Is there standard for twin needle machines?

[katit]

My question is about distance between needles. I assume it's fixed. I read in topic nearby about some machine with 14mm between needles. Out of curiosity I pulled PFAFF 1246 web page but the number is not anywhere. Not in manual. Now on web page. Is it possible it's adjustable?

So, what IS the standard distance for let's say automotive upholstery?

And is it easy to change it on let's say Singer 111 variants of twin-needle machine?

[brmax]

Its called gauge from my best recollection, the between needle distance jargon.  In an older singer as you mention or a 212 its relatively easy, if the parts are available. 

I believe they did design these around products, in my opinion. 

 

Floyd

[katit]

I see. So, if I do want to experiment and get my hands on one of those - unless "gauge" is what I need - it's probably useless machine, correct?

[brmax]

It is an adjustment thats requires both hooks to be reset, this being the change of the saddle position along its machined way. 

So ya its not a today this gauge/ distance and tommorow another. For myself anyway others maybe, but unlikely. For sure it takes a lot of time. There are a few here that could accomplish this daily. 

The older ones typically have one needle bar, some newer ones have seperate needle bars. In that its totally out of my pay or interest grade. Changing this needle gauge width may have been a real pursuit long ago for me. If with something in the 1/2” or 14mm long ago if the parts were there. They were not. 

 

Floyd

Edited March 7, 2019 by brmax

[councilman24]

3 hours ago, katit said:

I see. So, if I do want to experiment and get my hands on one of those - unless "gauge" is what I need - it's probably useless machine, correct?

No, on a 212 singer it"s not that hard.  When I got mine in the mail both hooks were loose and no where near set up.  Took 2 to 3 hours with a good manual to set the hooks, the first time I ever moved a hook.   Bought a new gauge set and changed it for the first time to a new gauge in an hour or two, again the first time I did it.  With a good manual.  Parts are widely available.  I haven't worked with other than 212 singer series. But if you find a good one of those at a good price buy it no matter what the gauge.  You likely will want more than one gauge anyway.  Yes it's more convenient to have one in each gauge you want.  But if you use one for an occasional project and mostly at one gauge it's not that hard to change.  Assuming some medium mechanical ability.  Especially if you've timed machine and adjusted hook clearances before.  If you can't change your watch battery or the oil in your car then maybe changing one isn't for you.

In fact I need to go down stairs and change mine from 1/4 to 3/16.  I expect it to take an hour.  With interruptions maybe 2 hours.

[councilman24]

1 hour ago, brmax said:

It is an adjustment thats requires both hooks to be reset, this being the change of the saddle position along its machined way. 

So ya its not a today this gauge/ distance and tommorow another. For myself anyway others maybe, but unlikely. For sure it takes a lot of time. There are a few here that could accomplish this daily. 

The older ones typically have one needle bar, some newer ones have seperate needle bars. In that its totally out of my pay or interest grade. Changing this needle gauge width may have been a real pursuit long ago for me. If with something in the 1/2” or 14mm long ago if the parts were there. They were not. 

 

Floyd

It just really isn't that hard.  Some of the first detailed sewing machine adjustment I did.  But takes a good manual and an understanding of the adjustments needed.  Try it for fun.

[councilman24]

BTW I am not a sewing machine mechanic.  I had to learn how to work on mine because I own 20 industrial machines and no mechanic nearby. Becoming a mediocre machine mechanic based on need.  But this change of gauge isn't really that hard.  they are meant to be changed in the field.

[katit]

The way you guys explain it - makes total sense and I'm not scared of changing gauge set at all. I just did complete overhaul of similar single needle walking foot machine along with setting timing, hook, etc. So I get it. Most likely I will need only one gauge for what I want to do (car upholstery)

Machine I will be looking at looks exactly as Singer 168w101 but it's got 2 needle. It's a post bed machine. My main problem/fear is that I won't be able to buy/find gauge set needed. I looked at machine very briefly, didn't recognize model # but it did look like 1/2 inch between needles which is little too much for what I need. So, if you know what that machine is and if it's using same gauge sets as any other similar Singer's...

[councilman24]

15 minutes ago, katit said:

The way you guys explain it - makes total sense and I'm not scared of changing gauge set at all. I just did complete overhaul of similar single needle walking foot machine along with setting timing, hook, etc. So I get it. Most likely I will need only one gauge for what I want to do (car upholstery)

Machine I will be looking at looks exactly as Singer 168w101 but it's got 2 needle. It's a post bed machine. My main problem/fear is that I won't be able to buy/find gauge set needed. I looked at machine very briefly, didn't recognize model # but it did look like 1/2 inch between needles which is little too much for what I need. So, if you know what that machine is and if it's using same gauge sets as any other similar Singer's...

Ebay.    Or Henderson

[Constabulary]

When it comes to 2 needle machines Singer 212 / 112 based needle feed machines (like Consew, Seiko, Juki...) are the best / most economic choice for Hobbyists / small businesses because the gauge sets are cheap and available almost everywhere, even on Ebay.  Adler & Pfaff are using different gauge sets and cost a lot more.

For any needle distance you always need 4 parts: needle holder, needle plate, feed dog and presser foot or presser feet if you have a walking foot machine instead of "plain" needle feed machine

College Sewing in the UK is a good source if you live in the EU:

https://www.college-sewing.co.uk/industrial-sewing-machine-gauge-parts/

You can even convert the Singer 112 / 212 based machines in to split needle machines