Singer 211G166 Restoration

[Coeta]

Ladies & Gents this machine was lying in the backyard as an garden ornament. As you can see from the pics attached from awful to something that might work again. I managed to get new lifting and vibrating pressure foot and the thread tension system...I have put everything apart again and followed a few videos on you tube to see how I need to go to set and align everything to be in sync again from the needle bar height to the hook timing..when threaded and turning the hand wheel i cant get the material to feed under the pressure foot even if it is set to the max stitch length.

So the machine does turn over.

I got these manuals: 211G165_166_265_266.....211U157A_165A_166A_566A....I also watched the video on the Consew 225 Hook Timing

Somewhere I must be missing something in the manual is there a set sequence from the start to the end to be able to get it to work again.

If anybody can elaborate i would sincerely appreciate it or if somebody has a personalized video made of the setting and adjustment and can be able to share it online I would appreciate. I dont want to go to a specialist and pay them to do it because that would help me nothing if something happens again that it does not want to work and need to pay again.

DIY here is of utmost importance.

[mikesc]

If it isn't feeding, are the feet and the feed dogs moving ?

I'm definitely not an expert ( one of the resident experts will hopefully know exactly what is wrong ), but I bought a 211U166A about 15 days ago ( or it might be a 211U166, hard to tell, but mine has a max stitch length of 5mm, so I think it is the 211U166A ),..got all the same manuals and watched all the same videos

"One careful lady owner since new", she used to sew made to measure leather jackets in a small French boutique, ( they had a mechanic for their 3 machines, the operators were not allowed to adjust anything, the lady didn't even know how to adjust the stitch length, nor that she had been sewing all the time with a broken off middle foot, the mechanic told her the foot was short, so as "to be able to see what you were doing when turning corners or backstitching".

Slightly different body to your model, but I can take a movie of what it is doing ( it works very well ) if you can tell me what area you need to see.

Mine has the metallic brown body, with the big horizontal panel on the front in black, white and beige , but it just says Singer 211 , no specific model number, took me a while to find which model it was, Singer made some with the exact model number marked after where it says 211 and some with nothing at all marked after 211 ..Serial number marked on the back U844311020 and "made in Japan".

Small bobbin.

Nice restoration there

[Coeta]

Feed and feed dogs are moving...I thought I had the timing done correclty when slowly turning to check if the needle does not catch the hook..I somewhat loosen the screw for the needle bar because the needle eye was below the hook...tighten it up then the hook was to far away from the needle I loosen up the bottom 2 screws and tapped it slightly closer to the needle during this I have changed the stitch length as well and this is where it started to get messy, and everything started to cacth and scratch on everything and now it does not want to make complete full turns as it catch somewhere so I think the timing is now completely srewed up.

I struggle with the adjustment of the lifting eccentric and the alt pressing feet,,,I am missing something in the manual procedure

Edited March 3, 2016 by Coeta

[Constabulary]

Are you serious? From just looking at these pictures no one knows if this clunker is even complete or if you meanwhile have reassembled everything or if the hook and / or timing belt are missing. So what do you think one should start with?

[Coeta]

Are you serious? From just looking at these pictures no one knows if this clunker is even complete or if you meanwhile have reassembled everything or if the hook and / or timing belt are missing. So what do you think one should start with?

Lol...I also thought about that if it is complete,,indeed everything is there except for the oil reservoir system and the needlebar thread guide that broke...

If somebody can just list the order sequence of what to set i will give it a go again, then on the sequence where I struggle I will ask for assistance again and might get this to work again.

thanx

[gottaknow]

You have to start with the upper and lower shaft timing. If that's not exactly right, everything else will be a waste of time. Have fun!

Regards, Eric

[mikesc]

If everything is getting "scratchy", and it is jamming , don't force it..

As I said , I'm not a sewing machine expert ( I'd count Constabulary amongst those who are, and Eric, who joined in while I was typing ) , but, from your description of what you did, you have introduced too many variables at once ( general rule when dealing with machinery, or most things for that matter ) - "only change one thing at a time"..

