make wax

[Xig]

hi

I want to make my leather wax with beeswax, paraffin, olive oil and coconut butter but I don't know their ratios (for solid, semi-solid and liquid wax). please guide me.

[Tugadude]

Here's one take on it:

 

https://colorglo.com/restoration-blog/how-to-make-beeswax-leather-polish-conditioner

[Dwight]

If you make this containing olive oil or almond oil . . . please understand that in time the product will go rancid and have to be thrown out.

The reason is the oils you use.  They are plant based oils . . . and will eventually rot, go rancid, stink . . . and make your product useless.

The one oil that does not do that is neatsfoot oil.  I have products made with neatsfoot oil that are over 10 years old . . . have never had a problem with it.

I use natural bees wax that I personally took from my bee hives . . . and I use the more expensive 100% neatsfoot oil (not the cheap neatsfoot oil compound that contains other oils).

I put them together in a jar . . . put the jar in a pan of boiling water . . . let them melt together . . . give it a couple stirs . . . pour it out into muffin papers.

I use a scale and make it exactly a 1 to 1 ratio by weight.  Adding a little more oil makes it softer . . . adding a little more wax makes it harder.

Because my wax comes straight out of the bee hive . . . it has a slight honey smell to it.

May God bless,

Dwight

[Tugadude]

Dwight makes a great point.  Nobody wants to invest time in making something that will go bad before you use it all up.  So pay attention to his recommendation.

So in this case, it is OK to not mind your own beeswax.

[ScottWolf]

2 hours ago, Dwight said:

If you make this containing olive oil or almond oil . . . please understand that in time the product will go rancid and have to be thrown out.

The reason is the oils you use.  They are plant based oils . . . and will eventually rot, go rancid, stink . . . and make your product useless.

The one oil that does not do that is neatsfoot oil.  I have products made with neatsfoot oil that are over 10 years old . . . have never had a problem with it.

 

May God bless,

Dwight

There is a good deal of urban myth/misinformation in your post that bears clarification. I see the term "rancid" thrown around a lot when it comes to conditioners and leather. There are many others on the inter webs who parrot this information, and it tends to cause some confusion as to what really is and more importantly ISN'T a concern.

 

In the context of leather and use of products on and or in the processing/manufacturing of leather the term "rancid" refers to when the substance itself OXIDIZES. The oxidation of the substance is what leads to degradation and or untimely breakdown of a leather product. Now, everything used on/in leather products will/does change chemically at some point, this includes those commercially available products that people religious stand by while denouncing the ingredients that are actually in their favorite product. A way of preventing and or mitigating that chemical change is to use things like preservatives and or emulsifiers, be it a chemical and or a natural occurring product. All of which can and are used in leather care products. I won't get into the types of chemicals used, as that's a bit involved and beyond what most people can make in their kitchens. However, natural ingredients, like Beeswax, Vitamin E and products high in Vitamin E (Etc, etc, etc) can both serve as a preservatives and or emulsifiers that retard and or prevent substances from oxidizing as they normally would and in some cases prevent it outright. 

Case in point, neatsfoot oil is a tried and true "go to" substance used by leather crafters for centuries, I doubt many would disagree with that statement. HOWEVER, neatsfoot oil is a horrible product in the long term as it OXIDIZES terribly in leather (especially if over used) and causes that super hard and dried out looking leather that we've all seen in older leather products that haven't been properly cared for. This is also why, those who are wise in its use, always caution to use it sparingly and not over use it on leather products. A good example, LEXOL leather conditioner IS Neatsfoot oil, you can see the MSDS on their website that states as much, if you doubt me. That bottle of LEXOL liquid that some people swear by is approx 5-10% neatsfoot oil and 80% is WATER and any of the remaining ingredients are chemical preservatives and or emulsifiers to allow oil and water to mix and retard oxidation. 

