Question about belt length

[KennethM]

Hey guys, I really want to start making some belts, maybe make them for Christmas gifts for the family.

My question is, I know the belt blank needs to be longer then the acutal pant size, but how much?

For example if I wear size 34 pants, what belt length would I need?

[Handstitched]

G'Day, while everyone on here will have their own method, I have never used the size of jeans etc. as a measurement. I've always used a tape measure around the customers waist for an accurate measurement. Theres normally  5 holes on a belt an inch apart, , so if your waist is  34" that would be the centre hole on the belt.  

HS 

[Rahere]

Depends on how much your waist's likely to change and  how you intend to fix the buckle. Let's look at that last one first, as a fer-instance.

I'll presume the most common is a loop-and-tongue buckle, where the "standing end" loops around a tongue, folding back on itself before being riveted.

You'll need anything between one and two centimeters for the wrap, about 1.5cm for the retainer, and up to 5cm for riveting it back, or stitching if a light leather. Make that end up first, so you've then got a baseline.

Belts made for the mass market also have to allow for the step between lengths - usually 5cm/2in units. That's not necessary if you're making for someone.

Then, you have to allow for the individual. Our ladies waists can be significantly further around some weeks, which is sometimes catered for by elastic near the buckle. Or if you're coping with a banker, going from the gym to a Corporate Reception...in general, you'll allow a couple of inches for times it's sucked in, and another couple for blowouts.

And finally, you need overlap in being able to pass the tongue comfortably through the buckle in the last instance. Say at least a couple of inches.

So, in your case, a 34 inch waist, add 2.5 inches for the buckle end, another 2.5 inches for blow-out, and 3 inches for the tongue pass-through. 42 inches. Your hole punching starts about 5.5 inches in from the tip, and yuo'll want 5 running backwards from that point - 7 if commercial.

Always remember you can'r add more on, but you can add more holes, so err on the generous side. You can always add another loop! In fact, in mediaeval days it was common to fold the belt tails around the buckle end and back under the tongue, leaving the surplus to dangle. One reason for this is because they might need to allow for extra layers of thick clothes, including furs, in winter.

[Hildebrand]

Don Gonzales has a great utube video that explains this perfectly. 
 

Todd

[HondoMan]

@KennethM, I make several belts per week and this seems to suit near on every customer.  There are various things you'll need to figure on your own.  Sorry, I only use the metric system.  I did learn the imperal system years ago in school, but don't use it enough to know what you would need here.

Men's belts have roughly 2.5mm between holes and women 2mm.  Kids and teenagers can be 2mm or 1.5mm.  Take into account the body shape and size.

Stay with 5 or 7 holes.  Other amounts offer and unprofessional appearance and it is problematic if you offer an even number.  The center hole is the current size.

It is best to have the client offer their current belt - with holes!  These woven type belts are very difficult to get a proper measure. 

Measuring the current belt.  If one googles how, there will be several methods.  There is only one proper way.  Laying the belt flat and as straight as can be, measure from the currently used hole to the point where the tine and buckle frame meet.  This is how the belt is worn.  Do not measure to the end of the frame or to the end of the leather.  Buckles come on various lengths, so measuring to the end of the buckle or end of the leather do not offer the current length.  Also consider the thickness of the current belt and the leather you will use to make a belt.  This will need to be considered for the new belt.  It may be 1mm or less.  Also, ask the client how that current hole is for them.  Is it a wee tight, loose or perfect.  If too thight, perhaps 5mm additional might suit.  Same for too loose.  The idea is when they put on their new belt, the middle hole need to used and should be comfortable.  Not too tight or loose.

If the client wants a 5 hole belt, the tip of the belt to the middle hole need be 15cm.  If it is a 7 hole belt, then it will be 17,5cm to the center hole.

I tend to add 8cm for the bend back (part to be sewn where the buckle is).  That is simply my choice.  Shorter can do as well, but not too short.  For a plain belt, the stitching may be the only decoration to the belt and a longer bend back can offer a stunning appearance with a slight contrast in thread colour. 

