Landis Model 12 F coming back to life

[FDC]

New to leather work and really want to make my own boots. I’ve been aware of the curved needle outsole stitchers for several years and know that I don’t need one so of course I bought one. 
 

It was in a shop and oily, perfect. 
 

I thought that I would be able to tidy it up and use it but that turned out not to be true  as 70 years of hot wax and filth were a deal breaker so apart it came and I rebuilt it from the ground up. A bit intimidating to say the least but with a lot of photos and time it is back together and I’m in the fine tuning phase of things. I have it stitching unsatisfactorily and am working away at it.
 

I have begun to understand how this machine actually works by taking it entirely apart and trying to get it back to proper operation. Brilliant, frustrating and gorgeous!

I used #207 bonded polyester thread and crazy glue to make my new round drive belt joint, works like a charm!

[Tastech]

As a machine man i commend you . They are a complicated bitch to work on at the best of times and it appears you have done an excelled job . They take a bit of practice to learn how to use it well but i am sure you will sort it out . Congratulations on your new born .

[FDC]

On 4/4/2024 at 3:21 AM, Tastech said:

As a machine man i commend you . They are a complicated bitch to work on at the best of times and it appears you have done an excelled job . They take a bit of practice to learn how to use it well but i am sure you will sort it out . Congratulations on your new born .

Thanks! Everything you say is 100% true. I’ve worked on all sorts of equipment and motorbikes over the years but this Landis probably takes the cake for complicated. 

[Tastech]

FDC, I have a Landis K . Not as sexy as the 12 . I have to change the color of the threads from white to black and to brown regularly . I dread doing so . I have decided to buy another identical machine set up with a different color thread . The reason i want the same machine is simply for reference mainly . I want to  Clean , restore and paint my original machine but it takes time . What i fear is that from the time i pull it all apart and put it back together i forget where and how things go . Its always the case That you forget to take the photo of a crucial placement and you have to work it out . With a second machine close to it i can always use it as a reference . The problems with these machines is that nobody really knows how to repair and service them anymore and the people that own them just don't know how to look after them . I remember about 40 years ago the people that owned and operated them were very possessive and temperamental about their machine . You would get abused if you stood to close to them and shanked if you ever touched them . LOL  These days we call them the angry machine . You say a prayer and make sacrifice each time before you use them because one day they sew like a champion and the next it will chew you up and spit you out  . It can be quite soul destroying . Ask any one who has one and they will either roll their eyes or  you will notice an expression of shell shock on their face . No one who has ever operated one knows the feeling .

One thing i have found with mine is that because i use waxed thread i don't have to heat up the pot . If i do everything goes to crap .  I now use a 5W30W synthetic engine oil for lubrication and everything seems to run more smooth . For now at least .

I have some Questions .

How long did it take you .?

Did you have to replace or make any parts for it ? 

Did you make any dumb mistakes and if so what were they so i can avoid them?

What would you do differently ,knowing what you now know ? 

Any tips you might have from hindsight ?

Keep us posted on your progress with it . No one really talks about this subject and i wish they did . For therapy reasons . LOL

Tas

 

[DieselTech]

Looks great! You did a nice job. May I ask what this machine was originally designed for? What was its main use? 

Thanks.

[Wizcrafts]

8 hours ago, Tastech said:

These days we call them the angry machine . You say a prayer and make sacrifice each time before you use them because one day they sew like a champion and the next it will chew you up and spit you out 

This reminds me of something Lisa Sorrell said in her video about her curved needle machine. Lisa makes bespoke Cowboy boots for a living and showed herself sewing on the soles on a 12 series machine. She plays "Last Letter Home" by the Gibson Brothers in the background because it makes the machine happier. She also pointed out a scar/dimple on her throat where the needle broke one time and embedded its tip in her throat. She warned against pushing the boot or shoe which can throw the alignment off between the awl and the needle.

1 hour ago, DieselTech said:

May I ask what this machine was originally designed for? What was its main use? 

The sole use of the curved needle machine is to sew soles onto boots and shoes. No pun intended!

[Ferg]

Wiz,

Every time I read one of your posts with all your machines listed I think of what my wife says about all the equipment I own and some I haven't used for so long. "Why don't you sell it?" For the most part no one wants to pay what you feel is fair, so it still rests in my shop and shed.

Love to hear about the old machines. Had a good friend who was a shoe repairman. He had all those old machines and the entire shop smelled of lubrication oil and leather dye at the same time. He sold all of his shop before he died and I simply didn't have the $2500 or so to buy it.

