Okay, seriously .

[JLSleather]

Yikes.  I just noticed a 45 minute long video on making a 3-slot card wallet.  The video 'craze' has been out of control for a while now, actually, but does anybody REALLY need to watch a video to cut out 4 pieces (2 pairs) of veg tan (about 3" x 4"), stack em together, and stitch em?  

I'll re-write this with pics of the actual leather (soon) but for now these make legitimate and painless father's day gifts. still time!

card_hor03.pdf

[Colt W Knight]

I use to be a very active member on a guitar website, and I posted a lot of blogs on building electric guitars because I thought it would stop folks from asking the same questions over and over. folks liked my directions because I laid them out in simple 1,2,3... format. Then folks asked even more questions, so I started posting picture tutorials. Well then people would look at the pictures but not read the text and I got even more questions. Then I tried doing some video tutorials, and it was just too much work and people didnt appreciate all the work. They would just criticize that either the video was too short, too long, didnt specifically cover what they wanted to do, or they requested videos on completely unrelated topic. It got to be too much, and I quit. I was getting too many emails and pms asking me to hold their hands through projects. 

I hate long winded videos on youtube. I wont watch a video if they dont get right into it or if they go off on tangents. And I really dont like the vlogs people post thinking they are some kind of pseudo celebrity. 

[JLSleather]

2 minutes ago, Colt W Knight said:

thinking they are some kind of pseudo celebrity. 

TOO funny, though I wonder if THEY think they are 'celebrity' or if they just want YOU to think so

But yeah -- that's exactly what I mean.

[R SFraser Sr]

Colt,I have mentioned it before in this site, but now that you are bringing it up,

I for one, very much appreciated your posts on the Telecaster Forum,

and I am sure many others did, and nowadays we miss your posts.

bob

[Colt W Knight]

3 hours ago, R SFraser Sr said:

Colt,I have mentioned it before in this site, but now that you are bringing it up,

I for one, very much appreciated your posts on the Telecaster Forum,

and I am sure many others did, and nowadays we miss your posts.

bob

Thanks for the kind words Bob. 

[jimmy eng]

From a sewing teachers point of view, I find a lot of people know zero about what they're going to do and doubt themselves on how to go about making something. And a lot of people are learning by themselves, so when someone watches a long video on the simplest thing it's like having someone working with you as you learn.

 

[JMWendt]

I used to be surprised at the hesitation people have to just try something.  These days, a lot of people spend more time watching how to do something on YouTube than they do trying to do things and learn.  Hands on has become hands off.  Giving up has also become normal.  So it doesn't surprise me now to see a how to video on the most basic things.  People prefer to watch, not do.  And there's always a monkey with a camera trying to build a brand. 

[Martyn]

8 hours ago, jimmy eng said:

From a sewing teachers point of view, I find a lot of people know zero about what they're going to do and doubt themselves on how to go about making something. And a lot of people are learning by themselves, so when someone watches a long video on the simplest thing it's like having someone working with you as you learn.

 

I have to agree. When you know nothing at all and are self-learning with no mentor, these long winded videos on simple subjects are very useful. Yes, once you have some experience, then they sound like they are full of unnecessary waffle, but I would suggest that the videos are not aimed at the experienced. Perhaps those with experience could remember that they were novices once too and find a little tolerance from somewhere. I personally domt care what the motive for making them might be, whether it's self-promotion, ego-stroking or just a genuine desire to help others, it makes no difference to me so long as I'm learning, I appreciate the effort they all make.

[JLSleather]

7 hours ago, JMWendt said:

People prefer to watch, not do.  And there's always a monkey with a camera trying to build a brand. 

Yeah, there's a mouthful!  Back when we had employees, there were always some who 'just didn't understand' and wanted to be shown again (instead of doing the work).  Which is of course one of the big reasons I will never have employees again   

I'm not "anti-video".  But when a 'how-to'' video is over, you should know how to do that yourself, or you're wasting your time.  Common sense says you don't need a 45 minute video to make a project you can make it 20 mins

But it IS true that some people just like to be there without actually doing anything.  I've seen some of those Tandy 'classes' (though never sucked into one myself) which appear to be a social hour, where people can pay to hang out with other people who weren't doing anything either.  