So while every substance used in leather care out there has a varying IV ( iodine value), some of which are low (coconut oil for example) and some quite high, which pertains to the concern about oxidation, when used in combination with things like Beeswax, vitamin E, emulsifiers, etc ( or chemical equivalents), these concerns are mitigated, if not outright negated. It should go without saying (CPT Obvious moment) that if you use these substances without the other substances mentioned, that you may very well encounter problems with them oxidizing and causing problems in your leather products, especially if over used, on your leather.  

Lastly, this is not me or my opinion on the internet, it's summarized information based in Science and Chemistry that I invite everyone to research for themselves, as I have done, as it is quite interesting and eye opening in what has been used in the past and is being used now in the process of making/manufacturing leather and its maintenance/conditioning afterwards. The easiest way to start is to pull up some of the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheets) for popular commercially available products and go to section 3 on the document, where you will see what is used in those products and or the approx ratios of each substance to one another. In some cases it can be like seeing the man behind the curtain when it becomes apparent that things like Olive oil, Almond Oil, Safflower oil, mineral oil, etc, all the ingredients that people purport as being "bad" for leather on forums like these, are actually used in those very same commercially available products. 

 

[Dwight]

21 minutes ago, ScottWolf said:

There is a good deal of urban myth/misinformation in your post that bears clarification. I see the term "rancid" thrown around a lot when it comes to conditioners and leather. There are many others on the inter webs who parrot this information, and it tends to cause some confusion as to what really is and more importantly ISN'T a concern.

 

In the context of leather and use of products on and or in the processing/manufacturing of leather the term "rancid" refers to when the substance itself OXIDIZES. The oxidation of the substance is what leads to degradation and or untimely breakdown of a leather product. Now, everything used on/in leather products will/does change chemically at some point, this includes those commercially available products that people religious stand by while denouncing the ingredients that are actually in their favorite product. A way of preventing and or mitigating that chemical change is to use things like preservatives and or emulsifiers, be it a chemical and or a natural occurring product. All of which can and are used in leather care products. I won't get into the types of chemicals used, as that's a bit involved and beyond what most people can make in their kitchens. However, natural ingredients, like Beeswax, Vitamin E and products high in Vitamin E (Etc, etc, etc) can both serve as a preservatives and or emulsifiers that retard and or prevent substances from oxidizing as they normally would and in some cases prevent it outright. 

Case in point, neatsfoot oil is a tried and true "go to" substance used by leather crafters for centuries, I doubt many would disagree with that statement. HOWEVER, neatsfoot oil is a horrible product in the long term as it OXIDIZES terribly in leather (especially if over used) and causes that super hard and dried out looking leather that we've all seen in older leather products that haven't been properly cared for. This is also why, those who are wise in its use, always caution to use it sparingly and not over use it on leather products. A good example, LEXOL leather conditioner IS Neatsfoot oil, you can see the MSDS on their website that states as much, if you doubt me. That bottle of LEXOL liquid that some people swear by is approx 5-10% neatsfoot oil and 80% is WATER and any of the remaining ingredients are chemical preservatives and or emulsifiers to allow oil and water to mix and retard oxidation. 

So while every substance used in leather care out there has a varying IV ( iodine value), some of which are low (coconut oil for example) and some quite high, which pertains to the concern about oxidation, when used in combination with things like Beeswax, vitamin E, emulsifiers, etc ( or chemical equivalents), these concerns are mitigated, if not outright negated. It should go without saying (CPT Obvious moment) that if you use these substances without the other substances mentioned, that you may very well encounter problems with them oxidizing and causing problems in your leather products, especially if over used, on your leather.  

Lastly, this is not me or my opinion on the internet, it's summarized information based in Science and Chemistry that I invite everyone to research for themselves, as I have done, as it is quite interesting and eye opening in what has been used in the past and is being used now in the process of making/manufacturing leather and its maintenance/conditioning afterwards. The easiest way to start is to pull up some of the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheets) for popular commercially available products and go to section 3 on the document, where you will see what is used in those products and or the approx ratios of each substance to one another. In some cases it can be like seeing the man behind the curtain when it becomes apparent that things like Olive oil, Almond Oil, Safflower oil, mineral oil, etc, all the ingredients that people purport as being "bad" for leather on forums like these, are actually used in those very same commercially available products. 

