What is the Consew 206 of straight stitch machines?

[ensitmike]

I'm looking to add a straight stitch machine to my studio, but haven't worked much with them. My Consew 206 was an easy buy because the machine has a cult following and a great reputation. 

Straight stitch machines seem to be more varied and with less consensus. Does anyone have any experienced recommendations? I'm looking to buy from the used market. Use case would be very light leather (at the heavy end) and down to sewing ripstop nylon material (at the light end).

[Constabulary]

my opinion - basically all drop feed straight stitchers are quite  the same. They may differ a bit technically (rotary hook, or CB hook... different type of thread take up lever...) but there is none really bad I would say (speaking of industrial machines not domestic / home sewing machines). I would look for one with reverse function (older machines sometime lack the reverse function). And if it was me I would look one with for a wider feed dog like Singer 20U or its clones, Pfaff 138, Bernina 217, Adler 1217, Singer 457 (industrial not domestic), Singer 307G2. BTW - all mentioned machines have zig zag too - could be useful too but depends on your needs.

The Singer 457 is a machine with excellent parts situation - you get a lot of different parts and accessories for this model.

BTW - I have a 307G2 and I´m very pleased with it.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Constabulary

[Wizcrafts]

9 hours ago, ensitmike said:

Use case would be very light leather (at the heavy end) and down to sewing ripstop nylon material (at the light end).

The problem with sewing any leather on a bottom feed only machine is that the presser foot exerts a lot of drag on top. This separates the layers and causes shorter than desired stitches that can vary with the drag. Also, the foot pressure spring may not hold down leather on the upstroke. Further, the tensioners and guides may not allow for the use of bonded nylon or bonded polyester thread.

That said, If you find a straight stitch machine for sale locally, bring samples of your materials and the thread you intend to use. A dealer would be in a better position to pick a suitable machine, or modify an existing model. There are kits available to upgrade the feed dog and throat plate on many s.s. machines to transport difficult materials and to use larger needles. It all depends on the build of the machine and the hook type and adjust-ability.

If you do find a suitable straight stitch machine, it may be limited to #69 bonded thread with a #18 needle, or possibly #92 thread with a #19 or #20 needle.

Use leather point needles on leather or creature skins and round points on vinyl, webbing and cloth.

[nylonRigging]

13 hours ago, ensitmike said:

I'm looking to add a straight stitch machine to my studio, but haven't worked much with them. My Consew 206 was an easy buy because the machine has a cult following and a great reputation. 

Straight stitch machines seem to be more varied and with less consensus. Does anyone have any experienced recommendations? I'm looking to buy from the used market. Use case would be very light leather (at the heavy end) and down to sewing ripstop nylon material (at the light end).

( you looking bottom feed ? ) .. It probably has best chance of doing what you are asking . is old Swiss. made Bernina 217 . It the best bottom feed machine ever made, smooth, balanced and superior with it's feed dog design . It one old machine I will never get rid of .
.

Edited April 1, 2020 by nylonRigging

[ensitmike]

18 hours ago, Constabulary said:

my opinion - basically all drop feed straight stitchers are quite  the same. They may differ a bit technically (rotary hook, or CB hook... different type of thread take up lever...) but there is none really bad I would say (speaking of industrial machines not domestic / home sewing machines). I would look for one with reverse function (older machines sometime lack the reverse function). And if it was me I would look one with for a wider feed dog like Singer 20U or its clones, Pfaff 138, Bernina 217, Adler 1217, Singer 457 (industrial not domestic), Singer 307G2. BTW - all mentioned machines have zig zag too - could be useful too but depends on your needs.

The Singer 457 is a machine with excellent parts situation - you get a lot of different parts and accessories for this model.

BTW - I have a 307G2 and I´m very pleased with it.

Thank you for the great response. I think you are absolutely right! A zig-zag would be a better and more versatile unit.The most common around me are definitely the 20u and its clones.

That 307G2 is a NICE looking machine. I'll keep an eye out. 

Do you happen to know which machine would be easiest to get a straight stitch needle plate for (just a hole as opposed to a horizontal slot). I need a small hole needle plate for the ripstop because it often gets pulled down with the needle.

 

9 hours ago, Wizcrafts said:

The problem with sewing any leather on a bottom feed only machine is that the presser foot exerts a lot of drag on top. This separates the layers and causes shorter than desired stitches that can vary with the drag. Also, the foot pressure spring may not hold down leather on the upstroke. Further, the tensioners and guides may not allow for the use of bonded nylon or bonded polyester thread.

That said, If you find a straight stitch machine for sale locally, bring samples of your materials and the thread you intend to use. A dealer would be in a better position to pick a suitable machine, or modify an existing model. There are kits available to upgrade the feed dog and throat plate on many s.s. machines to transport difficult materials and to use larger needles. It all depends on the build of the machine and the hook type and adjust-ability.

If you do find a suitable straight stitch machine, it may be limited to #69 bonded thread with a #18 needle, or possibly #92 thread with a #19 or #20 needle.

Use leather point needles on leather or creature skins and round points on vinyl, webbing and cloth.

I hear you and that is fair. I do sew a lot of other materials so if it isnt stellar I will just not use it for leather projects. My 206 just chews on thiner leather occasionally, so I was looking for a machine that would better handle very thin work. The good news is downgrading the thread size would work well for the lighter work as well so that shouldn't be a problem.

Thanks for the input. All good things to consider.