But ocassionally, you find one or two who really does want to learn something.  So in the end, I suppose people will continue to make long-winded videos, more of a low-rent self-promotion than an instruction, and I'll keep making simple instructions which make those wordy 'shows' even more unnecessary than they originally were

 

Edited June 4, 2016 by JLSleather

[Martyn]

56 minutes ago, JLSleather said:

I'm not "anti-video".  But when a 'how-to'' video is over, you should know how to do that yourself, or you're wasting your time.  Common sense says you don't need a 45 minute video to make a project you can make it 20 mins

It depends on the skill level and confidence you have. Lets take saddle stitching as an example, if you can do it, all you have to say is 'sew along this line'. If you cant do it, an hour long video on the subject barely touches the surface.  Anything I can do today is a direct result of people showing me how to do it on youtube and I'm grateful to all of them. My saddle stitching now is fairly good I think, but I would hardly be able to do it at all if it wasn't for the videos from the likes of Ian Atkinson and Nigel Armitage and others. When I watch the same videos today, them seem to be full of waffle, but I still pick things up and the first time I watched them, I hung on every word. If the video's irritate you, dont watch them, it's that simple. But I would encourage everyone with a camera and something to say, to make them. Good or bad, makes no difference. Motive is irrelevant. Youtube isn't short of bandwidth. The good ones will get recommended and passed along, the bad ones will slip away into obscurity. You also have to remember that the most skilled leather worker, might be the worlds worst teacher and video producer. You dont have to be smart, computer literate and eloquent to be good with leather. I want to learn from all of them and I'm grateful to all of them who take the time to make the videos, post instructionals (and share templates), whatever the motive or quality, It's all good.

Edited June 4, 2016 by Martyn
correcting typo

[bob21804]

I like YouTube videos for the most part. I like to say - "I think I could learn to do brain surgery watching YouTube". And between YouTube and this website, I've improved my leatherwork quite a bit in the past few months. (Most recently it's been more website and less YouTube) Different people learn in different ways. It helps some people a lot to watch every steps someone else does, to get the details of how to do it properly, or the best way to do a seemingly simple task. If they're really unsure of how to do a it, it might help them to see every detail. But yes, a 45 minute video to watch a 20 minute task being performed seems to be a bit much. Now, I can watch and learn, but I really don't learn best until I actually do whatever it is with my own hands. Yes, some YouTube videos are much too drawn-out for my taste, (and it may-well depend on the subject, and the familiarity I already have with it) and when I start feeling that way I move onto a video is better suited. I love to learn all kinds of stuff, and I look at YouTube videos as ONE good way to increase my knowledge of a subject. And of course, books, asking questions of those who already do whatever-it-is well and actually doing are great tools and methods too.

[bikermutt07]

I have learned a lot from youtube. It's  like an open instructional  library.  Had it  not been for grier Wolfe and Atkinson i wouldn't be  here. Both make long drawn out  videos.  Heck, the first  sheath i made wolfe took 6 videos to lay out. But he was informative and precise. I can appreciate your lack of interest in  long boring  self promoting videoes of wind bags who love to hear themselves  talk (nutnfancy) but there is a lot of great content there. Imagine  if i would have tried to break into leather 20 years ago. I would be stuck  with nothing  more than books to learn  from. Not that i dont love books,  i do. But i found out ages ago that im a verbal learner. So, youtube instruction has a lot to offer people  like me.  Thanks to all the folks who make those videos. 

[JLSleather]

I can't grasp what I would learn from watching someone saddle stitch for an hour.  Okay, make a stitch line (or a gouge).  Fair enough. Now, stab with the awl on the line so it comes out the line on the back side. All good.  Now, left thread through, now right thread through, pull up.  All great. Now, do it again.

Now, do it again.

Now, do it again.

Now, do it again.

Now, do it again.

Now, do it again.

Now, do it again.

    

That one guy is correct.. if it aint for you, don't watch it.  Personally, I think it ranks right up there with the new refrigerators with installed cameras.. so you can check your smart phone at the grocery to see if you need eggs.   Honestly, are we THAT lazy we can't check before we go to the grocery ... ?

 

[MADMAX22]

19 minutes ago, JLSleather said:

That one guy is correct.. if it aint for you, don't watch it.  Personally, I think it ranks right up there with the new refrigerators with installed cameras.. so you can check your smart phone at the grocery to see if you need eggs.   Honestly, are we THAT lazy we can't check before we go to the grocery ... ?

I think its funny that people cant even drive home without having there phone right next to them trying to look at FB or similar while they are driving a 2 ton vehicle at 60mph down the road. Not sure how we use to manage being "out of contact" for half an hour or all day. 

