JRedding

I have bargrounders from Kings and some from Chuck Smith I don't remember which ones may have been used on that saddle. And the scenery part of that belt is done in acrylic and the background portion is just Feibings oil dye.

You're pretty close except I didn't dye the background, if you use small bargrounders and do the antique just right it kind of looks like you did though, I don't do dye background unless I'm asked, too much contrast for me.

If cold weather ruined saddles all mine would have seen their last about a month ago. I've learned though that cold frozen rig David talks about serves a purpose , you can find out how broke your horse really is. If he don't hump up with that he's goin' pretty good. Maybe it wouldn't be so bad if the cold would destroy one it sure would be good for business.

buffalo, there was a place in California called E-Z Sales that we used to get them from, they carried both sizes, I haven't ordered any in a while so I'm guessing they're still there, I don't have the number handy it's at the shop and I'm not, but if you can't locate them easily I can get the number I have for them.

Jordan, I don't know if it will help but we finish between two and three hundred belts a year and I'd be happy to tell you how we do dyed belts. We dye belts with Feibings Oil Dye, not the alcohol based the oil based, we give two to three light coats of dye on the top of the belt we don't dye the back and we don't do anything before we dye,we dye the raw leather, the theory is that leather will only absorb so much of anything, before it reaches it's saturation point, we apply dye to the dry, untreated leather because we want the dye to penetrate as deep as possible (without saturating through), this creates a dye job that will wear and not wear off , applying oil before you dye lessens the penetration, it's really common sense oiled leather isn't as absorbant as dry. If you want to soften the belt, lightly oil it from the back, we use olive oil I know there's a lot of talk about using veg oils on here but we've used it for years, it really doesn't turn rancid. A light oiling from the back will penetrate and soften the belt without fooling with your dye, just be careful if it's a light (thin) belt you don't saturate the dye through to the back, or the oil through to the front, just go slow it's hard to foul up. When you're done dying and oiling you can top coat it with a lot of things, we've used feibings harness dressing for a flat finish, tan-kote, bag kote,or neat-lac, be careful with neat-lac it's a great finish but it will pull a little dye back off if you 'don't handle it right. Any of the finishes when applied will pull a small amount of the dye off on the wool when you apply it, this is normal.

Whoa, It appears me and Romey lit the fuse on this one, lucky for me I learned those tricks from my dad and other guys I guess qualify as old timers now,instead of figuring it all out the hard way. They taught us those things to help keep us alive. Those old timers rode rougher horses than we did, and I guess my generation probably got to see rougher horses than my boy will, we started five year old horses and my dad acted like that was a luxury to start'em so young.I wish I had been the bronc stomper Waddy refers to at the time, I've found more ways to get bucked off than Martha Stewart's found to ruin hamburger, and walked in way too many times, but I guess that was their point, as long as you come walkin' in everything was alright. Most of the people who ride a horse today will never get to spend a day with those old guys, it didn't seem like much of a treat at the time to have them constantly riden' my a@#, but the truth is their old ways wound up savin' it more than once. I'm in Utah, Romeys in Montana, and twister is in Texas, it's a good bet our fathers never met, but it appears they all had the same lessons to pass on, and they were still breathin' to pass it on to us, and that's the real lesson in doing a few little things to stay safe, and I think it's still worth passing on.

Luke, I'm not sure if they have that color or if you can buy anything that small but we've had pretty good luck finding colored thread from the folks at Campbell-Bosworth in Texas. if that doesn't work find a bootmaker they should have it or be able to help you out I'd think.

I'm backin' Romey on this one, the nightlatch falls in there with never button the bottom button on a Levi jacket, don't have a rope strap stout enough to pull your truck out of the mud, and the one it seems everyone today seems not to know rig the connection in the front of your chaps so it will tear out long before you get hung upside down and beat unconcius. There are more ways to get stacked up and hurt than we can discuss here. Saddlemakers and repairmen have a responsibility to know the things that will get someone hurt, and look out for those that don't know any better if you're going to do this kind of work. Just because it's an old idea doesn't mean it's a good idea, and in todays world of lawyers and liability it's best not to send things out of your shop that might get someone hurt, even under rare circumstance. If they want that stuff let them figure it out on their own, they can steal the coller off their dog and buckle that on there if they think it's a good idea.

I think you're screwed dude, around here we nail stuff like that to the wall for a while just to make sure it sinks in and doesn't happen again. Thank god for having to paint once in a while or my wall would look like "don't let this happen to you" for a cow.

John, Thanks for the compliment, I do those for 225.00 it takes about six hours to complete one of those start to finish.