Something I did learn while setting up another machine I bought ( whose timing was waaaay off ) was that a needle that hits into the hook can do a lot of damage ( it's previous owner tried needles that were too long )..I broke off around a centimetre from a needle that was the correct size ( so it was now waaay too short ), and the needle couldn't hit the hook and leave nicks and scratches, and then turned it all over by hand, until everything was doing more or less what it should ( feeding etc ..this was on a top and bottom feed juki, not a compound "needle feed" machine ) at the times that it should..then I put in a full length correct needle..and did final timing adjustments, again turning by hand..

First powered run showed me that I still had some nicks and scratches left over..( loud "snicketty", "snappetty" noises as the top thread went around the hook ) so , polished some more, now it sews.

Edited March 3, 2016 by mikesc

[Coeta]

Ok I got that correct the upper timing and lower timing,,,,

mark B on the belt pully is in line with the cut out line on the casting and the the take up lever is in the upper most position the I slipped the fan belt over gave it a few turns checked it again and they are still lined up...

ok the next step?

[gottaknow]

Your shaft timing is only correct if you didn't remove either shaft and change the orientation of both the upper and lower timing belt cogs. If you did and you don't have the correct set screw in the V of both shafts, you may be out of time, (these should always be marked if removed). After that, if you don't want to pay an expert, now is the time for discovery. We all had to start somewhere, for me it was 1980. The apprenticeship for an industrial machine mechanic is 3-5 years, full time in a factory.

I have been impressed over the years I've been on this site at the determination of folks. Very few things in life are free. The people that offer advice and technical expertise on this site do so as a service to the site. I wish I had the time to walk folks through the various machine issues, but it's difficult on a project like yours and I don't have near enough time. That being said, there are several threads of mine if you search our site where I get pretty in depth on 111's and 211's. Invest your time, it's your machine. Don't just ask what's next.........

Regards, Eric

[Coeta]

Eric thank you very much for your input and the honesty from your side as mechanical expert and your inputs already given, much appreciated.

One more and maybe or definitely not the last question ....

The only shaft that were in fact removed was the hook driving shaft and I did take pictures during the removal of the parts but during the cleaning there were supposed to be a line/mark on the shaft to indicate the timing mark so as it is now there is no line visible ....

in order to line it up again with the B letter on the belt pulley from the pic before disassembly it appears that the groove in the shaft for the screw's were at the bottom side. pic 25

I have used the groove on the inside edge of the shaft where the pulley slide over as the timing line(pic 22).......would this be correct before I continue with the rest of the timing...

found the link to the rebirth of a singer ...currently reading and will reply again...thanx to all

Edited March 3, 2016 by Coeta

[gottaknow]

As long as you are sure you have the correct screw in the V groove on the shaft, you should be good. If you remove a set screw, you can tell by its markings if it were in a groove, or on the round part of the shaft. This is sometimes the only way you can tell if you didn't do a good marking job. Once you know you have it correct and it's sewing good, I always go back and take a small cold chisel and mark the hole in the belt pulley that lines of with the V groove.

Regards, Eric

[dikman]

Coeta, although I have one of these machines I can't really offer any useful advice as mine is working. I would, however, like to say well done for resurrecting this machine, I reckon you've done a great job so far!

(A garden ornament! What a waste ).

[Coeta]

Coeta, although I have one of these machines I can't really offer any useful advice as mine is working. I would, however, like to say well done for resurrecting this machine, I reckon you've done a great job so far!

(A garden ornament! What a waste ).

Can you line up the B mark on the pulley with the cut out line on the casing

Take then a pic of the shaft where you can see at least two of the cut out grooves in order so that I can confirm if the feed driving eccentric is correctly timed

(in order to rule out if the shaft grooves is in the incorrect position)

...Eric I have checked the screws and some of them were in the incorrect position (flat headed ones on the groove and they did not lock the part on the shaft)..

I changed them and are all correct now...thanx

[Coeta]

I really need some advice/assistance now...I have worked on this machine non stop for 12 hours for 2 days now,,reading paragraph for paragraph and apply it step for step as I read it but stil I did not succeed.I also got the clip from Uwe Grosse on how to setup the Consew hook timing. So thats why I put in another request for some help..maybe maybe I will get it correct:

I have set the belt for propper sync.

