Wizcrafts

Steve; What's your budget?

ASM; I found that system 214x2 is a leather point needle for the machine you are looking at. I see some available in boxes of 100, in sizes 18 through 27. I'd guess other dealers may offer them in packs of ten.

With the power off, run your fingertip along the point of the needle. If you feel any burrs, replace the needle. If it has residue from tape or glue, clean it with deglazer or Goof-Off. If you get used to the sound of a new needle as it sews, you may be able to hear a change when it is wearing out the point.

If your needle screw is letting the needle go inside the leather, I would replace the needle securing screw. It might have worn threads, or have been cross-threaded by accident. If the latter happened, you must pray that only the screw itself is damaged, not the needle bar. If the screw is fine, but won't tighten enough, the threads in the needle bar might be worn, or cross-threaded. This would require you to have a new threads cut to a larger size, to match a new, larger diameter screw, or to have the needle bar replaced. Not going to be cheap either way.

This limited range of needle sizes in system 214 is not well known. I only learned about it a half year ago. That is not to say that these needles were never made in smaller sizes and that some dealers might still have new old stock of smaller sizes in 214. But, the chances that they are leather point is small. For instance, I have a Cowboy 441 clone, which uses type 7x3 or 794 needles. The leather point needles for it start with number 23 and go up. But, I have a full range going down to #18, with a regular sharp point. This is probable a supply and demand situation where more users want standard needles for cloth, vinyl, webbing and sails. UPDATE: I just found a source of system 214x1 (328) needles going from size 18 up to 27. There is no mention of leather point, so they are probably regular rounds.

Impressive specs. It will sew just over 1/2 inch. It uses system 214 needles, which are the same ones used in the CB2500 and GA5-1 type machines. These needles are available in sizes starting at #23, so the machine is not going to useful with thread thinner than #138. It is definitely overkill for anything under 10 ounces thickness. But, it looks like it will sew holsters, collars and harness up to 1/2 inch thick, with #277 bonded nylon or bonded polyester thread (using a #25 needle). You will need a smaller industrial machine for wallets and normal thickness belts. Most walking foot machines will serve this purpose, if geared down, or equipped with a servo motor with good slow speed range..

Look here for used sewing machines, for sale by our members.

If you are only sewing animal collars, a CB2500 will handle 7/16 inch of leather. It has bottom feed and a solid foot (a roller foot is also available), handling thread sizes from #138 through #346. If you are going to sew webbing, you can definitely sew 1/2 inch with that machine. It has bottom feed only, which is no problem on webbing, or on dog collars, where the bottom is not normally seen. The ultimate machine would be a 441 clone, which has triple feed and can sew over 3/4 inch.

The Sailrite 111 is a standard walking foot machine, with a maximum sewing thickness of 3/8 inch. You will not be able to sew over that, even though the feet lift higher. The feet need to be able to alternate up and down a certain distance. Plus, the needle bar must not be allowed to hit the lifted or alternating feet. Being that this machine uses a standard system 135x17 needle, it will not sew more than 3/8 inch. If you are seeking a leather sewing machine, for thicknesses up to 1/2 inch, this is not the machine for you.

Oh yeah?

My Patcher is also a long arm, blue body, big bobbin machine. The model is 29k172. I run the bobbin thread through the center hole that sticks up out of the center of the bobbin. The side spring keeps the bobbin itself from flipping out under speed. My machine was skipping stitches until I looked at the paddle shaped spring on the needle bar, saw it was loose in the thread channel, and bent it inward for better contact with the top thread.

Yes Trox, my bobbin case has the bobbin hold-down spring. I had a thought. Perhaps if the bobbin is almost empty, it will raise up like that, where a full bobbin has enough weight to stay down. Just guessing. I don't miss stitches either since I fixed the bent paddle shaped check spring on the needle bar.

Mine doesn't jump like that. Maybe your bobbin springs are too tight, causing the bobbin case to lift with the thread, rather than feed smoothly. Or, perhaps you are using too large a top thread, which is forcing the case to lift to clear the thread going under it.

I think you have misunderstood me. The Puritan Alligator machine and its shorter arm brothers are designed to sew up the arm (left/right). The machines known as shoe patchers have 360 degree feed (18" arm max) and the old Singer Class 11 includes a model that sews up the arm. Unless somebody makes another machine with this capability, all the rest sew across the arm (forward/backward). All of the 441 machines sew across the arm. While there are other chainstitch machines made for sewing garments, only the Puritan is strong enough to sew leather bags and luggage. It uses an awl to pierce the material, then a barbed needle comes up to feed the material. As the needle descends below the material, a bottom lever loops the thread around itself, forming a chain. These machines have no bobbin. All standard leather sewing machines have bobbins and the top thread gets pulled around the bobbin, grabbing the bobbin thread and pulling it into the material, to form the lockstitch. Both sides are finished in lockstitch machines. They are the standard in most industries. You should visit some industrial sewing machine dealers and describe your project to them. Keep going until you find one who knows how these bags are sewn. Or, contact our member-dealers who advertise on this website. I suspect that Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines might have something you can use to sew up the arm.

