Skivers

[toxo]

3 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

I highly doubt there will be a switch to just change over. First see if they provide any manual to advise the air pressure requirement. I would not go with the air driven set up unless you only intend to do short runs occasionally. As far as the feet go there are a lot available but I would be getting a roller foot version pretty early as I do almost any thing I want with a roller foot with the least problems. One of the dealers here has agreed to pay me some $ to do up a manual with pictures on how to set up and use these 801 type skiving machines which I will probably finish by March or April 22. Most of the manuals out there are not very helpful I am sorry to say. This here link if you check will show some of the feet available (you can see in my youtubes where I made one like the number 18 fit up and I would get the number 20 in case it was any better. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33049213271.html

Get a whole lot of scrap leather and take notes as you trial. (make sure you get a dressing stick for removing the burr occasionally inside the bell)

Let me know when you have it in hand

Thanks Brian. I plan on picking it up on Tuesday. There are a lot of 801 vids on YT but they don't seem to go beyond the basics. For example the angle of the sharpen as the stone wears down or doesn't it matter? I don't suppose it'll come with a stone dresser. Thanks for the link. Looks like spares are not hard to find.

The only reference I can find for the "Eagle" brand is in London so that might be good. I'll call them tomorrow. Hopefully they'll have some info on the vacuum side.

It won't be getting a lot of use so maybe a cheap compressor will be a cheaper option than changing to an electric motor.

 

[RockyAussie]

12 hours ago, toxo said:

For example the angle of the sharpen as the stone wears down or doesn't it matter?

It does matter and thankfully a lot of these machines have an adjustment underneath to move the stone back a little if need be. The width of blade angle you can see should be around 5mm wide or a bit more if possible. The wider bevel makes it less of a problem to get thicker leather to to pass through. If it is too short it will jam up more often and the feed stone will have trouble pushing it through.

With the machine head opened back you can see me undoing the 12mm bolt to move the stone back in order to achieve a wider skive bevel.

This pic shows the shaft is now fully back.

[AzShooter]

I just did a bag using a hand Skiver.  That's a lot of work.  If I get to the point where I'm making a bunch I guess I'll have to get a machine.

Watching this thread is helping me decide which machine will work.

[toxo]

6 hours ago, AzShooter said:

I just did a bag using a hand Skiver.  That's a lot of work.  If I get to the point where I'm making a bunch I guess I'll have to get a machine.

Watching this thread is helping me decide which machine will work.

Is why I'm buying this one. Doing it by hand is time consuming, inconsistent and easy to make a mistake especially on soft chrome tan.

[toxo]

10 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

It does matter and thankfully a lot of these machines have an adjustment underneath to move the stone back a little if need be. The width of blade angle you can see should be around 5mm wide or a bit more if possible. The wider bevel makes it less of a problem to get thicker leather to to pass through. If it is too short it will jam up more often and the feed stone will have trouble pushing it through.

With the machine head opened back you can see me undoing the 12mm bolt to move the stone back in order to achieve a wider skive bevel.

This pic shows the shaft is now fully back.

Great info as usual Brian. On the vacuum side, you got me thinking about sparks in the bag. Maybe it has an air driven impeller to avoid that. Thinking about the feed roller, I've noticed there are different types, is there a preference for thinner leather? The one I'm getting was apparently used by an upholstery firm so should be ok. Also I watched one video that said the carborundum feed stone is used to take the burrs off the inside of the knife, that's not right is it?

[RockyAussie]

10 hours ago, toxo said:

Great info as usual Brian. On the vacuum side, you got me thinking about sparks in the bag. Maybe it has an air driven impeller to avoid that. Thinking about the feed roller, I've noticed there are different types, is there a preference for thinner leather? The one I'm getting was apparently used by an upholstery firm so should be ok. Also I watched one video that said the carborundum feed stone is used to take the burrs off the inside of the knife, that's not right is it?

