Foot Lift sticking problem with 441 clone

[dgkfit]

Hello,

    Your help is needed.  I have a 2 year old 441 clone, one of the popular brands.  It has a chronic problem.  The mechanism that lifts the presser feet to remove material from under the feet and needle sticks, usually in the UP position.  I have done what the importer says do, and it still does it.  Is there any advice out there as to how to fix it?  

 

Thanks  Dale

[Wizcrafts]

Just rotate the pressure screw until the presser bar frees up and drops. The hole in the screw is sometimes bored slightly off center. Oh those Chinese!!!

[CowboyBob]

There's locknut(ring) for when you adjust the foot pressure,loosen that & see what happens.Also have you ever taken the side cover off & oil everything in there including the top & lower part of this bar?

[Uwe]

You'll have to be a little more forthcoming with information if you want meaningful answers. Otherwise it's just a wild guessing game. Not sure why the brand is a secret.

Is it sticking with manual foot lift lever, pedal foot lift chain, or both?

How high does the foot  lift when it sticks?

What exactly was that recommended thing you did that did't work?

Did you buy the machine new? Has the foot lift ever worked properly?

[dgkfit]

hello wiz, bob, and uwe, 

 

thank you all for your rapid reply.    i will try to answer all your questions, and try what you recommended.  it is a cobra 4.  i bought it new, only because its dealer was the closest dealer to me.  but it has been a good machine, and the service has been fine. 

1    it will   stick up no matter how it was put there, foot pedal or manual.

2    the recommendation was that i take a dremel and motor-file off some of the end of the lever's knob, which attaches to the fork on the back / end of the machine.  i did this some.

3   the big presser foot pressure knob is adjusted way down tight for the thin fabric i sew.   is that making the foot stick in the up position???

4    it has been a while since i oiled inside the end plate.   i had a machine mechanic come and try to fix the problem, last fall, but he hasnt totally fixed it.   and, he looked inside the cover plate.    which place inside there should i especially oil to treat this problem?

 

thank you  dale k

 

[Uwe]

If the mechanic sitting in front of the machine couldn't figure it out, it'll be a real challenge for us to do it remotely and blind-folded.

As for oiling, remove the side cover and oil everything that moves when you lift the feet. Anywhere metal touches metal and moves needs to be oiled.

I'd recommend a few simple process-of-elimination steps to see if you can narrow down the source of the foot lift bind.

Loosen the foot pressure screw all the way and remove the screw. If foot lift bind goes away, then that screw is where to investigate further. If it still binds with the pressure screw removed, then the problems lies elsewhere.

Closely inspect everything that moves as you lift the feet and look for visible rub marks, scratches, etc. Sometimes the problem hides in plain sight.

 

 

Edited March 31, 2018 by Uwe

[dgkfit]

hello uwe,

  thank you for your help.   i oiled the bolt that goes up and down inside the lockscrew that adjusts the presser foot height.   that helps alot.  we shall see.  your "hiding in plain sight" input helped me look at that.  i will sew tomorrow.   thank you and i will reply with more....dale

[brmax]

Has to have the thread removed from the tensioners if possible, if not at minimum removed from needle and the take up lever. With the motor power turned off. The side cover can then and has to be removed and layed in a safe place.

With the presser feet (hand lever) in raised position, step on the foot pedal for the presser release. Does this let the knob fall 

 

Good day

Floyd

 

Edited April 1, 2018 by brmax

[dgkfit]

hello floyd,  

   thanks for your input.   i didnt take the end plate off, but stepped on the foot lift, locked the hand lock, and stepped on the foot lift again.  the hand lever dropped.   this is after i oiled the center bolt on top/end.   i will take this up again tomorrow.  thanks  dale

[RockyAussie]

I would also check that all of the parts around the tension discs that get spread open are not getting caught up and or out of alignment. Was on my Cowboy.