On that, do not stitch across the belt.  This will weaken the leather at the buckle.  From the buckle, stitch along the edge to the end of the bend back.  Make your stitch line 4mm from the edge.  3mm is too close to the edge and your irons or awl will cause the edge to have a 'lumpy' appearance.  More than 4mm will cause the leather at the bend back to open at the edge.  Also, don't use too thin a thread.  I tend to use either 8mm or 1mm thread.  6mm is ok.  Less than that is simply too thin.

From the hole the buckle tine go through, come back to the tip of the belt about 2,5cm and skive the belt to the end of the bend back.  The reason, if the leather for the belt is 3,5mm thick, if this is not skived down, one will have 10,5mm of leather at the buckle (bend back area plus the tip of the belt.  That's a lot of leather.  Skive down to about 2-2.5mm.  Use caution not to make it too thin. 

If you are using a D shaped buckle or single frame, you will need a keeper.  How wide you make it and secure it is your choice.  Sewing it into the belt is best, but can prove difficult for a beginner.  What is important is the distance from the buckle to the keeper.  Too far away and the trouser belt loops ge in the way.  So, from the edge of the long hole for the tine, come back 3cm towards the tip of the belt or 3cm away from that long hole.  This distance will be perfect.

Lastly, if you have a 40mm wide buckle, you want 38mm wide leather.  For a 35mm buckle, 33mm wide leather, etc.

If you are adding a maker's stamp or other tooling, consider also how the client wears their belt.  Traditionally, men put their belts on to the left and women to the right, but today that does not really hold true.  Either ask or look.  This is important as you wouldn't want your logo or tooling to be upside-down.  It is also important if you have a buckle with some type of design or logo.  These are generally meant for people who slide their belt on to the left.  If such a buckle is for someone who wears their belt to the right, you might wish to mention this. 

Hope that helps get you sorted.  Don't forget to post photos of your work.  Would like to see your first few belts...soon!

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by HondoMan

[chuck123wapati]

the Al Stohlman books are great info, he has at least two on belt making and they were free on the Tandy site. https://www.leathercraftlibrary.com/category/79/ebooks?pagenum=1

[Frodo]

[Aven]

11 hours ago, KennethM said:

Hey guys, I really want to start making some belts, maybe make them for Christmas gifts for the family.

My question is, I know the belt blank needs to be longer then the acutal pant size, but how much?

For example if I wear size 34 pants, what belt length would I need?

Size 34 pants is, depending on the brand, your waist (skin) measurement.  Some brands mark their waists an inch smaller, meaning that if your waist was 34", their pants that fit you would be a 33".  Makes people feel good about themselves.  You also have to decide if the belt is for jeans or for dress.  The thickness of the jean material vs cloth pants can be a belt hole different in circumference.  You really need to measure them in the pants they want the belt for.  A "try on" belt that has holes from like 18" from the buckle to 50" past the buckle lets them try it on, figure out the hole that works for them.  It keeps the ego out of the process.

[Northmount]

5 hours ago, HondoMan said:

Men's belts have roughly 2.5mm between holes and women 2mm.  Kids and teenagers can be 2mm or 1.5mm.  Take into account the body shape and size.

I believe that should be cm rather than mm.  For inches, men's may be 3/4" to 1".  For women's and children's, 5/8" to 3/4".

Tom

[KennethM]

Thank you everyone for the feed back..a great deal of Information. 

I made myself a belt and it came out nice but it's a tad to long in my opinion. I used a chart I found on this website.

