Linen thread

[JamesR]

I totally agree with Barra.

For hand sewing Linen takes a lot of beating. If properly waxed it will out last Synthetics. I've been arround long enough to see the difference now 10 to 20 years is all that you can reliably get from Synthetics. I've had to replace stitching that was done by me in as short a time as 7 years using Polyester Blended Thread. Whereas I have never had a Linen Thread fail in nearly 50 years of stitching. Also there are more Dead Sailors (below the surface stitches) with Synthetics owing to the stretch factor pulling tight (overtensioning) when the next stitch is done. Please remember to use "S" twist threads so that your stitches don't unravel as you sew.

Linen doesn't rot if prepared properly with Beeswax & Resin. Case in point My great Grandfather Sewed Traces in 1927 I put a new end on in 1979, the Stitches were so hard to remove after all of that time, only the Leather broke not the thread! He used 2 ounces of Resin to 3/4 lb of Washed Bees wax meleted to-gether (with a touch of Linseed oil or castor Oil in winter).

Rub this into the thread until the friction melts it into the thread. Oh yes point your thread first before waxing.

Remeber "S" twist thread not Z twist.

Kindest Regards.

Jim.

Jim,

Thank you for the good info, I have been working with leather and synthetics

for a few years but I have a lot to learn. You say I should use "S" twist but what about direction, left and right twist? I am lefthanded does the direction of twist matter? Thanks in advance.

Jim

PS I a "dead sailor" the result of the leather being sliced through by the stitching?

[JamesR]

Not sure if it's the "best" source .......Linen Thread - 5 cord left or right hand twist is a good all purpose handsewing thread for pieces smaller than a saddle:

Campbell- Bosworth: http://campbell-bosworth.com/catalog/advan...?keywords=linen

- I have not used the less expensive Hungarian thread myself, but reports that I have received from others who have who's opinions on such matters I resepct, state that it just fine - a harder lay though - and costs half as much as the Barbour's. 5 cord left or right hand twist is a good all purpose handsewing thread for pieces smaller than a saddle or harness

That brings back memories - I've "picked" a lot of old thread and have to agree that properly treated linen seldom rots and when either it or the leather does it's due to factors such as salt from sweat, acids such as urine, or mis-care such as over oiling - all are due to improper long term care

Chuck,

I checked campbell-bosworth's site and see Barbours #5 cord. Do you know if this is a "S" twist thread?

[tonyc1]

I wonder if there is a site on the 'net that gives conversions between metric and other threads like nylon and lines and poly.

Tony.

[jimsaddler]

Jim,

Thank you for the good info, I have been working with leather and synthetics

for a few years but I have a lot to learn. You say I should use "S" twist but what about direction, left and right twist? I am lefthanded does the direction of twist matter? Thanks in advance.

Jim

PS I a "dead sailor" the result of the leather being sliced through by the stitching?

Hey James

I've got to eat my words eh. "S" right hand Twist is for Right Handed Sewers, "Z" left hand Twist is for Left Handed Sewers. What happens is as you sew there is a tendency for the Thread to unravel if you use the wrong twist. This gives a lot of trouble with the thread looking straggly where it shows.

Yes Dead Sailors are buried below the surface at Sea aren't they? Hence a stitch buried below the surface is a Dead Sailor, The big no no of Hand Sewing. Linen is not abrasive so is less likely to break the Grain.

Kindest Regards.

Jim.

[JamesR]

Hey James

I've got to eat my words eh. "S" right hand Twist is for Right Handed Sewers, "Z" left hand Twist is for Left Handed Sewers. What happens is as you sew there is a tendency for the Thread to unravel if you use the wrong twist. This gives a lot of trouble with the thread looking straggly where it shows.

Yes Dead Sailors are buried below the surface at Sea aren't they? Hence a stitch buried below the surface is a Dead Sailor, The big no no of Hand Sewing. Linen is not abrasive so is less likely to break the Grain.

Kindest Regards.

Jim.

Jim,

So I guess as a left handed sewer I should buy Z twist? I guess I am not experienced enough to see this but why would it make a difference? Is it because a lefty stabs the holes from the left side?

