Sewing Through Plywood

[29EssexRat]

So I'm looking to attach cloth to 3/16" plywood. While I do realize this is a leather working sub, I figured the thick plywood would be more comparable to a leather working based sub rather than a sewing sub.

Basically the cloth is a thicker fabric, and needs to be sewn with a thicker thread to 3/16" soft plywood. I'm looking for a sewing machine that will be up for the task. This is a one time use, maybe 80 feet of stitching. So the wear on the machine is negligible. I've found a couple of forum threads that mention some machines, but I am not familiar with sewing machines, and having not found any of the same models on ebay/market place/craigslist, so they're not of use to me.

I'm looking for used, as this is a one time deal, and under $250. There's a ton of older industrial machines on eBay, but again, I'm not familiar with sewing machines, and details about sewing machines isn't really available on the internet. 

There's a few I've seen listed on eBay, that they show/say sewing through thick leather. Or are labeled as "Heavy Duty".

Singers: 1036, 281-36, 66-18, 128, 329K, 237

Pfaff: 130

Kenmore: 148-530

Any of those seem up to the task? Or any I should look for, preferably on eBay under $250. 

I've tried hand stitching, predrilling a hole, and threading it, but it really irritates my carpal tunnel, but that might be what I have to end up doing, and perhaps con someone else into helping.

[Nyckname]

Buy a bench mounted drill press. Drill the holes. Sell it when you're finished. 

[29EssexRat]

Yeah, i might do that. Had posted on another forum and someone recommended chucking an awl into a drill press. A pretty darn smart idea i might just have to do. A sewing machine would be really nice still though, but will look for used drill presses and fab something up for the awl.

[Matt S]

This topic has been discussed a couple times here before. The consensus is that you need at minimum an upholstery weight machine (such as but not limited to) the Singer 111. Preferably a harness weight machine.

All of those machines you listed are domestic machines for sewing shirts and cushions, or garment weight industrials (for sewing shirts and cushions quickly). None of them are suitable for sewing plywood, even lighter stuff. Sadly eBay is full of mislead and misleading persons.

For $250 you're going to be looking a while to get a suitable and functioning machine. You would probably be better off hiring someone who has a suitable machine.

[fredk]

Don't use an awl on plywood. Use a small drill ~ maybe 1/16 inch or less, it will be quicker and less dangerous

[chrisash]

Have you considered epoxy glue, I would imagine some of it will be far stronger than sewing and cheaper than buying a machine

After all lotus cars use epoxy glue to join the chassis parts together in their cars, so quite strong

[29EssexRat]

Darn was hoping one of those i had mentioned wouldve worked. I’ll keep an eye out for a 111, any other comparable machines?

The awl method was with pre drilling, then chucking the awl for a lock stitch.

epoxy glue would be very expensive, would it not? The piece is roughly 4.5’ x 7’. Thats a lot of glue.

[fredk]

Does Chisash mean contact adhesive?

The OP is in a $ using place - US, Canada, Australia?

For under £10, about US$12.50, I can buy a tin of contact adhesive which will do the area mentioned, 31.5 sq ft

Does it have to be sewn? or just attached? I've used contact adhesive to adhere leather, PVC material and cloth to wood panels for vintage cars

Using the awl in a drill press idea is just for making sewing holes. A sewing awl blade is just a special kind of knife. In a drill press it will cut thru thick leather and maybe thin ply but you are looking at 5mm thick ply - the blade will bend and break. Drill the holes and stitch using the two-needle saddler stitch method

[29EssexRat]

I’m in the US, i originally tried contact adhesive, 3M Super 77 but it never set up and the fabric was easy to pull off. This is for a roof of a car, so i glued it down with wood glue, which held really nicely, but would be more confident with a stich around the border, plus it would look nice.

 

Maybe im using the wrong term, but im talking of a stiching awl that you put a bobbin of thread in. With predrillled holes i wouldnt be forcing the needle through, or in any way damage the needle.

[Bert51]

I was told a story of some one restoring a car and stitched the door and kick panels, which had a ply backing with a Singer 132K6.

I have not seen it, but was told it could be done. I might have to go and try it, I wonder if a size 25 needle will do it?

Bert.

[29EssexRat]

Yeah been looking for a 132k6 to no avail. Theres so many makes and models i really just need a list of them. Or how model numbers denote sewing capacity.

[Bert51]

Sadly, any 132K6 I've seen, that is any good has a real good price on it.

Bert.

[Constabulary]

where are you located? Essex in the UK?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SINGER-132-K6-HEAVY-DUTY-SEWING-MACHINE/153660274459?hash=item23c6ddb71b:g:sQcAAOSwsVpdMGgU

Other than Singer 132K - check for Singer 45K

Edited October 6, 2019 by Constabulary

[Bert51]

Or an Adler 104 or 105, they all use the same needle as the Singers.