It looks like the golf bag in your photo was sewn on a Puritan Alligator, with a 36 inch arm. This machine sews up the arm, as opposed to around the end. A second machine is used to sew the ends around a vertical post or the end of an arm. Puritan machines are chainstitch machines, used in professional factories to make bags, luggage and work boots, where the chain is invisible. They are capable of sewing through aluminum and plywood. All normal leathercraft work is sewn on lockstitch machines. If you want to duplicate the results of professional golf bag manufacturers, you'll need at least two machines (up the snout and across the snout). The $2000 you mentioned might be a down payment on just one of them! You might be advised to contact Puritan for their recommendations. Keep in mind that these bags are sewn up the arm and across the arm. This requires two different machines. If they are lined with wood, heavy plastic, or wood, you should use a needle and awl machine. Puritans meet these requirements and are the standard machines used in the golf bag industry. If it was me, I'd figure out a way to sew them on a standard cylinder arm machine.

I just read on the Puritan website that they make chainstitch cylinder arm machines that sew up the arm! The longest so far is a 36" arm!

Golf bags are usually sewn on Puritan chain stitch machines, with 36 inch high posts. The mechanism is needle and awl. The thread is usually linen and run through liquid wax, but bonded polyester will do fine. Puritan machines are made and sold in the USA.. If a Puritan is not in your budget, a long arm, big bobbin, Adler 30-70 patcher will do. It is also possible to sew golf bags on a 441 clone, like a Cowboy or Cobra. You would want at least a 16.5 inch arm, but the 25 inch arm would make it easier to sew along the center of the bag. The length would have to be sewn together, wrong sides out, then inverted to have the bottom plug sewn on with a French seam.

I am lowering my price for my Union Lockstitch machine to $2500, cash and carry, from Flint, Michigan, 48506. The full description can be found in my previous posts in this topic and on my leather works website. This is a needle and awl harness stitcher.

A close up photo would be a big help in IDing your machine.

I have two SewPro 500GR servo motors I bought from Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines. They have 3:1 gear reduction built in and a 2" pulley. These easy to control motors, which they now call the Toledo Sew Slow, have plenty of low speed torque and bolt into the same three holes as your clutch motor. The belt may need to be shorter, as this motor sits a little closer to the underside of the table. The boys are heading out to Wyoming for the big leather craft show this week, but are going to be checking messages. You can email them at: "information AT tolindsewmach DOT com"

As the last responder mentioned, servo motors are *usually* much more controllable at slow speeds than clutch motors. Unfortunately, some people are getting push button servo motors that are very touchy at slow speeds. These motors don't have a smooth taper from off to on, just a sudden drop out/jump in. The motor I like the best, and I've had quite a few, is the one now sold by Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines as the Toledo Sew Slow. It was previously sold as the SewPro 500GR and has built in 3:1 speed reduction/torque multiplication. This motor has a rotary knob on the back to limit the top speed and has a very smooth taper from off to on, with lots of slow speed range of motion. It even has a brake that releases with a slight movement of your toe on the floor pedal. I see no reason why you couldn't buy a new or used industrial sewing machine table on k-legs, with a standard 7" x 19" machine cutout and an oil drip pan, plus the slot for the belt, delivered knocked down in a box, or assembled on a pallet, for a couple and a half hundred bucks. Then, buy the aforementioned motor and 3L v-belt (length to be determined later) and bolt it onto the bottom of the table, using the existing standard three holes. The motor comes with three carriage bolts, and cable clamps for the wiring. The switch box screws onto the right front of the underside. As for the thickness the 111 can sew, that varies somewhat with the presser feet you use, but you should be able to get up to between 5/16 to 3/8 inch sewn with it. It easily handles #138 bonded thread. There are dozens of different types of presser feet available for the Singer 111. I prefer left toe only, which allows me to sew close to the edge of straps or cases (using a swing-away edge guide). The standard outer foot has a double toe. Upholsterers usually remove it and replace it with a piping foot set. These often-heavy feet can reduce the sew-able thickness a bit.

Art; That sounds like a good plan. I will work on it this weekend. I have to go make holsters and sew stuff today. Catch you later on...

Wait until I have time to review what all I've posted in this huge topic. I want to make sure there is nothing I left out that would be relevant to the topic. I'll let you know if/when to lock this topic. Till then I'll try to steer new posters into starting their own topics.

Please post your questions as a new topic on the forum. You will get all kinds of answers from our sewing members.

No, I don't. You should start a new topic and ask for other members who might know about that machine. This topic is for general information about types of machines for sewing leather, not specifics about any particular make or model (although it sometimes gets that way).