Hand Sewing

[JamesCaldwell]

Just getting back into leather and want to learn to hand sew. I have Al Stohlman's book,The art of hand sewing. He recommends unwaxed linen thread. Is that still the best to use for sewing. Won't be doing anything elaborate, just simple projects for now. Thanks, James

[fredk]

I use pre-waxed polyester thread in different thicknesses and colours, but mainly dark brown, light brown or black. Either pre-waxed or waxing during sewing is a must

[Bob Blea]

I use pre waxed polyester cord from Maine Thread.  It's good quality and comes in many different colors and isn't very expensive.  I think it's a good starting place for getting good at hand sewing.

[zuludog]

Stohlman's book is good, but it's a bit dated now. You can still follow his advice if you wish, but things have moved on a bit --

Synthetic, polyester threads, both braided and twisted, have become much more popular, though you can still use linen if you wish. For both types ready waxed is widely available, though you can give it an extra rub if you want. And there is a wider range of colours available

Have a look at Rocky Mountains Leather Supply. they have Ritza 25, aka Tiger Thread, which is a very popular braided polyester thread. Normally it is sold in large reels which makes it expensive to buy into, but RMLS sell smaller reels at reasonable prices

RMLS sell Twist thread, both linen and twisted polyester; it is the Chinese Yue Fung make sold under their own label, and it's very good

I have used all three types, and can recommend them

Search YouTube for 'how to saddle stitch' and 'thread for leatherwork' 

[Danne]

1 hour ago, zuludog said:

Stohlman's book is good, but it's a bit dated now. You can still follow his advice if you wish, but things have moved on a bit --

Synthetic, polyester threads, both braided and twisted, have become much more popular, though you can still use linen if you wish. For both types ready waxed is widely available, though you can give it an extra rub if you want. And there is a wider range of colours available

Have a look at Rocky Mountains Leather Supply. they have Ritza 25, aka Tiger Thread, which is a very popular braided polyester thread. Normally it is sold in large reels which makes it expensive to buy into, but RMLS sell smaller reels at reasonable prices

RMLS sell Twist thread, both linen and twisted polyester; it is the Chinese Yue Fung make sold under their own label, and it's very good

I have used all three types, and can recommend them

Search YouTube for 'how to saddle stitch' and 'thread for leatherwork' 

Isn't Meisi the producer of RMLS Twist and Yue Fung?

[Danne]

I wouldn't use thread without wax. And there are a lot of options to choose from. I have tried a decent amount of different threads.

The ones I use is Meisi linen and Meisi Xiange twist (Poly thread with a linen look) When it comes to linen thread I switched from Sajou Fil au chinois. (Lin cable) to Meisi, because Meisi is a lot more consistent. Some people say that Lin cable is a more durable thread, linen thread is not durable no matter who produce it. Not compared to a synthetic thread.

Ps Meisi have a free sample pack with a couple of full spools and a decent amount of smaller "sample size" you pay for shipping. Can be worth to try if you do small leather goods. 

But of course there are a lot of good alternatives out there depending on the style you are looking for. For example if I would make knife sheats and gun holsters, I would probably have a look at Ritza25 (Tiger thread)

Edited February 18, 2021 by Danne

[Handstitched]

@JamesCaldwell  Welcome to the forum , and good to hear you're getting back in to leather

I have always relied upon Al Stohlmans books . Youtube have some good vids on handstitching too. 

I've always used waxed threads .

Good luck  

HS

[JamesCaldwell]

Gentlemen, Thanks for the responses. I wondered about the synthetic threads if that might be the way to go now. Built a Stitching horse over the weekend and am anxious to get started. Thanks again, James 

[mike02130]

The reasons to wax your thread,

1, Lubrication.

2, It protects the thread from fraying.

3, Helps hold the tread tight when you cinch it down.  

I tried using unwaxed on small runs when numbers 1 and 2 aren't so important  but when cinching the thread I can see it untighten after cinching vs using waxed.

[Matt S]

Linen is certainly softer on the hands, but synthetics can be pretty good these days, and often cheaper than linen. Ritza "tiger" is a popular premium flat-braided polyester thread for hand stitching. The braid eliminates twisting issues and gives a chunkier look than laid thread. It's also usually available in a wider range of colours than linen.

Waxing the thread by hand is a definite "yes" for me, whether the thread is prewaxed or not. Beeswax is okay and better than nothing, but handwax/coad is miles better, and honestly I see its lack of mention in Stohlman's works as an indication of the limits of his experience and/or the extent to which he wanted to push what was available at Tandy for the quickest results possible. 