Stitch lenght to zero and corrected the needle bar hight for 2.4mm on the upwards movement,,got the hook as close as possible to the needle, in the centre line/thread and 1.5mm above the eye , set the needle guard as per the book

So the timing is perfect.

I set the machine up for synchronous feed so I kept it at 0 SPI , loosened up the reverse feeding mechanism and moved the crank to the centre.

Needlebar rock frame - Adjusted the needlbar distance from the vibrating pressure bar to be 7.5mm.

Then I set the stitches to max:

Set the feeddog so that the valley are pointing out as much as possible and let the needle enter a little bit in the front of the middle of the needlehole.

Then I loosend up the bottom set screw to adjust the forward stitch lenght to be 5 stitches per inch.then the reverse feeding mechanism for it to be the same length as for forward sticth and this is where my problems start I dont get the reverse sticth length to be the same as the forward length

forward is 5 stitches per inch and reversed it stays at about 11 or 12 even after I have locked the screw on the bottom crank. When I turn the bearing pin to rest against the bearing block the stitch length does not change.

Then I realised when i turn the handwheel the reverse feeding lever drops about 5mm and stops every time the needlebar reaches a downward stroke.

So then from me been tired I mistakenly loosend the wrong screw instead of the blue I loosend the red one there was one cluck sound from something that was under tension and now its nomore...

I dont get any further, cant get the machine to feed, although it is on the max stitch length it only stitch about 2mm,,,when I use the reverse feed the needle point get stuck on the feeddog....so basically the whole thing is no screwed after I loosend up the wrong screw on that top shaft.

[Coeta]

The pressure foot is makeing a deep pressure on the paper as if it is pulling it in the groove plate...what do i need to set to keep it from pressing it to far down

Edited March 7, 2016 by Coeta

[Coeta]

The red circle in previous post...that shaft.....when the machine marks are lined up in the sync position what is the zero position that shaft must be on as there is pinned block for the reverse feeding....

With that red incircled screw loose so that the shaft can rotate I loosend the lock nut and bearing nut and set it so that there is no forward or rearward movement from the needlebar rocking frame

[Coeta]

well finally I got the 211 to sew though I am no mechanic, had to learn how to use the thread tension system finally got it correct and I had a few threads onto the material...some minor settings might need to be tweaked as it will only do max 5 STI when adjusting the stitch length only one notch back the stitch is very small...so I suspect it must be the bottom cam that is not 100 % lined up also when reversing the needle hits the feeddog, when tested with paper it did not hit it tough maybe some screw is not fastened enough and got out of its position but I am getting there..then after about 20 stitches the thread breaks..... the thread is close to the hook point when it is under the throatplate,,cant see properly what is going on down there but I will get it fixed

[Constabulary]

Well, I´m seriously impressed! I have to admit that I really thought you would not get this "thing" back to life! Patience pays off - Congratulations!!!!

[brmax]

I'm impressed this is being done in the short amount of time, patience is a key.

There has been some very good post on the site here, with hello moments I seen for myself.

And with the work your doing and searching old post many in the future will continue the journey.

It all is much easier when the parts are cleaned up for sure.

Looks like your getting in the area where a tablet writing down what you did at step 2.a is going to be good.

I wanted to say, the photos and the quality are really great, that part is so helpful down the road for others.

I wished I had put more time in that, now its easier to understand why relatives always told everyone to stop shutup smile.

good job

Floyd

[Coeta]

Well I stuff it up again..need to start from scratch settings...as I wanted to fix the

reverse stitching length to be exact as forward. I realised after a week of oiling that does not sweat next to shaft entry points where they rotate on the super oilite bearings .....the oil channels were clogged up...I had to remove the shaft where the feeddog are attached thus lessons learned....if you stripp do it propperly...:-)

See stitch lengths...I cant seem to figure out to correct it for revers

Edited March 10, 2016 by Coeta

[brmax]

In your other above photo what is the material, looks coated, inquiring mind wants to know.

