved as gif or jpg) and create your design from there. Some of the impressions you would have to crop real close, but using the impressions I would imagine you could make a decent design on the computer... It would take some time cropping each impression out of the scan and saving each one individually, but I think it might be worth it....

Since I have thought of this... I think I am going to do it myself to add some "leatherwork" to my website background....

Good luck

That's sort of the way I thought to do it. Except that we will recreate the impression using the curve tools in Corel Draw and then make sure it is the exact size of the original. This way it will act just like a stamp with no background to it and the color can be anything one wants.

The example I gave above was done using an image from a website that I put into a trace program CorelTrace, and rendered after playing with the settings for a few minutes. It would be nice if that worked well but as you can see the resulting impression isn't really close to the real seashell impression. So the best way to do it is by hand which shouldn't take to long per for anyone who is pretty good with the curve tools in Corel or similar programs.

Sooooooo - perhaps we could have a library here to post such images for others to use. No idea. I tried to attach a cmx file which is corel draw's clipart format and I couldn't. That's not a surprise because most forums don't allow much more than standard file formats. Anyway, thanks for the input. I'll see you all in a few weeks when I have accumulated some cliparts.

[Johanna]

An art library for members is a very good idea. Everyone would have to agree not to post trademarked images, and that whatever original designs they share could be freely used. David, I can override the attavhment settings and incluse a bmx file. Please send it to me at admin@leatherworker.net and I will post it on your topic.

Johanna

[JustWakinUp]

David,

The idea is great and I can only add a graphic designers tilt to this.

The idea of taking the images from a tandy catalog is excellent.

Once you've pulled those images into whichever program you use

I would trace those images and save as a brush or define it as a pattern.

That way when you wanted to fill a background you could just put that

on it's own layer use the fill tool then select the pattern you defined

et voila. I use adobe products for all my graphics work so I can't speak

for Corel Draw. I would have to assume they all have the same tools, maybe

called something different and located somewhere different within each individual

program.

I could be down the wrong path in helping but here are a few examples.

The Pattern created

The Pattern Applied to selected area of image.

Hopefully this helps you.

[David Bright]

Making a brush of the clipart patterns is the next step. What I am doing right now is making the building blocks for this. I have someone making vector cliparts of all the tools in the Tandy catalog. Tracing them manually so as to get as close to the real impression as possible. When this is done we will have set of digital tools that can be used to play with patterns. Any patterns that are created can then also be made into brushes for easy fills on selected areas.

I am really excited about this and even more excited to show you all the work that comes out when I design the patterns and a talented tooler does them.

[Johanna]

The possibilities of using this technology to create patterns is exciting- please keep us informed!

JustWakinUp- I can't believe Tandy has never thought of doing geometric CraftAids! It would be one way to get basketweave designs with guidelines, and make quilting patterns a snap.

I'm not familiar with Corel Draw either, and I know Adobe has more features than I know how to use, but even I can create patterns like this, so I don't think this is too much of a stretch for leatherworkers.

Keep talking, guys, I'm listening!

Johanna

(the tech side of me has my head spinning with ideas!)

[candyleather]

The trick is get a plastic sheet similar to the craftaids for to print the computer desing and get your own craftaid. Does anybody know the name of that plastic and the way of made a plastic craftaid?

[Johanna]

X,

http://www.leatherworker.net/forum/index.p...=findpost&p=289

Johanna

[candyleather]

X,

http://www.leatherworker.net/forum/index.p...=findpost&p=289

Johanna

:flowers: Thanks Johanna!!! I wrote them an e-mail, if I get more info I'll post here.

[Nixon66]

I just came across this thread so I thought I might refresh it and add my two cents. There is a free shareware vector graphics program that I found and came highly recommended called INKSCAPE. You can Google it and find several locations to download it. I have had great success doing line drawing for all kinds of things, but the latest being patterns for leatherwork.

I would show examples but I'm having trouble showing the .svg files in anything except the originating program.

[howardb]

Brilliant concept David. I recently visited both the Hide Crafters and Tandy home stores in Fort Worth, TX. Nice folks. Try contacting them directly & see if they have CAD files of the tools. If so, it's plausible for them to be squished & exported as line art. My guess is that very little, if any, already exist in CAD, but it's probably worth an e-mail. There are other toolmakers out there too, like Barry King, so getting a complete library is likely going to take time!

Regards,

Brent

[TimDreamer]

Bump!! This was two years ago, has any progress been made?

[TomBanwell]

I would think you could just use the tools to make an impression on leather, then scan them. In Corel Draw (similar to Inkscape) you can easily change the scanned jpg into a vector file, and within CorelDraw or Illustrator or Inkscape you could manipulate the individual vectors into a finished design.

[Aahran]

Tandy now has an iPod app that is a start on what you're looking for. They only have a few tools available right now, but they are planning more.

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/tandy/id401656166

[Toastie]

Looks good tinkering with it now

[EmbossingDieCompany]

I just ran across this thread......this concept is fairly easy to do.

I went to Tandy's website, downloaded a few stamp pictures, cropped them and then you can manipulate them any way you want to create your design......then convert it to outlines and print. Obviously you need a CorelDraw, Illustrator or Inkscape to do this.

[TwinOaks]

This very interesting thread has been reawkened, and now I'm curious...I checked out the Tandy app, and it apparently no longer exists...at least, the app store doesn't find it. Any app writers wanna volunteer to jump on this?

[Cyberthrasher]

This very interesting thread has been reawkened, and now I'm curious...I checked out the Tandy app, and it apparently no longer exists...at least, the app store doesn't find it. Any app writers wanna volunteer to jump on this?

Several months back I had a computer programmer living with me and we were working on doing this, mostly for an Android app. But, he got behind in school work and we dropped it. I had no idea this thread even existed at the time. Basically what we wanted to do was get some of the basic tool images to be able to design patterns on a phone or tablet. I had found the Tandy app mentioned (no idea if it's still available, but it was at the time), but nothing for Android - so I didn't want to be left out. Keep in mind, I AM NOT a programmer at all - really the only aspect of IT work that I don't do, my Achilles heal when I want to do stuff like this.

[stingray4540]

I would definitely be interested if anyone ever accomplished this! Dissapointing that 6 years would go by and no one has done it.

I would love to be able to create a pattern on the computer, then do all the stamping/carving/coloring on it. This way I can see if my idea in my head actually looks good in practice!

[Scott Ebersole]

The possibilities of using this technology to create patterns is exciting- please keep us informed!

JustWakinUp- I can't believe Tandy has never thought of doing geometric CraftAids! It would be one way to get basketweave designs with guidelines, and make quilting patterns a snap.

I'm not familiar with Corel Draw either, and I know Adobe has more features than I know how to use, but even I can create patterns like this, so I don't think this is too much of a stretch for leatherworkers.

Keep talking, guys, I'm listening!

Johanna

(the tech side of me has my head spinning with ideas!)

I create my own stamps using CorelDraw X6 and then I use my Epilog Laser to cut them into 1" nylon rod. The results are wonderful.Works great when you can't find the right stamp. If I new how to put a picture in here I could show you a picture of a stamp I made and the results in leather.