 

5 hours ago, nylonRigging said:

( you looking bottom feed ? ) .. It probably has best chance of doing what you are asking . is old Swiss. made Bernina 217 . It the best bottom feed machine ever made, smooth, balanced and superior with it's feed dog design . It one old machine I will never get rid of .
.

This is a beautiful machine. I've seen it many times... just wish the prices weren't so high. I'll definitely reconsider this machine. Thanks for the reminder. Great suggestion.

[nylonRigging]

18 hours ago, ensitmike said:

This is a beautiful machine. I've seen it many times... just wish the prices weren't so high. I'll definitely reconsider this machine. Thanks for the reminder. Great suggestion. 

even if it is only a bottom feed, every time I jump behind my old swiss. 217  I am reminded of what old school smooth balance and craftsmanship is for a machine . If you ever manage to score on one, they are a keeper.

they pop-up I see them around here in my AO, used/clean for sale , but they seem to hold pretty steady asking price anywhere from 800-$ to 1-k .

[ensitmike]

1 hour ago, nylonRigging said:

even if it is only a bottom feed, every time I jump behind my old swiss. 217  I am reminded of what old school smooth balance and craftsmanship is for a machine . If you ever manage to score on one, they are a keeper.

they pop-up I see them around here in my AO, used/clean for sale , but they seem to hold pretty steady asking price anywhere from 800-$ to 1-k .

Yea. There are two in my area at $800 and $1400. Unfortunate.

I really messed up. about 8 months ago I had the opportunity to get a Bernina 117 head for around $250 but I was just too busy... should have done it.

Now I have tons of time and am kicking myself.

[ensitmike]

Thanks for the advice all. I am picking this 20u-33 up tomorrow. They claim fully functional, but that the motor doesn't work. That is fine with me because I was going to grab a servo anyways. This is almost ideal.

Best part... it is a trade for a Kennedy toolbox that I got at Goodwill for $25. I'd say thats a score.

 

 

[dikman]

$25?? As long as the head is working that's a bargain!

[ensitmike]

20 minutes ago, dikman said:

$25?? As long as the head is working that's a bargain!

To be fair, the toolbox I'm selling retails for $265. Resale market is around $120. At the end of the day it cost me $25 though.

Looks like a family selling items from an estate than none of the family members wanted. That is usually a good sign. I know my way around a machine enough to make the functional call I think though. Whenever there is also a sewn item left under the foot, I'm almost always optimistic.

[Northmount]

And the 20U has a single hole needle plate available, so becomes a straight stitch machine.  I have switched mine over.

Tom

 

[Gymnast]

On 4/1/2020 at 7:27 PM, Wizcrafts said:

The problem with sewing any leather on a bottom feed only machine is that the presser foot exerts a lot of drag on top. This separates the layers and causes shorter than desired stitches that can vary with the drag. Also, the foot pressure spring may not hold down leather on the upstroke.

I agree, that this is the main problem for a bottom feed machine compared to a walking foot machine. But I think, that it is not only the presser foot, that make the drag on top. Another reason for the drag on the top is the needle thread tension combined with the presser foot. A modified presser foot can reduce this part of the problem significantly as explained in the video: https://youtu.be/rBIulDuhDDs

[Wizcrafts]

2 hours ago, Gymnast said:

Another reason for the drag on the top is the needle thread tension combined with the presser foot

Correct! However, if one reduces the top and bottom tensions to the minimum needed to maintain a reasonably tight stitch, the thread drag will be minimized. Couple that with an aftermarket heavy duty feed dog and throat plate and a bottom feeder, coupled with a roller or Teflon foot will move leather and vinyl reasonably well. It will still be limited to fairly thin thread and needle sizes. I used this approach when I was in between being completely out of the leather business and when I began reacquiring industrial sewing machines. I had to make do with a Singer 15-91, which I beefed up as I described. It was passable until the right machines came along.

[rburson]

  I use a 20U for my linings and other Fabric needs it is a very solid machine. Mine is setup with a servo motor and runs very smooth. When I first got it it had a clutch motor I don't think I would have any fingers left if I tried to sew at those speeds. I just ordered a single hole needle plate from Amazon it arrived in 4 days and came with a feed dog. I was having issues making masks to donate the thin fabric was trying to get stuck in the needle plate hole

[ensitmike]

9 hours ago, rburson said:

  I use a 20U for my linings and other Fabric needs it is a very solid machine. Mine is setup with a servo motor and runs very smooth. When I first got it it had a clutch motor I don't think I would have any fingers left if I tried to sew at those speeds. I just ordered a single hole needle plate from Amazon it arrived in 4 days and came with a feed dog. I was having issues making masks to donate the thin fabric was trying to get stuck in the needle plate hole

Absolutely! That is exactly why I got it, so that is great to hear. Will also sew fabric outdoor gear and some clothing.

Versatility drew me too it as well, but also when I found out how common it is, I knew parts would be easy to come by and cheap for years to come. I might even hook the knee lever to the stitch width lever and try some old time, "general store" name embroidery on handkerchiefs, jackets, etc.

 

[ensitmike]

paging @Constabulary

Hope you don't mind me calling you, but I found some interesting things you said on this post.

 

I am curious if the needle bar hack you mention is universal. I ask because my 20u uses the same system as the Singer 212g141 mentioned here. I would like to be able to interchange needles with my 135x17 Consew 206 though.

If raising the needle bar is both possible and doesn't have any downsides, I might just do that.