The problem I have with youtube is the black hole effect. Go to look how to do something next thing you know your watching some end of the world prediction video or spider battles or some dumb stuff and you just wasted an hour or two

[bob21804]

15 minutes ago, MADMAX22 said:

I think its funny that people cant even drive home without having there phone right next to them trying to look at FB or similar while they are driving a 2 ton vehicle at 60mph down the road. Not sure how we use to manage being "out of contact" for half an hour or all day. 

Gotcha, but "funny" isn't the word I'd use to describe it. Sometimes it seems like half the people on the road are either talking on their phone or texting. How bout "scary" instead. I've seriously been thinking about making a sign to hold up to people who I see driving while using their phones. It makes me mad that they're so willing to put me and my loved ones at higher risk on the roads.

Also, I agree 100% with what Matt said about YouTube, (and the internet in general), making it so much easier for us to learn leatherwork. But I also agree with what Jeff alluded to - all this tech can, and is getting out of hand. I like things simple when possible. No smart TV (or any TV for a while now) for me, and I don't miss it a bit. Definitely no "Smart TV/Smart" appliances in my near future. Technology has made possible some really great tools, but it's a mistake to depend on them.

[MADMAX22]

Just now, bob21804 said:

Gotcha, but "funny" isn't the word I'd use to describe it. Sometimes it seems like half the people on the road are either talking on their phone or texting. How bout "scary" instead. I've seriously been thinking about making a sign to hold up to people who I see driving while using their phones. It makes me mad that they're so willing to put me and my loved ones at higher risk on the roads.

Yeah guess funny isnt really the word to use. I dont use a sign but do use other methods to remind people to pay attention, especially when I am on my cruiser.

[Martyn]

3 hours ago, JLSleather said:

I can't grasp what I would learn from watching someone saddle stitch for an hour.

Well for example, I was stitching for a while and couldn't figure out why the back didnt look quite right. It was only through watching NA's video, I realised I was casting my loop over the needle, instead of under. I discovered whether you cast over, or under depends on whether you are stitching left hand priority or right hand priority and whether you are stitching towards you or away from you. Being able to swap left to right, front to back at will without affecting the stitch doesn't just require practice, it requires that you understand exactly how your actions affect the stitch, like if you are trying to tie a square knot and get the crossovers wrong, you end up with a granny knot. If you know all that already, great. If you don't (and I didn't), then I'd still be struggling without the help of these videos.

Edited June 4, 2016 by Martyn

[Boriqua]

It really depends on the material being presented, the presenter and the presentation. I have been at this off and on for over 25 yrs. Still I watched most of the ian Atkinson "leodis leather" videos from start to finish.

Then .. there is a convenient way to  fast forward to the juicy parts later. I worked in an industry where you got old quick. If you didn’t keep up with new ideas and methods you were gone or you managed an upper management spot so you could thrwart new ideas which wasnt me so I always keep an ear out for any new information and make it a point of pride not to assume I know everything. The 65 yr old and the 20 yr old may have something to show me and I want to remain open to it.

Most important to me though is  .. "this may be heavy so if you don’t feel it stop reading now"

I think it is a travesty that in the USA we have removed most of the hands on classes. I was "lucky" in that I enjoyed school and excelled academically but my 2 brothers struggled. They were more hands on learners. Both of them went on to be wonderfully successful in the most common measures. One has his own business, is a licensed electrician and owns several rental properties and the other has been an electrical technician for 30 yrs. Both have wonderful homes, cars and families which is some measure of success?

Formal education wasn’t for them .. they will both out work almost everyone else I have met but sitting in a classroom absorbing abstract information wasnt their thing. One was relegated to "special Education classes" and he now makes more money than most people I meet and deservedly so .... he knows his Sh*t.

Somewhere we decided that working with your hands wasnt a wonderful life's work and that "shop" classes were unnecessary. If a 2 hr video is what some person needs to find his/her niche and become a productive member ... Im all for it.

Mike Rowe is right ... Politics aside ... lets get more opportunities for the doers.

For the rest of you  .. there is fast forward!

 

Edited June 4, 2016 by Boriqua

[leatherwytch]

I sense a little bit of jealousy, Jeff.  If you don't want to see a video don't click on it. There is always someone new who wishes to learn from it and the new people can learn from one or 1000 videos. Just some coincide with them better than others.

 

 

[ruger]

I like to see videos with necessary instructions and not all the unnecessary drivel they add. Most videos can eliminate about 5 min.

before they even start with what they are trying to get across.. Some of the videos have bad music and wonderful visual content and would like a hint or two and most short and to the point.

I can usually tell within the first min. or so. Like watching paint dry on the wall.

Long drawn out instruction and drivvvle can put you to sleep !