[DieselTech]

51 minutes ago, Wizcrafts said:

This reminds me of something Lisa Sorrell said in her video about her curved needle machine. Lisa makes bespoke Cowboy boots for a living and showed herself sewing on the soles on a 12 series machine. She plays "Last Letter Home" by the Gibson Brothers in the background because it makes the machine happier. She also pointed out a scar/dimple on her throat where the needle broke one time and embedded its tip in her throat. She warned against pushing the boot or shoe which can throw the alignment off between the awl and the needle.

The sole use of the curved needle machine is to sew soles onto boots and shoes. No pun intended!

Thanks Wiz for sharing that vid. Old beast sounds like a steam train rolling down the track. Also thanks for all the knowledge you share of these old machines. It is greatly appreciated.

[bladegrinder]

On 4/3/2024 at 11:31 PM, FDC said:

New to leather work and really want to make my own boots. I’ve been aware of the curved needle outsole stitchers for several years and know that I don’t need one so of course I bought one. 
 

It was in a shop and oily, perfect. 
 

I thought that I would be able to tidy it up and use it but that turned out not to be true  as 70 years of hot wax and filth were a deal breaker so apart it came and I rebuilt it from the ground up. A bit intimidating to say the least but with a lot of photos and time it is back together and I’m in the fine tuning phase of things. I have it stitching unsatisfactorily and am working away at it.
 

I have begun to understand how this machine actually works by taking it entirely apart and trying to get it back to proper operation. Brilliant, frustrating and gorgeous!

I used #207 bonded polyester thread and crazy glue to make my new round drive belt joint, works like a charm!

I know nothing is of that machine, but man does it look awesome!

Edited April 6, 2024 by bladegrinder
Spelin

[FDC]

On 4/6/2024 at 3:03 PM, bladegrinder said:

I know nothing is of that machine, but man does it look awesome!

To be honest with you that’s a big part of why I restored it. Eye candy!

[FDC]

On 4/6/2024 at 3:47 AM, Tastech said:

FDC, I have a Landis K . Not as sexy as the 12 . I have to change the color of the threads from white to black and to brown regularly . I dread doing so . I have decided to buy another identical machine set up with a different color thread . The reason i want the same machine is simply for reference mainly . I want to  Clean , restore and paint my original machine but it takes time . What i fear is that from the time i pull it all apart and put it back together i forget where and how things go . Its always the case That you forget to take the photo of a crucial placement and you have to work it out . With a second machine close to it i can always use it as a reference . The problems with these machines is that nobody really knows how to repair and service them anymore and the people that own them just don't know how to look after them . I remember about 40 years ago the people that owned and operated them were very possessive and temperamental about their machine . You would get abused if you stood to close to them and shanked if you ever touched them . LOL  These days we call them the angry machine . You say a prayer and make sacrifice each time before you use them because one day they sew like a champion and the next it will chew you up and spit you out  . It can be quite soul destroying . Ask any one who has one and they will either roll their eyes or  you will notice an expression of shell shock on their face . No one who has ever operated one knows the feeling .

One thing i have found with mine is that because i use waxed thread i don't have to heat up the pot . If i do everything goes to crap .  I now use a 5W30W synthetic engine oil for lubrication and everything seems to run more smooth . For now at least .

I have some Questions .

How long did it take you .?

Did you have to replace or make any parts for it ? 

Did you make any dumb mistakes and if so what were they so i can avoid them?

What would you do differently ,knowing what you now know ? 

Any tips you might have from hindsight ?

Keep us posted on your progress with it . No one really talks about this subject and i wish they did . For therapy reasons . LOL

Tas

 

Hi Tas,

 

Dumb mistakes? Yeah, buying and restoring this machine! I likely have 150 hours into it now. Ouch. Money wise maybe $300 USD in total including thread, thread lube, needles, awls round drive belting, pulleys plus the cost of the machine which was about $400 USD. 

I had to replace the leather clutch friction plate, round drive belt and I changed the two pulleys on the motor drive to slow it down a bit. 

Disassembly was clunky the first time round at the very end of the process. I didn’t think my way though the process perfectly. I started left to right and removing the stitch length mechanism allows for a super easy tear down of the last two cams. Going back together is simply reversed but figuring it out was a head scratcher. 
 

I took almost 100 pictures. There is no detail too small to capture! Particular attention to the gear racks and their timing is a good thing but if you have a good knowledge of how the machine operates you can really just go to town as the cam wheels kinda dictate assembly. You will not regret having too many pictures from every angle!

My advice is this: if the machine was used with hot wax just accept the fact that it needs to be torn down. Be careful to keep the cam rollers with their respective levers and cams. Move slowly and think twice about everything before you commit to action. I felt like you do, once you start this job you have to get to the finish line ASAP as it’s best to keep it fresh in your memory. I put my shop on hold once I started the refurb. 
 

When I get it singing I’ll post a video for sure! I’m now onto some furniture projects that need to be finished so the Landis is just eye candy for a while.