Would a size 25 needle be heavy enough?

[chrisash]

As you are only sewing the edges, then using a epoxy glue would not be expensive i guess and you can do small sections at a time, my understanding is that epoxy glues are far stronger than normal contact glue, but worth investigation i would have thought

Regarding the stitch line, that could be done first and then glued giving the effect you are looking for

[Wizcrafts]

A Union Lockstitch machine can punch through plywood. They were often used to sew luggage and cases in their day. Also, the Campbell Randall and Landis 3 and 16 can do this task. The reason is these are all needle and awl machines with powerful continuous run motors and giant flywheel pulleys. These old machines still cost thousands of dollars.

Aside from the needle and awl machines, I believe that a #26 or #27 needle would be needed in a closed eye needle machine, like the Cowboy and Cobra 441 clones. Or, maybe a #25 round point instead of leather point. Either way, the material should be glued to the wood before punching through or the wood will splinter on the bottom. If an upholstery machine was used, the hole in the feed dog would have to be large enough to clear a #25 needle. Also, the hook might need to be moved further away to clear the oversize needle.

I think the OP would be better off drilling the holes on a drill press, or with a hand drill.

[keithski122]

I have sewn vinyl to 3mm mdf using a juki 563, no special needle and my usual 20 thread.

Edited October 6, 2019 by keithski122

[29EssexRat]

I am in the US, Nebraska, so sadly couldn't pick up that one in the UK.

I have glued the whole thing down, the stitching is for added securement.

Couldn't find any adler, campbell and rand, or landus on eBay that came up with those part numbers. A couple of local ads popped up for a Singer 241-2 and a 78-1? Looks like there's a few posts about them on this forum, but make me feel like those aren't up to the task. I have a week and a half to find one, as I'm headed down to Kansas for work, will look around there too I suppose.

[Gymnast]

I like to link to one of the previous threads on in this forum on the subject:

https://leatherworker.net/forum/topic/66962-sewing-through-leather-and-plywood/?tab=comments#comment-436004

I notice that even Wiz back then wrote a comment, that he once sew plywood with a singer 15-91 with a 110/18 needle and V69 thread.

On ‎10‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 9:48 PM, Matt S said:

All of those machines you listed are domestic machines for sewing shirts and cushions, or garment weight industrials (for sewing shirts and cushions quickly). None of them are suitable for sewing plywood, even lighter stuff. Sadly eBay is full of mislead and misleading persons.

Well this got me a bit provoked, and now I tried sewing plywood on my Singer 201 domestic machine for sewing shirts. And I admit, that it is modified, and this is not for general long time use. This sewing is with a 140/22 regular needle, V138 polyester thread and 4 mm Finnish Plywood.  This is how it looks:

 

[Tejas]

Gymnast, if I understand correctly, at the end of your video you mention a youtube video you made about your machine. Would you please post a link to that video.

[Gymnast]

21 minutes ago, Tejas said:

Gymnast, if I understand correctly, at the end of your video you mention a youtube video you made about your machine. Would you please post a link to that video.

You can look at some details on my channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtdxanz878434pFr2dMhwXw 

An overview of the quite many changes are given in this video: https://youtu.be/_7ML5U_I6DU

Many skilled people have warned against using a machine like this to heavy work. But up to now I have done it for about 5 years and about 100 hours of work in all. It is still working. And this kind of machines are quite cheap second hand in my country. I got one reserve machine on stock.

[RockyAussie]

On 10/6/2019 at 3:38 AM, 29EssexRat said:

This is a one time use, maybe 80 feet of stitching

I have to ask why then you do not just take it to an upholstery place and pay them a few bucks to stitch it up for you. Way way cheaper and probably a better outcome.

Plywood is not that hard to stitch through as some might think but a decent sized machine would be best.

[Wizcrafts]

8 hours ago, Gymnast said:

I notice that even Wiz back then wrote a comment, that he once sew plywood with a singer 15-91 with a 110/18 needle and V69 thread.

That was a soft wood 12" ruler I sewed. It was 1/8 inch thick. It wasn't much denser than saddle skirting.

[Gymnast]

8 minutes ago, Wizcrafts said:

That was a soft wood 12" ruler I sewed. It was 1/8 inch thick. It wasn't much denser than saddle skirting.

Thank you for correcting me Wiz - I am sorry that I got that wrong.

I was a bit suppriced in my test, that I got almost no splinter at the bottom. I suppose, that the small hole in my needle plate helps to limit that problem.

An important question for this work is what size of thread is needed.

I agree with RockyAussie, that you will save a lot of time by asking for help in an upholstery shop.

[Wizcrafts]

55 minutes ago, Gymnast said:

I was a bit suppriced in my test, that I got almost no splinter at the bottom. I suppose, that the small hole in my needle plate helps to limit that problem.

Soft wood yields the best results when a nail or needle punctures all the way through.