[dgkfit]

hello all,

    i took the end plate off and oiled everything that moved.  that included some pistons that go up and down when the feet are lifted.  then, when i went to put the thing back together, and put the fork over the knob that connects and completes the connection, the disc that goes around the bent rod inside the machine came off.  i dont know how to re-connect it.  it is a mess.  i looked hard in the parts list to find names for these parts, but could not find them.   fotos are below.   thank you for your past and future help.....dale

 

[brmax]

The spring on the back side that helps the presser feet linkage, temporaraly remove it.  Then remove a lot of the excess white grease around the connection of the “ bent rod “ link. 

The long thin linkage on back side for presser foot actuation that has the screw, its loose. This screw requires tightening so to keep secure the link that is off. But first ( after complete or close to the removal ) so to facilitate re-conneting the bent rod link/ top side. After assembly secure that screw carefully. Now I would re install the helper spring and post up on any issues. 

 

Good luck

Floyd

[RockyAussie]

4 hours ago, dgkfit said:

the disc that goes around the bent rod inside the machine came off

This part that you mention has me confused and as you have not pictured the disc or that area, I have tried to find what it is you are mentioning. It may be something peculiar to the Cobra machine though. I have taken some pictures of my Cowboy that may help some and I have attached a pdf that does not show any disc but is about the only diagram I could find that shows that area. As Floyd said I think correctly the bent rod needs to be hooked back on to the hinge screw and then the loose screw that lets the mechanism rotate needs to be tightened up. I hope this helps some. Brian

441 parts.pdf

[Uwe]

I have a feeling you disassembled more parts than necessary. The whole side cover plate assembly should come off after removing just two screws (shown from 0:24-0:35 in my 441 adjustment video - please don't do anything else shown in that video.) I'd contribute pictures but I'm nowhere near my machines.

You'll have to post some more pictures of the rear of your Cobra and also the parts you removed, so that we can perhaps mark up the pictures with numbers and arrows to communicate what needs to go where and in what sequence.

If that L-shaped part with the fork ("thread tension release arm" sounds good to me) was not installed correctly to begin with, it may well have caused a bind when lifting the feet. The upper end of the thread tension release arm needs to go BETWEEN the thread tension discs when you lift the feet. If it went behind or in front of the discs, it may have caused a bind.

I also have a strong feeling that you're unclear about what certain other parts do. For example, that foot pressure adjustment screw on top of the machine does NOT change the height of the presser foot as you implied earlier. You said that you had that screw all the way down for working with your thin fabric materials. That screw really adjusts the spring pressure that pushes down on the feet as they walk. In general, the foot pressure should be as light as possible while still holding the material in place.

Sewing machine maintenance beyond basic oiling may not be your thing. After we (hopefully) get this current issue resolved, try to connect with a different local mechanic who's familiar with the 441 design. Your previous mechanic was not up to the task.

 

[dgkfit]

Hello all,

   I think i have it fixed for now. I loosened the screw that holds the pivoting part with the fork, and got the fork to go over the coil at the end of the thick wire that goes on down inside the machine.  (That is the internal linkage) Again, the parts manual gives no names I can find for these parts.  The " upper end of the thread tension release arm"  DOES go between the  "thread tension discs" when i step on the lift pedal.  Steve at Leather Machine Co told me to adjust the  " foot pressure adjustment screw on top of the machine"  way down because the feet were slipping on slippery ballistic nylon fabric.  So, that raises the question:   SHOULD I ADJUST THE BANANA SLIDE TO THE TOP POSITION FOR THIN FABRIC?....if so, and then should i loosen up the screw that makes the foot pressure spring so tight?

Thank you all again....I think I fixed it.    I will call Steve/David if it needs more fixing.  
 

Dale K

 

[brmax]

Good job Dale!

In that manual it describes adjustment for the walking foot height, ( the slot adjustment). Really this is for climbing over seams and such. If this is truly not needed then the most efficient is leaving the adjustment connected towards the top. I think it’s listed on page 13. 

On another point you might discuss here and with the tech’s over at Cobra and or the other 441 dealers. Is what presser feet your using or other styles that might work better for your materials. 

Good day

Floyd