Coad can be any number of concoctions but a good one is beeswax and pine rosin, say 2:1 or 3:1, maybe with a tiny bit of linseed oil thrown in. Melt them together in a double boiler setup (bean tin in a pan of water), then pour the mess into a big bowl of lukewarm water. Grab the glob and start pulling it apart and recombining while keeping it underwater to avoid burns.  Keep going until it cools enough to not burn you when you pull it out the water and keep pulling it apart and smooshing it together, finally rounding it as it starts to get hard. Use this coad as you would beeswax -- pinch the thread to the wax and draw it through with some gusto, at least a half-dozen times. You'll find that coad stays on the thread better (straight beeswax can flake off like dust); melts as you draw the thread for lubrication; holds stitches together better where they cross over; gets on your fingers and helps to grasp the needles. There's loads of different ingredients and mixtures you can use, and some experimentation is needed depending on your environment and preference. You may need different mixes in the summer and winter.

[tsunkasapa]

The purpose of the unwaxed thread was to work the TAPER into the end of the thread, he said to wax it after that. It isn't impossible to taper the end of waxed thread, but it is difficult and can be frustrating. As for synthetic threads, I do not put plastic into my leather projects, only linen or hemp. YMMV

[45rjb222]

As with anything times change. Now it depends on the look you desire for your project or the use of the project being made. Properly used un waxed linen will last a life time.  After getting the taper you desire wax the thread just plain old bees wax works well, if your project is going to be submitted to moisture then use a cobblers wax this will darken the thread a bit but it will absolutely lock your stitch and almost totally water proof your thread. I personally prefer in natural threads Linen over hemp I find hemp brittle and stiff. All the polestar threads sew ok if you desire a round thread look them Vimeo or Twist will suit but the true classic look is a 3/18 linen. Ritza is a flat braid makes a nice stitch not too expensive and will last your lifetime for sure.

[chuck123wapati]

Threads may have changed but Stohlmans techniques are still spot on, everyday almost questions are asked here that are covered many times in his writings.

You can get more of his stuff free on the tandy site. https://www.leathercraftlibrary.com/category/79/ebooks?pagenum=1

[fredk]

On 2/18/2021 at 3:35 PM, tsunkasapa said:

The purpose of the unwaxed thread was to work the TAPER into the end of the thread, he said to wax it after that. It isn't impossible to taper the end of waxed thread, but it is difficult and can be frustrating. . . .

I have a very large spool of thread which is not waxed. After I cut off a length I wax about 3 inches of the ends, taper, thread on needle, then pull the rest of that thread through a block of beeswax. Waxing the ends helps to keep the individual threads together and make a good taper

[Danne]

12 hours ago, 45rjb222 said:

As with anything times change. Now it depends on the look you desire for your project or the use of the project being made. Properly used un waxed linen will last a life time.  After getting the taper you desire wax the thread just plain old bees wax works well, if your project is going to be submitted to moisture then use a cobblers wax this will darken the thread a bit but it will absolutely lock your stitch and almost totally water proof your thread. I personally prefer in natural threads Linen over hemp I find hemp brittle and stiff. All the polestar threads sew ok if you desire a round thread look them Vimeo or Twist will suit but the true classic look is a 3/18 linen. Ritza is a flat braid makes a nice stitch not too expensive and will last your lifetime for sure.

This is no critique. I'm just curious. What type of linen thread is this? Because my experience from linen thread (thinner thread around 0.5mm) is that for example a wallet that have been used 1-2 years in a jeans pocket needs to be restitched if I used linen thread. 

The thread is this case have been Fil Au Chinois 632. And this is the reason I now prefer to use synthetic thread instead.

[Hardrada]

7 hours ago, Danne said:

The thread is this case have been Fil Au Chinois 632. And this is the reason I now prefer to use synthetic thread instead.

Hmm, I just got a spool of that, thinking of using it for a wallet, because the 0.6 mm Tiger thread looked kinda thick for this application. One thing I didn't like about the Lin Cable is that it's not as waxed as Tiger: I couldn't melt the Lin's ends—they smouldered but didn't melt. How do you handle this last part of the stitching?

[45rjb222]

9 hours ago, Danne said:

This is no critique. I'm just curious. What type of linen thread is this? Because my experience from linen thread (thinner thread around 0.5mm) is that for example a wallet that have been used 1-2 years in a jeans pocket needs to be restitched if I used linen thread. 