[Colt W Knight]

I do pretty good with picture tutorials when I can use Photobucket to host my pictures, but editing video takes me forever. I can understand why most folks have long and long winded videos because when you are put on the spot in front of a camera, you can never remember what to say or you stutter or forget the impressive word you were thinking of using. What happens? You get nervous and ramble, then you don't want to spend hours editing the video. At least that is why I hate doing videos.

A friend of mine asked me to make a tutorial on how I made some bourbon bottle lamps, so I decided to do a quick video because most of the stuff I saw online didn't have very nice lamps.

This 3:30 minute video took me hours to shoot, edit, and upload. As far as videos go, it isn't very good.

 

[JMWendt]

Just to add a comment here on the recursive state of the internet at this point, we are getting to the point where it isn't meta-data anymore, but it is now metameta-data, or even cubic-meta-data.  If you do a search for "How to Make YouTube Videos" there are literally hundreds of YouTubers out there who have gone out of their way to make videos to help others make videos for YouTube.  I did not specifically search for videos about how to make videos about making videos, but I'm sure there is at least one of those in that list.  "Hey guys, here's my video about how you can make a video about making a video about making videos on YouTube!"  Yeah.  That one.

Sure, YouTube can be helpful for obtaining some information or seeing some knowledge demonstrated . . . for example, when a buddy brought me a Marlin rifle he could not get back together.  I looked it up on YouTube and we had it assembled in thirty seconds.  But that was a year ago.  If you ask me how we got that rifle together today, I couldn't tell you now.  I don't know.  I used the information at the time and reassembled the gun once, but didn't learn anything.  Of course, I don't own that gun, so I can do it again (and again).  And to be clear, we didn't even watch the entire video . . . we popped to the part where he slid the pin in place and that was it.

Information is not knowledge, and knowledge is not wisdom.  Information can be absorbed through watching, and is typically ephemeral.  Knowledge and wisdom are gotten through doing, and they are mostly retained.  In fact, I would posit that the likelihood that information becomes knowledge is directly proportional to the duration of one's wonderment about the subject matter at hand.  Similarly, the likelihood that I will gain knowledge and wisdom from YouTube is virtually zero.  I get the knowledge and wisdom by doing, not watching.

The internet has nearly eradicated any duration on wonderment.  We no longer ponder what we do not know and really familiarize ourselves with the fullness of our lack of knowledge, and we no longer carry that lack of knowledge with us long enough to be invested in finally knowing.  We just wonder for a second, look it up on the internet, then move on and forget we ever wondered about that in the first place.  And when I say "we", I mean everybody else.  Because I don't use the internet.  Right?

 

 

 

[bikermutt07]

This reminds me of a story. Being a tradesman I'm always looking for improvement in different areas. I once ran a granite department and ran across a house being remodeled. We had to deliver different counters throughout a long drug out schedule. During this time I met this kid. He was maybe 22 or 23. I noticed his work on various parts of the project. He set the cabinets, installed the trim, did all the tile work (including some very impressive floor to raked ceiling showers). He did all the wood and tile floors. I kept thinking to myself, how does this kid know so much. Well, when He did the handrail on the entry staircase that was it I had to ask. I said, "man, I don't want to insult you but, how the hell did you learn all this stuff?"

He pulled out his phone, and simply replied, "dude, YouTube". He went on to say as each thing came up, the owners asked him if he could do it? He researched the projects and let them know what tools he needed.

Now, I know you have to have some raw talent to do that. And the kid was definitely smart. He made a career for himself off of frigging YouTube.

Last time I ran into him he was running a crew for that same family as they bought and flipped homes.

If properly applied, YouTube can be very useful.

[particle]

I used to watch Norm Abrams on The New Yankee Workshop every morning before work while I was getting ready. I knew nothing about woodworking at the time, but nearly everything I know, I learned from watching his TV show (and later reading books & magazines, and more recently YouTube). Sure, I didn't absorb everything he taught, but I picked up bits and pieces, and learned alternate ways to accomplish the same thing - with expensive tools, with cheap tools, with hand tools, etc.

Some people are simply thirsty for knowledge. When I first started with leather working, I devoured everything I could find on the internet and watched untold hours of related videos on YouTube. I don't seek them out like I used to, but when I'm trying to learn something new, I welcome those long videos and appreciate the time and energy spent producing them.

[JMWendt]

Sure, you guys . . . like I said, you got the information from YouTube, but then you did it . . . practice.  The information is there, and it's great.  You used to have to go find people to get it.  Now you cna just watch.  But you still have to follow through and do it a few times to really lock it in and make it knowledge.