I want to start selling them in batches through my Instagram and Etsy ,so having a custom measurements sent to me seems counter productive? They may measure wrong or simply give me wrong measurements on purpose with the hope of a free belt Soni don't get a bad review (there out there,those Karen's)

I was just trying to see if there a standard math formula,kinda like what mass belt producers do..for instance just add X amount of inches to the pant size..in my head seems like there has to be a possible way

[Rahere]

That's why I talked of 5 and 7 holes. 5 if you're making for a known waist, but because belt lengths are normally sold in 2" increments, that means 2 more notches for those who fall between lengths one way or the other. 2" is 5 cm, so @HondoMan's 2.5cm is the same as our inch. For the ladies, 18"-34" should meet most needs (to be frank, 24 at the bottom end, but you'll always come across the sub-teen who just MUST have a small one). For guys, 28"-48", or 58" in the US.

[Rahere]

Another question for those needing to cope with plate buckles, the pin can be offset from the rail enough to need to be taken into account in reducing the belt length. How do you cope with those who want to change the plate according to the time of day? Snaps? It also argues for having a decent rivet-setter, at the least a hand-lever machine.

And then there's the market for plumbing straps in tornado alley...

[Northmount]

1 hour ago, KennethM said:

for instance just add X amount of inches to the pant size

Pant sizes are all over the place.  Some stretched, some have shrunk, so you can't go by pant size.  If you research this more on this site, you will find all kinds of stories about mistakes and lessons learned about using pant sizes.  Also depends on where they wear the pants, under or over their dunlap tire!

So for Etsy or other places, you would likely be better off making standard sizes to stock and sell.

If custom making, you need to set up a measuring strap as other threads have suggested, so you get a real measure you can more likely trust, as long as they are honest in measuring and recording the number.

Tom

[Rahere]

And don't forget even a measuring strap will stretch in time.

[KennethM]

So when getting custom belt orders online from customers on the other side of the globe...you still get them to measure there own waist?

[HondoMan]

10 hours ago, KennethM said:

So when getting custom belt orders online from customers on the other side of the globe...you still get them to measure there own waist?

From experience, it's a non-starter.  I no longer take internet orders, emails, texts, or phone calls which involve measuring, be it dog collars, belts, armbands or cuffs, etc.  Kenneth, if you decide to have a wee go, it will not prove well.  I can near on guarantee that the client's ability to measure will be different from yours.

I tried explaining to customers countless times, and it very rarely is accurate.  It is not necessarily the fault of the client.  I have numerous rules and tailor's tapes in me shop and nearly all are different.  Perhaps the first 10cm are identical, but then it all goes to hell.  Also, some will 'cheat' and simply tell you that their belt size is 95, for example, since it appears on the inside.  For some companies, that means to the end of the leather and some meaning to the end of the buckle frame.

If you chose to take an online order, prepare yourself for 'the belt is too long or too short'.

[Handstitched]

On 9/12/2020 at 9:18 AM, Northmount said:

Pant sizes are all over the place.  Some stretched, some have shrunk, so you can't go by pant size.

Exactly  its  never an accurate measurement.   I have never used an old belt as a guide for the same reason. They're stretched & out of shape .......and made from vinyl , and some customers aren't always    sure which hole  they're actually using  .

 @HondoMan When customers come to my stall, I always get them to measure their own waist, no physical contact ( nothing to do with covid btw) , then I make a determination / recommendation / give  advice. If its say 40", that will be the centre hole. I can work the rest out myself. 

@KennethM If all else fails, just follow the ' Al Stohlman Method' . Its worked for me ( and countless others )  thus far  

HS 

[paloma]

On 9/11/2020 at 3:43 AM, HondoMan said:

@KennethM, I make several belts per week and this seems to suit near on every customer.  There are various things you'll need to figure on your own.  Sorry, I only use the metric system.  I did learn the imperal system years ago in school, but don't use it enough to know what you would need here.

Men's belts have roughly 2.5mm between holes and women 2mm.  Kids and teenagers can be 2mm or 1.5mm.  Take into account the body shape and size.
 

??? i think it's an error

Edited September 14, 2020 by Northmount

[paloma]

Usually between two holes I leave a gap of up to 30 mm between the width of the belt and the hole.

over 30mm I leave half for example for a 40mm wide belt I leave 2 centimetres

Edited September 14, 2020 by paloma