The second drum thing after the impeller may be a spark arrester? There are quite a few different feed roller versions. In the stone versions you have a fine ,medium and course grit to choose from and I would suggest that the medium is what I would start with. The fine grit is not great at picking up and pulling through medium to heavy weight leathers and the course is more liable to have soft leather stick to it and wrap around. This link from Campbell Randall shows quite a few of the possible types - https://www.campbell-randall.com/shop/fav-fratelli-alberti

The rubber feed  types can be good on soft stuff but if you accidentally have the feed roll touch the bell blade it will cut right in and that's the end of that one. Had that happen. The steel fluted ones can be good on heavy weight leather but can leave a ripple up and down look and again if it touches the bell knife ......not good. As a general practice using the feed stone to clean up the burrs inside the bell after a sharpen is not normal except if for some reason you have had to grind out a large chip from the blade and there is a heavy burr inside the bell. I do it when I sharpen a bell for the first time but rarely after that. You do NOT want to do this and end up with any bevel inside the bell as it will make getting a predictable skive near impossible. The leather will dive downward. Cleaning the burr off with a stone tipped dressing stick is the normal practice and only takes a few seconds of pressure. There should be a brass dish shaped deflector in the bell which should be set about 15mm in from the edge, this you have to careful not to touch with the dressing stick when you are cleaning up any burrs.

When you have it in hand I would post a few pictures showing underneath of the machine head mostly around the bell area and in from the end and straight on at the front around the bell area again.

[toxo]

OK, a bitter sweet day. The seller wanted £750, I offered £600 and he accepted. When I got there today to pick it up (£30 in fuel) I found a machine that had seen better days  and didn't work. The belt that operates the sharpening stone was de-laminating in various places but it did sharpen the blade. The feed roller was smooth - looks like someone drove it into the blade, and wasn't turning. Turns out the linkage that turns the feed roller was missing. found it in the drawer, looks like the pins at each end were too short so I'm guessing wasn't staying in place. Wasn't able to assess the vacuum system because no air available. A couple of more minor things need attention. All in all it needs some TLC but should be able to bring it back for very little cost. He sensed I was about to walk so we got to haggling and in the end I paid him £350 which I'm happy with. Will clean it up and take some pics tomorrow and try to get some air to the vacuum.

[RockyAussie]

8 hours ago, toxo said:

Will clean it up and take some pics tomorrow and try to get some air to the vacuum

Show me some pics of the pins in the shaft as well. To be safe I will try and get some pics on here showing the gear section behind that shaft. You will need to take off the top cover and check that there is some grease in there and that the cogs are not all broken in there. Having that shaft not connected does not sound good. This is what

that shaft should look like -

This gear box at the back shows a top cover plate that can be removed with three screws - Inside you should see oily grease and if it looks dodgy you will need to clean it all out to inspect.

 

[toxo]

OK, spent most of the day looking for air line connectors if one was the right type it was the wrong thread. I was determined to find out if the vacuum system worked.  Ended up having to bodge it.

Eventually got some air into it via the compressor by the back door and an airline going up the stairs.

 

This is the vacuum pump. Don't know what's inside it yet.

Nothing happening at all. Looked everywhere for a switch of some sort, Nothing. Was beginning to think it might be blocked up and then I noticed this under the table top.

That spring is on the end of a lever and goes down to the treadle. Pressed the treadle and away it went. I was so happy. Felt a proper nana for not spotting it earlier. Good suction too.

Don't know if there's a spark arrester in there somewhere. If not just have to make sure the sharpening stone is well clear when in use.

Better pics later when I've cleared everything up.

[toxo]

After cleaning it up a bit I started to put it back together. The safety guard over the bell knife was severely out of shape and was was actually touching the blade in places. A few clumps with a hammer got it in reasonable shape. The drive belt was much too loose so sorted that. There is only two presser feet one 1 inch and one 2 inch. they both have a severe sloped profile which I think is unusual. The waste bag had foam in it so maybe the sloped feet is for foam. I gingerly switched it on and tried a piece of leather. The feed roller is smooth and slightly out of shape so I helped it along with hardly any force and blow me down it did a very nice skive first time. I'm proper made up.