really struggling with which sewing machine

[ToddW]

Somewhat new to Leather Working but spending a lot of time on it these days..  A bit of background.. I predominately make wallets, coasters, pen cases up to messenger bags or small laptop/ipad bags.  I currently hand cut everything and hand sew.  Started out with the cheap stuff and find myself rebuying nicer stuff.  As an example, just replaced my cheap pricking irons with Sinabroks.  Looking to make my next purchases.. Sewing Machine and clicker (or maybe laser). My first first purchase was one of the Chinese Cobler Sewing Machine which was probably a waste of money but saw some videos on Youtube where they were tuned to do leather working and the price was right..  I have watched Youtube after Youtube and everyone has their view on sewing machines.  Juki, COBRA Cowboy, old singer, tek sew, weaver, adler.. cylinder arm vs bed...  seems a lot of people have 2 machines..  I would prefer not to spend $3K plus on a machine so used is probably the route I will go.  If I have a model that I am looking for, I am very good at finding one used.  Could someone point me in the right direction for a machine good for wallets but be able to handle a messenger type bag.  I want something with a large bobbin for long runs on my bags.  Thickness usually runs 2.0-2.2mm on the leather for my bags although I did some dog collars that were in the 4 or 5mm thick,  Just need something versatile..

Thoughts.. Right now, I think I am leaning towards the Cobra class 20 or the class 26..  I like that they have the speed reducer and servo motor out of the gate.

 

Thoughts?? Any help is appreciated!

[Hags]

I bought a cobra class 3. It works very well on the holsters and sheaths I predominately make, but is not the best suited machine for lighter leathers. Really, I think it was a bit of overkill for 2 layers of 7/8, but I do like the cylinder arm. I would take a look at the cobra (or similar) class 26 machine. I believe Makers leather supply has a video on it. Might be the one. 

[ToddW]

I found a Artisan 618 with Table and servo motor with speed control included with bobbin spinner, Large M bobbin..  I kinda wanted the cylinder arm for bag gussets but this is a lot cheaper being used.  I am thinking this cover the wallets & Journal covers I do.. Not sure how it will handle the computer bags.

[ToddW]

The more I dig, the more I get confused.  I did find the Artisian 618 used which seems like a good deal as its sub-$1000 but not a no brainer deal.  Was really like the Cobra class 26 but looks like the Techsew 2750 Pro is a bit better.  I see some saying the Cowboy is $500 cheaper.  so confused.. The new ones have financing available making it bit easier on the pocket book leaving money for a clicker or laser.

[kgg]

1 hour ago, ToddW said:

The more I dig, the more I get confused.

Yes the selection of machines can be confusing, at times overwhelming with machines having similar specs and trying to figure out what some of the clone machines are closely related to. If I were now looking for one primary machine that would cover most items I would try and figure out what items would fall in the 90 percent bracket and buy either a really good used or new brand name machine to cover those items. If those items are done better on a flatbed like wallets then buy a Juki DNU-1541S (new~$1800US used ???). If you are doing 50 / 50 then get a cylinder arm machine and with a table top attachment like a Juki LS-1341(~$4000US) or and older Juki LS-341.

Buy Once Cry Once

kgg

 

[ToddW]

right now, I am doing mostly wallets but have a strong desire to make bags..  I will ultimately get there so want a cylinder arm with a detachable bed.

[RockyAussie]

This machine might be a good one for you to consider -

There are a few more video's on this machine on my youtube channel as well if you want to see more.

[Voodoo63]

On 1/12/2022 at 10:51 AM, ToddW said:

Somewhat new to Leather Working but spending a lot of time on it these days..  A bit of background.. I predominately make wallets, coasters, pen cases up to messenger bags or small laptop/ipad bags.  I currently hand cut everything and hand sew.  Started out with the cheap stuff and find myself rebuying nicer stuff.  As an example, just replaced my cheap pricking irons with Sinabroks.  Looking to make my next purchases.. Sewing Machine and clicker (or maybe laser). My first first purchase was one of the Chinese Cobler Sewing Machine which was probably a waste of money but saw some videos on Youtube where they were tuned to do leather working and the price was right..  I have watched Youtube after Youtube and everyone has their view on sewing machines.  Juki, COBRA Cowboy, old singer, tek sew, weaver, adler.. cylinder arm vs bed...  seems a lot of people have 2 machines..  I would prefer not to spend $3K plus on a machine so used is probably the route I will go.  If I have a model that I am looking for, I am very good at finding one used.  Could someone point me in the right direction for a machine good for wallets but be able to handle a messenger type bag.  I want something with a large bobbin for long runs on my bags.  Thickness usually runs 2.0-2.2mm on the leather for my bags although I did some dog collars that were in the 4 or 5mm thick,  Just need something versatile..

Thoughts.. Right now, I think I am leaning towards the Cobra class 20 or the class 26..  I like that they have the speed reducer and servo motor out of the gate.

 

Thoughts?? Any help is appreciated!

We have a cobra class 26 2019 model used 2 or 3 times. 

[jokker1978]

On 1/17/2022 at 12:33 AM, RockyAussie said:

This machine might be a good one for you to consider -

There are a few more video's on this machine on my youtube channel as well if you want to see more.

What cowboy is that ?

[Wizcrafts]

2 hours ago, jokker1978 said:

What cowboy is that ?