I do not mean to beat a dead horse here but I would very much like to understand what is happening and why. Thanks again for your patience.

Jim

[jimsaddler]

I wonder if there is a site on the 'net that gives conversions between metric and other threads like nylon and lines and poly.

Tony.

Hi Tony

I still get confused with threads. I brought up in cords and then numbers came in and now there are deniers. I think that some one is trying to confuse me. Well 6 to 8 cord are for very heavy work, I use a 5 cord (#15 hemp) as normal sewing thread for hand sewing, 4 cord for nice strong 8 or 9 Stitches per inch, 3 cord for Show work at 10 to 12 SPI. But then we have the #12 Hemp that is marketed to us to-day (against our will) which is a bit too heavy for best Sewing, gets a bit too lumpy for tp sewing and then #2 Common Hemp for good strong Sewing. So based on the cord system the Linin threads were simple work our and use.

Then came in the Poly blends #8 #12 #18 #20 # 30 #36 & #40, so #8 was for Pearson 6, heavy work like Traces, #12 & 18 went well in the 45K25 #20 in the Pearson A1 for nice Winker and Saddle Borders and etc.

Now come the Deniers and I'm lost. So I pick up the thread manual and read off the numbers and hope I didn't make a mistake in ordering. It would be nice if Practical people not Expurts gave us a simple scale of sizes that was easy to understand.

The same thing happened to our Saddle & Harness Buckles when the Metric rip off came in Australia. The expurts metricated them to scale and there has been a problem ever since. Of course when you scale down to metric you must take off the length ad depth as well as the width. So a one inch double Swage for instance got shorter in the process and suddenly we were told it is right to do so, only problem was that now a strap wouldn't fit easily in the Buckle any more. Only took centuries to learn what was the right balance for the job.

By the way you kmow the definition of an Epert don't you? X is an unknown quantity and Spurt is a Drip under Pressure.

Goodnight .

Kindest Regards.

Jim.

[jimsaddler]

Jim,

So I guess as a left handed sewer I should buy Z twist? I guess I am not experienced enough to see this but why would it make a difference? Is it because a lefty stabs the holes from the left side?

I do not mean to beat a dead horse here but I would very much like to understand what is happening and why. Thanks again for your patience.

Jim

Note when you use a Sewing machine you mostly have to use Z twist or it unravels and breaks or gnarls. The same happens when you stitch from the other side. when a lefty makes a thread a righty can't use it and vice versa. years ago I had a situation in a Football Factory where the Thread maker was a Lefty and there were a lot of problems with his threads. The Girls had tangles and breakages alll the time. Changed to a right hand thread maker and production went up, no breakages or tangles.

So the answer is in the flick of the wrist.

Kindest regards.

Jim.

[JamesR]

Note when you use a Sewing machine you mostly have to use Z twist or it unravels and breaks or gnarls. The same happens when you stitch from the other side. when a lefty makes a thread a righty can't use it and vice versa. years ago I had a situation in a Football Factory where the Thread maker was a Lefty and there were a lot of problems with his threads. The Girls had tangles and breakages alll the time. Changed to a right hand thread maker and production went up, no breakages or tangles.

So the answer is in the flick of the wrist.

Kindest regards.

Jim.

Jim,

I guess I am lost now, maybe its the way a lefty twists the thread when its put through the needle? I could just try both S and Z and see what happens but the stuff is expensive.

Jim

[Suze]

look on some spinners sites and they will have a good explination about S and Z twist threads

but the basic idea is that when you pull the thread through "whatever" (I'm a cloth junkie) you will either be working WITH the twist and it will stay --- OR --- you will be working AGAINST the twist and it will untwist itself giving you snarls and tangles and a "whole new vocabulary"

that is why when doing embroidry you should alway make sure your thread comes off of the spool in the same direction (thread the part that comes off of the spool first)

Hope that helped a tiny bit.

[Grunt]

OK, here's my question. I just bought a new sewing machine, The Cobra 3/Artisan3000. My question is what linen threads, size and twist, can I / should I use?