The thread is this case have been Fil Au Chinois 632. And this is the reason I now prefer to use synthetic thread instead.

I have never used Fil Au Chinois So I cant form a real opinion on this thread. I still have some 3/18 that is tough thread. Its a larger diameter than 0.06 Ritza which i use a lot of now. When stating longevity I used to do Harness and Saddle work and burried my thread in a groove where it did not wear as far as wax I used it was a cobblers wax I learned to make from my grand father. basic recipe was bees wax pine tar and rosin. That wax locked the stitch and it wouldn't rot Unless you berried it for a couple years. Anything will wear when its rubbed. I have changed how I stitch and what I use due to Nigel Armitage.  I appreciate Nigel's knowledge and processes.

[mike02130]

2 hours ago, Hardrada said:

I couldn't melt the Lin's ends—they smouldered but didn't melt. How do you handle this last part of the stitching?

Linen doesn't melt.  I back stitch then cut my thread short and tuck it in the hole with a small dab of glue.

[YinTx]

9 hours ago, Danne said:

What type of linen thread is this? Because my experience from linen thread (thinner thread around 0.5mm) is that for example a wallet that have been used 1-2 years in a jeans pocket needs to be restitched if I used linen thread. 

 

Wow, I haven't had this issue.  Been using Fil Au Chinois on many a wallet, never had one come back.  Have used them myself for years on end, never had one even fray.  I have been using 432 and 532, perhaps that makes a difference.

I have had some 532 fail on a dog collar where the dog was scratching the collar with a hind leg, bit extreme use though.  Not sure how much grooving would have helped that.  Also had a 532 fail on the fold of a phone case/wallet after about four years of constant daily use.  It did not come unstitched at all, just had two of the threads break.

Obviously, YMMV!

YinTx

[Danne]

12 hours ago, Hardrada said:

Hmm, I just got a spool of that, thinking of using it for a wallet, because the 0.6 mm Tiger thread looked kinda thick for this application. One thing I didn't like about the Lin Cable is that it's not as waxed as Tiger: I couldn't melt the Lin's ends—they smouldered but didn't melt. How do you handle this last part of the stitching?

Ps also order the sample pack from Meisi (You get a couple of full spools and also sample packs) and you pay shipping. I think you Will like Xiange Twist, it's a synthetic thread that have a linen look. (I have some photos of products I've used it on, if you wanna see)

It depends, if I bartack a watch strap (like loop around the edges) I either tie it inside, och use some super glue before I pull the thread tight, and also some on the back side in the hole.

On a wallet I back stitch and some white glue on the thread before I pull tight and also som white glue in the hole.

[Danne]

10 hours ago, YinTx said:

 

Wow, I haven't had this issue.  Been using Fil Au Chinois on many a wallet, never had one come back.  Have used them myself for years on end, never had one even fray.  I have been using 432 and 532, perhaps that makes a difference.

I have had some 532 fail on a dog collar where the dog was scratching the collar with a hind leg, bit extreme use though.  Not sure how much grooving would have helped that.  Also had a 532 fail on the fold of a phone case/wallet after about four years of constant daily use.  It did not come unstitched at all, just had two of the threads break.

Obviously, YMMV!

YinTx

New:

After use, cleaned but not restitched:

Restitched with Xiange Twist:

[YinTx]

I've heard that if the holes are too big in relation to the thread, it allows the thread to move in the hole and rub, cutting itself like a little saw.  Maybe that is the difference, and why we both had failures at the same place, where the bend allows the thread to rub in a hole that is too big for the thread?  This is supposedly why you don't want to use a stitching chisel to punch all the way through leather in an application like a saddle, where there is a lot of movement and stress, and the tiniest exit hole from the awl is preferred, and a thread size that is very hard to pull through the hole so there is little room for movement.  Maybe someone with understanding/experience on this theory can pipe in?

YinTx

[Retswerb]

On 2/17/2021 at 4:07 PM, Danne said:

Ps Meisi have a free sample pack with a couple of full spools and a decent amount of smaller "sample size" you pay for shipping.

Do you have a link for this? I went on their website and didn’t find any reference to a sample pack.

[Danne]

2 minutes ago, Retswerb said:

Do you have a link for this? I went on their website and didn’t find any reference to a sample pack.

http://www.meisi108.com/product-17210-23781-85397.html

Contact them on Instagram for order: https://www.instagram.com/meisi108/

[Retswerb]

Thanks @Danne! I googled meisi thread and ended up on threadsofmeisi.com which appears completely different.