That is the CB-6900.

[RockyAussie]

4 hours ago, Wizcrafts said:

That is the CB-6900.

In the USA it is known as a Cowboy LS - 1341. It is a very good machine for a broad range of leather good manufacturing. I have done a few videos on it and have a couple of other ones I would like to get done yet as well. The very wide range of feet you can get for this machine so easily is one of its great features as well as the fantastic control it offers.

[discipledesigned]

On 1/19/2022 at 11:33 PM, Voodoo63 said:

We have a cobra class 26 2019 model used 2 or 3 times. 

does it have the EPS?

[ToddW]

56 minutes ago, discipledesigned said:

does it have the EPS?

That one tickled a question which I thought I did not think I need EPS but curious as you asking about it.  When I was looking at the the various machines, I was told"

 

"If you do not know what the EPS motor is it will probably be overkill… it is a motor designed for factory style working… it puts the needle back in the same spot every time it stops… which could be time saving but could also make you hate it…. It is a GREAT motor…BUT do not put something real expensive under it automatically, it has some getting use to it…. It puts the needle back in the same spot every time so if you do not take your foot off at the right time it will go ahead and make that stitch, and leather is not very forgiving… so you will have a hole in a project you did not want… so just train yourself… or get the regular servo…"

 

That had me at a pass unless I am missing something..

[dikman]

Todd, that was my experience, I sometimes ended up with a hole where I didn't want it! I'm sure it is due to lack of experience, but I don't do enough with the machine it's on to become that familiar with it. So I took it off. Besides, as I've mentioned before, my machines go slow enough that I can control exactly where I want the needle without using an EPS.

[RockyAussie]

22 hours ago, ToddW said:

That one tickled a question which I thought I did not think I need EPS but curious as you asking about it.  When I was looking at the the various machines, I was told"

 

"If you do not know what the EPS motor is it will probably be overkill… it is a motor designed for factory style working… it puts the needle back in the same spot every time it stops… which could be time saving but could also make you hate it…. It is a GREAT motor…BUT do not put something real expensive under it automatically, it has some getting use to it…. It puts the needle back in the same spot every time so if you do not take your foot off at the right time it will go ahead and make that stitch, and leather is not very forgiving… so you will have a hole in a project you did not want… so just train yourself… or get the regular servo…"

 

That had me at a pass unless I am missing something..

I have some machines that have eps and some that don't. The ones I have can have the needle always stop in the out position or the down position. I always have them stop in the down position and hand wheel if I want to take the job out which is usually at the end of the job. When I say the down position this is normally when the needle has just started coming up and the job is safe to turn without having to worry about missing a stitch. Getting that position without an eps can be a bit slow and time consuming depending on the job. If I were to be stitching something like bullet loops down ....up a few stitches stop and turn a few stitches stop and turn etc then for sure an eps you want. Like most things it will take a little time to master but once you learn to stop just short of the last stitch you can save some time not worrying about fixing up corners that you missed a stitch on.

[ToddW]

1 hour ago, RockyAussie said:

I have some machines that have eps and some that don't. The ones I have can have the needle always stop in the out position or the down position. I always have them stop in the down position and hand wheel if I want to take the job out which is usually at the end of the job. When I say the down position this is normally when the needle has just started coming up and the job is safe to turn without having to worry about missing a stitch. Getting that position without an eps can be a bit slow and time consuming depending on the job. If I were to be stitching something like bullet loops down ....up a few stitches stop and turn a few stitches stop and turn etc then for sure an eps you want. Like most things it will take a little time to master but once you learn to stop just short of the last stitch you can save some time not worrying about fixing up corners that you missed a stitch on.

Would you recommend EPS for someone buying their first sewing machine.  Two schools of thought there.. no bad habits yet or not experienced enough yet..

[MtlBiker]

20 minutes ago, ToddW said:

Would you recommend EPS for someone buying their first sewing machine.  Two schools of thought there.. no bad habits yet or not experienced enough yet..

I would.  You can always turn it off if you don’t like or need it for a particular job.  As as others said you can set it to always stop with the needle down in the material or up.  If you do small items like pouches or wallets with sharp corners at least for me it was very worthwhile because you only want to turn your fabric assembly with the needle down.  And particularly when less experienced that could be tough without EPS.  And if you turn without having the needle buried you risk screwing up your job.  I love having it and wish all my machines did.

Something else I haven’t seen mentioned yet is that when you stop sewing and want to remove your assembly you can tap on the front edge of the foot pedal and the needle will move to the top position. No need to turn the hand wheel manually to do that.

i hope this is of help.

 

[RockyAussie]

6 hours ago, ToddW said:

Would you recommend EPS for someone buying their first sewing machine.  Two schools of thought there.. no bad habits yet or not experienced enough yet..

I think @MtlBiker biker has answered that very well. Only thing I would add is that the EPS machines I have are Variostop which include a pneumatic foot lift as well. They are a very nice feature to have as you don't need to push side ways as you do with a knee lift. You just heel back on the peddle and up the feet come. Knee lift means you have to have the pad close to your knee and often have to spread wide to get the feet to lift. That gets tiresome and its possible to lean your knee and get enough  foot lift to upset your tension sometimes. Very annoying when you get sweaty nuts and need to spread too.. P.S. It gets pretty hot at times around here.