needle size ?

[Klara]

16 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

thats cool you could use the correct threads and spi for each needle division also as a way to remember. 

Now that's an absolutely brilliant idea! I think I need to make another one!

[NDphung]

On 2/27/2022 at 10:11 AM, MtlBiker said:

Geez, this needle sizing thing just doesn't make sense!  Please take a look at the screen shot I posted above (2-3 messages back) taken from the John James UK website showing the sizes available.  If what you are saying in this message is true (and I don't doubt you) then if you were to put those sizes in order from the smallest needle to the largest, what would that look like?

004, 003, 002, 001, 1/0, 2/0, 3/0????  Why would any company list sizes of anything in an apparently random order?

And am I correct that it appears sizes 1, 2 and 3 are all IDENTICAL?

Hi, I got my needle and some small Ritza thread from a place in BC, Canada (I am from Montreal and after doing my research, it's the cheapest place to get them since he uses good old Canada Post). I found the best explanation for the sizing is :

 

John James Saddlers Harness needles are supplied 25 loose needles per envelope.

John James Saddlers Harness needles size 1, 2 and 3 also known as 001, 002 and 003. These three sizes are all identical, they have the same diameter and the same length. This needle range is famous worldwide however the named size is determined by which county you live in. For the ease of ordering and to simplify the size range if you require size 1 or 3, please select size 2.

Sizes: 2 and 4 (also known as size 002 and 004) contains 25 needles per envelope

Size 16 (also known as size 3/0) contains 25 needles

Size 17 (also known as size 2/0) contains 25 needles

Size 18 (also known as size 1/0) contains 25 needles 

Size 1              55mm length x 1.02mm diameter
Size 2              55mm length x 1.02mm diameter
Size 3              55mm length x 1.02mm diameter
Size 4              48mm length x 0.86mm diameter
Size 16  (3/0)   62mm length x 1.63mm diameter
Size 17 (2/0)    60mm length x 1.42mm diameter
Size 18 (1/0)    57mm length x 1.09mm diameter

also the recommended size thread is:

Size 1/0 0.8-1.0 mm (1.09 needle dia)

Size 1,2 or 3 or (001,002,003) 08-0.6 mm (1.02 needle dia)

Size 4  or (004) 0.6 mm (0.86 mm needle dia). 

There is a picture of my needles to illustrate. (oops only let me use1.46mb)

 

 

 

[MtlBiker]

@NDphung - Nice to meet you.  I'm also in Montreal.

Where did you find the information that JJ needles size 1, 2 and 3 are identical?  I didn't see that on the JJ website nor on others that I've searched.  But I did see the specs which certainly seems to confirm that.

I got my John James harness needles directly from James in the UK.  I got a package of each of the 7 sizes, including exchange and shipping for less than the shipping cost alone from just about anywhere else.  Total cost in Canadian was $28.  All in.  Can't beat that.

Plus I got Ritza Tiger 25 thread in 1.0 size from Abby England, again for way way less than I could buy smaller quantities in North America.

Cheers!

 

[NDphung]

1 hour ago, MtlBiker said:

@NDphung - Nice to meet you.  I'm also in Montreal.

Where did you find the information that JJ needles size 1, 2 and 3 are identical?  I didn't see that on the JJ website nor on others that I've searched.  But I did see the specs which certainly seems to confirm that.

I got my John James harness needles directly from James in the UK.  I got a package of each of the 7 sizes, including exchange and shipping for less than the shipping cost alone from just about anywhere else.  Total cost in Canadian was $28.  All in.  Can't beat that.

Plus I got Ritza Tiger 25 thread in 1.0 size from Abby England, again for way way less than I could buy smaller quantities in North America.

Cheers!

 

just google jj harness needle size   https://www.needles2pins.co.uk/needles/needles-for-leatherwork/john-james-saddlers-harness-leather-sewing-needles-2.html#:~:text=John James Saddlers Harness needles size 1%2C 2 and 3,which county you live in.. I only need small amount with many colours. I don't need  500m.  the JJ comes to 10 a package with 50 cents /package shipping I only need three size of needles to use 1, .8 , .6 thread. Tandy sell large spool of Ritza also 100m = 20$   500m or 100m  =67$

[Dwight]

You can make this stuff as hard on yourself as you want.   Or follow the KISS method . . . Keep It Simple Stupid.

For hand sewing . . . if it works . . . use it.

For machine sewing . . . best advice I ever got came from the Tippmann Boss people.  Thread the needle . . . hold your hands about 30 inches or 75 cm apart . . . with the needle in the middle of the string.  Lift one hand . . . drop the other . . . build a 45 degree string for the needle to slide on.

The needle . . . if properly sized . . . will easily slide down the string . . . switch positions with the hands . . . again the needle should slide easily.

Has worked for me for 20 years.

May God bless,

Dwight

Edited March 1, 2022 by Dwight

[Aventurine]

Good lord.  I have read the foregoing and I am still baffled.  Please can anyone answer to these specific cases:

1). If I am going to use .6mm wide thread, what John James needles do I need, in whatever sizing system applies in the USA and Amazon in the year 2024 ?
2). If I am to use 1.0mm thick thread, what needles?

https://www.amazon.com/RMLeatherSupply-Saddlers-Harness-Needles-Leather/dp/B07477V1LG

[zuludog]

Here is my general guide to needles & thread, there are also YT Videos -

For thinner leather such as wallets use 0,45mm diameter thread and John James Saddlers Harness Needles item code L3912 size 004

For most leather goods use 0,6mm dia thread and John James Saddlers Harness Needles item code L3912 size 002 - note! make sure they are size 002 and not 2/0 

For thicker leather such as axe covers or if you want a rugged look, use  0,8 to 1,0mm dia thread and Tandy Stitching Needles 10 pack SKU 1195 -00

Briefly, synthetic is stronger than linen and won't rot, but some people prefer linen as it's natural and they like the way it feels/handles

Most people try a few types & makes before they settle on something, so look out for sales & short lengths

You can get John James needles in the USA from Rocky Mountain Leather Supply, I think, and possibly other suppliers as JJ are a well known make internationally; and Tandy are American anyway

But for needles, thread, and any other questions about leather & tools - Don't be afraid of the suppliers! After all they know their business and it it is in their interest to help you, so ask away!

Oh, just a comment - if you are going to use thicker thread and needles, you might need to temporarily enlarge the stitching holes with a round/scratch awl, they're cheap enough. The holes made by chisels & diamond/saddlers awl blades are actually slits, they don't remove any material and will close up around the thread after stitching. You might also need to pull through the needles with pliers, especially when back stitching - pad/wrap the jaws with tape so you don't scratch the needles.