How is this walker timed, at stitch setting 0 or 6 or? I remember mine was different not being a walker.

As I remember other compound machines, I found a couple steps back had a bearing on future adj.

I after 30+ years being a heavy equipment mechanic, I thought to take on a rebuild it worked great.

Some of the very exact looking machines were being used in my classes at North coast Marine Canvas.

So within these other scheduled classes I thought it good to spend a few franklins on a Saturday class on sew machines.

Great introduction and follow through to some mechanics of the typical canvas machines.

I spent the bucs and thought I could breeze thru (( not )).

It was a very well done class with this model like/kind as yours along with other Jukis 08, 41, Seiko, Consew .

I had went through! my double needle and now the real waking foot was a different puppy omg. Thanks to Russ it was crystal

to my class as everyone had different machines at home so fundamental instruction and some clarification on any others as the class had whatever you wanted to sit behind, pretty cool. Long story finally made short I sat behind a Juki as I just purchased one from a surplus sale and thinking I knew something about the singer I needed other knowledge, "to my surprise" the following Saturday's class I hadn't a clue about the singer walking foot style machine.

But I do have a note book with some information I will take a look at later and see if I see a particular point to address.

At the moment I have to go deal with a young'n getting smart teeth removed, obviously they got smarter faster than I. Mine were not removed until my late 40's.

good day

Floyd

[Coeta]

Lol.good luck with the young one...the material is called cordura 500g/cm we use it here to make schoolbags..very durable and weatherproof the 300g/cm is just to thin then a schoolbag only last 6 months..keen to see your note's

[Coeta]

Resurrecting an old thread, Yep this was the last time I have used the machine, and in the mean time we have moved to another house and so the machine was neglected and stowed in the garage on the floor deep under the dust and the metal parts got some surface rust again, and sadly the tension mechanism got damaged,  cant remember if I left it still working or not,

So I have to work through this thread again to get  the old girl operational again, setting the timing checking everything...

[Quade]

I just recently disassembled, powder coated and re-assembled a 211A which is very similar to this machine.  They're brother's really, one made in Japan and the other in Germany. 

In my experience, you leave the foot lift mechanism (the one on the back of the machine) for last. 

There's so much timing to adjust on these machines.   You have to match the foot movement to the needle movement. You have to make sure the needle moves at the same speed fore and aft as the foot (it's adjustable).   Then the distance of the hook from the needle and then the timing of the hook to the needle.  Then you have to adjust the foot lift mechanism on the back of the machine to make sure the needle goes through the lower foot at the same time the inner foot presses down on the lower foot and lifts the larger foot. 

 

[Coeta]

Some setting  on my timing is not correct , I struggle a bit finding what might be wrong when turning the wheel by hand I got about 3 stitches  then it is slicing/separating the thread when the hook passes the scarf of the needle, watching it from the bottom during the upward motion the thread is creating  a little  loop on the bottom of the material where the hook catches it again when turning past it thus creating tremendous strain and breaks the thread,

As the needle bar does not have marks on it I have set it up as described in the manual, with the needle to hook timing,  Might it be the tension mechanism that does not take up the slack of the thread, ,,,Oh well it's patience that keeps playing a big roll here to get what the problem might  be

I do have one question though regarding the upward free play of the little gear below the hook ,  the hook pushes through a gear (the small one) then it  runs on a driving gear (the big one),

Referring to the fitment of the small gear it pushes through a brass bush that gets hold with a little screw , how far must that brass bush be pressed in the housing as i have noticed that the small gear have some upward free play of 1mm if you turn the handwheel forwards or backwards,  thus it's causing a delay in the point of the hook timing to the needle  to be in the centre line of the needle. I have loosened up this lock screw and lifted that brass bush upwards until there is no upward or downward freeplay for the small gear _ did I do the correct thing here or are there supposed to be any shims inserted on the top or bottom of the small gear to take up the freeplay, or must that bush be fully pressed down with the free play applicable

Referring to gear  - point nr 5