This finish is not stained at all. It is just oiled and antiqued.

Well, I did fail English a couple times in school. I think I may have misled you, I believe we're practicing the same method, except I refer to that part as flow lines and I didn't tell you that. My mistake. If that seems unorthodox someday we'll talk about my opinion on casing leather that I hear so much about on here.

Ron, I have to agree and disagree about all the books and videos, any study material is good for something, you'll learn from something from each one,but I've seen guys who buy them all and try to apply everything to the point it's just confusing. The only caution I'd give about books and videos is once you've done the research and studied all the methods you can to get from point A to point B on a saddle box those things up, take what you've learned and learn to build your saddle. Using them for reference is fine but leaving them lay open on your bench everytime you work is like showing up on the job carrying your eigth grade math book just in case there's something in there you might need. My point is usually we go to school, study, and at some point the books have done you all the good they're going to and it's time to go to work and learn the rest. I've seen so many guys eager to learn the last ten years turn those things into a crutch ten years later they've learned alright and they're building a saddle that is such a carbon copy if Jeramiah saw it he'd likely offer a job. If a man's going to all this work to learn to build a saddle you might as well be building your saddle when you're done as a clone of someone elses who sold you a book or a video.

David, I draw in all my flowers they are the primary element I want to see so they're first, the leaves and a few extras are the second and everything else is just filler, simple as that. I'm completely self-taught and I hate anything that's complicated so if I can do it I usually have found a fairly simple way.

Steve, the tree is a Weatherly, I had it made with a "thin" cantle a little more like you used to see on the old Visalia brand saddles,the treemaker I use hates to do it for me they're a little more difficult to build and cover, especially that tall. And the leather is Hermann Oak. Thanks for all the positive words.

thanks Johanna for the help last night, and thanks for the nice compliment. I do draw all my own patterns the old way freehand to fit.

Ben, I just background between and inside the letters, and rock my bar grounder up on one end and lightly chase around the outside of the letters

Beaverslayer, They're buckin' rolls, used to add swell to a slickfork saddle, and thanks for the compliment. Sorry about the one saddle photo it had to be shrunk a lot to post and it pixeled out a little

Hello again, I wasn't able to get all of the photo's on one post, so here is the photo album.

Hello Everyone, Found this forum a couple of weeks ago and haven't had time to fill it out. My wife and I run a small saddle shop in Northeastern, Utah and thought we would share some photo's of our recent work with you. We know how much you like pictures. Hope it works.

mliebs8 I agree with whinewine if you're not happy take the suggestion and send it back. Good projects start with good leather, you can't make something out of nothing very often. Most saddlemakers I know joke about Weaver Leather being the Wal-Mart of the leather industry, they have a lot of good stuff, and usually plenty of it, but Go2Tex is right they just sell leather off the stack, I've never got the impression they know one piece of leather from another. We use Sheridan Leather more and more all the time just because their service is good and their leather selection is too. Sheridan Leather Outfitters 2047 Coffeen Avenue Sheridan, Wyoming 82801 1-888-803-3030

rsq3, sounds like you're getting the runaround, and maybe taken advantage of. We buy a lot of leather and I know the value of a reputable supplier, would just like to suggest the folks at Sheridan Leather in Sheridan Wyoming, they're great to deal with, honest as you'll find, and know leather, talk to Luke or Vandy if you call, if you're not quite sure what you're needing just tell them what you want it for they'll be able to help you out. Sheridan Leather Outfitters 2047 Coffeen Avenue Sheridan Wyoming 82801 1-888-803-3030

Adem, one of the easiest ways to get the beveler you want if it's smooth you're after is make your own, you can take any smooth beveler file it to the pitch you want and the width you want, sometimes you have to reshape the face a little after resizing it. I polish mine back on a buffing wheel but if you don't have one set up use a little Flitz polishing compound and elbow grease. You don't always get it right the first time usually you'll have to file and polish it out a couple times to get just what you want and running smooth. Don't be afraid to file one down if you blow it you're out a couple bucks and a cheap beveler. I've been at this nearly twenty years and I don't know a single tooler with a lot of experience who hasn't filed a bunch of tools, sometimes it's the only way to get just what you need, or you'll think if I only had a tool to do this, it may be something you can fashion. I hate to tear into tools I've paid forty bucks for but if you pay forty bucks you shouldn't have to. You'll be surprised what you can make, I've got border tools I made out of nails before they were easy to find, some of them have bordered out over a hundred saddles, and nobody knows how many saddlebags and breast collers they've seen, how do you think Don King got started making his own tools way back when.

thanks for the info on the hardware, I really appreciate it.