 

Well excuse me Dr. Fauci . . . sorry if I offended your "follow the science".

Science is good . . . so far it has give us three immunization programs that seem to kill a few folks every now and then who only took the medicine.

Science also allowed a rocket to blow up after launch back in 1986 killing the school teacher riding aboard.

Both are unintended.  AND . . . making your own leather conditioner may have "unintended" consequences.  I simply attempted to warn someone who may not have known about the "possibility" of unintended consequences . . . and possibly help them avoid a situation they did not envision.

But of course . . . you and the Lone Ranger rode in to save them from my layman's helpful warning . . . so good of you to do so.

May God bless,

Dwight

[chuck123wapati]

just from personal experience, We had a very stringent chemical program at the prison i used to work in. Oils were one of them and aerosols oil products a strict nono. So in an effort to keep the equipment in the kitchens lubed up the inmates would use vegetable cooking oils including olive among others. I can tell you in a few months vegetable oils dry and turn to a hard rubbery glue like  substance that requires solvents to remove, it didn't smell to bad so not really rancid but there may be other traits not so good for leather that we need to think about also. I 'm not putting veg oils of any kind on my leather, I've spent far to many hours cleaning it off of stuff. I prefer time tested products and i have tested them for most of my 62 years  i have leather products that are 40 years old. i cant see much in history books about using the vegetable oils, I'm sure they did at some point but why they aren't the goto from days gone by has to cause some question about their use in leather work. 

[ScottWolf]

21 minutes ago, Dwight said:

Well excuse me Dr. Fauci . . . sorry if I offended your "follow the science".

Science is good . . . so far it has give us three immunization programs that seem to kill a few folks every now and then who only took the medicine.

Science also allowed a rocket to blow up after launch back in 1986 killing the school teacher riding aboard.

Both are unintended.  AND . . . making your own leather conditioner may have "unintended" consequences.  I simply attempted to warn someone who may not have known about the "possibility" of unintended consequences . . . and possibly help them avoid a situation they did not envision.

But of course . . . you and the Lone Ranger rode in to save them from my layman's helpful warning . . . so good of you to do so.

May God bless,

Dwight

Take a deep breath, it isn't a personal attack against you, it's clarification on a commonly repeated rationalization to not use a substance on leather.

[ScottWolf]

8 minutes ago, chuck123wapati said:

just from personal experience, We had a very stringent chemical program at the prison i used to work in. Oils were one of them and aerosols oil products a strict nono. So in an effort to keep the equipment in the kitchens lubed up the inmates would use vegetable cooking oils including olive among others. I can tell you in a few months vegetable oils dry and turn to a hard rubbery glue like  substance that requires solvents to remove, it didn't smell to bad so not really rancid but there may be other traits not so good for leather that we need to think about also. I 'm not putting veg oils of any kind on my leather, I've spent far to many hours cleaning it off of stuff. I prefer time tested products and i have tested them for most of my 62 years  i have leather products that are 40 years old. i cant see much in history books about using the vegetable oils, I'm sure they did at some point but why they aren't the goto from days gone by has to cause some question about their use in leather work. 

Chuck, great example of what I mentioned above about the effects of oxidation and the concerns about using a substance by itself without other substances like preservatives and or emulsifiers to prevent/retard oxidation.

[fredk]

I. I have personal experience of using a vegetable oil on leather and the leather started to stink after a few months. Also the leather started to show signs of rot, very mild signs. The vegetable oil was put on at the customer's insistence. I had to remake the item for him and boy, did he pay for it! After 10 years of  everyday use that second item was still fine. It was finished off with my beeswax & nfo mix. In the early days of my leather working I did use vegie oil on some items but they did begin to smell different after a few months

2. I have never had any leather item go hard and dry after using pure neets foot oil

But I've only been doing this leather making lark for some 20 odd years so what do I know, except my experiences