Denster

Lobo. That is just a flat out wow!!!!!!

Just a suggestion if you are going to sandwich steel liners between leather. A coat of laquer on the steel is a good idea to preclude any rusting. By the way, the Cowboy Fast Draw Association strictly prohibits steel liners in the holster.

The vacuum bag system is all I have used for forming holsters for that last two years or so. I use the more expensive poly bags as the vynal, while it worked OK, did not expose as much detail as the poly and with the poly I bone the detail right through the bag. The bags are virtually indestructable I've done over 2 thousand holsters through mine with no problems. There is no point to leaving it in the bag after you are done boning. Just take it out flip it over put it back in and do the other side. Then take it out and into the convection oven at 130 deg for a half hour and let air dry. With these small bags pump size in not terribly important. Mine is only 3.5cfm. Remember it's not the amount of suck but the outside air pressure on the bag that provides the force for forming. Do a search for vacuum in the holster topic and you will find a detailed post about my setup with pics.

Just got an add from Zach White Leather. They are offering a cast iron Tippmann Boss with some accessories in excellent condition for $600. That is a screaming deal. If you want one call them quick it won't last.

OK! I've never done this but if I were going to this is how I would go about it. The simpelest way would be to get some music wire about .040 thick. It is tempered to a soft spring temper. That means bent past a certain point it takes a set and holds its shape. Form it into a enlongated loop 1/2" shorter and 1/2" narrower than your leather reinforcing collar. This gives you room to sew. While the holster is still flat put it under your collar and glue the collar in place and sew. Should provide all of the necessary reinforcement. You could do the same thing with flat stock on the order of .030 O1 tool steel if you have the means to heat treat it.

Actually the stiffening process is a process of the moisture in the leather combining with collagens from the leather at about 120 degrees and migrating through the fibers. When it cools the fibers are glued together. (Think liquid hide glue) Alchohol does seem to stiffen the leather in the same manner it may be a solvent for the collagens, not something I've experimented with. You can get some of the effect at around 90 degrees as that is just above the gelling point for the best effect temps between 120 and 130, as Lobo stated, give the max effect.

I like my aerostitch. It has an 11" throat as opposed to my Boss 6" throat. Speed control is dirt simple from dead slow to really fast with just the turn of a dial. Mine is a newer model that has both the needle positioning switch and reverse which is great. It's simple enough to work on myself and Tippmann has all the parts and a friendly technical staff. The air compressor I put in a different room so I hear it kick on but it isn't irritating my compressor will meet the demands of the aerostitch so I don't have to stop if it kicks on.

Eric Cordovan is the subcutaneous layer near the Horse's butt. The horse butts we use from various suppliers are the remnants of the process where the shell cordovan is cut from the horse hide. If you do a search in the leather thread there is a link I posted to a video from Horoween Tannery showing the process for the tanning of Cordovan. It is used mostly in the high end shoe trade. There are a couple of holster makers still using it. Matt DelFatti comes to mind as one. As I understand it finishing it requires some special processes. I did see on another forum that Tony at Milt Sparks holsters saying he had some Cordovan rounds he would sell. I recall the price was about $80. I've never worked with it. K-Man may have some experience with it and may chime in.

Thought the two of you would like to know that your holsters are receiving some really good (justifably) reviews over on defensivecarry.com

Do a search for vacuum and you will come up with a thread where I posted photos of my setup, the cost, and suppliers. My press is not welded up like boomsticks as I need to shift it back and forth from other duties. Were I going to use it as a clicker also I would have gotten the air operated one and welded on plates. There was a post mentioning the press Weaver sells as a clicker. That one is for smaller parts and probably wouldn't work well for larger patterns such as holsters.

I have both now. I started with the vacuum setup and had no real complaints. I needed a shop press for some other jobs so I figured might as well get some 40 durometer pads and give it a try. I have the 12 Ton Harbor Frieght model. Works good but the only advantage I've found is that with 8/9OZ the press will bring up fine detail lines better than the vacuum. I use it for that and finish up in the Vacuum bag as I can bone the details right through the bag and they are held in place until I release the vacuum. Best part is no more slip marks or fingernail marks on wet leather. Yes! I'm somewhat of a Klutz. I don't use the press at all for revolvers. Tip. Sign up online for Harbor Frieghts online cupons. They will constantly be sending you cupons for 20 to 30% off. Combine that with a sale and you can get some really good deals. I ended up with about $69 in my vacuum pump and got the press for around $80.

Mark is correct it all comes from Horween and the size and quality has dropped in recent years. The point I was trying to make on hard rolled vs soft rolled is that the soft rolled is easier to work with when it comes to molding and finishing. Either will make a fine holster and if I have an option at the same price I'll take soft rolled. YMMV

General craftsmanship looks pretty good Josh. Just a couple of things to consider. I think I would have gone with lighter hardware and leather for the support system. Also a shoulder rig without a positive retention device like a thumb break always makes me kind of nervous.

Depends on what you are making. Kevin at Springfield Leather has the best prices on butts but they are hard jacked, great for belts and sheaths but tough to mold if you are doing holsters. Siegels is a bit more expensive but you can specify hard or soft jacked. If you are making holsters get the soft jacked. Not much harder to mold that cowhide.

I use drum dyed leather so I can't tell you what dye to use. Most dye the pieces prior to assembly. I assume you will be wet forming and molding your holsters. If so after they are molded put them in a convection oven or build a heat box and bring the temperature up to between 120 and 130 degrees leave them for about 30 minutes and remove and air dry. This will firm the leather up nicely. Then go ahead and burnish your edges and apply your finish. I use a light coat of neatsfoot oil inside and out and finish with Fiebings leather sheen.

I agree with Josh. Your basic pricing is ten to twenty dollars light from what would be fair for the quality you are delivering.

And you probably never will Shorts. It's kind of a guy thing. Always, if you can, buy larger than what you think you'll need. On the premis it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Anyway it's only about an extra $300 or so.

Eric Just a suggestion. You might try finishing your collar and sewing it on. Then to make your bend just wet the flesh side as it is the compression side and gives the most resistance to the bend. Glue and sew it then to mold use a sray bottle of water for the interior and a sponge for the exterior just going to the edge of the collar which you are not going to mold anyway. May take a little longer to get the right amount of moisture into the leather for molding but not that much. Just a thought.

Wow! You don't care for any differing opinions do you K-Man. I am relating my experience with the Boss, which is also extensive and much different than yours. The machine is either junk or it is not it can turn out a quality job or it can not everything else relates to the operator. I pointed out what I believe are things for the first time buyer to consider. If that makes me look like a fool and spewing so be it. End of story.

You have probably figured out that K-Man does not like the Tippmann Boss. I do wonder though why if you destroyed one beyond repair that you would buy another only to have it destroyed beyond repair and then go on to buy a third? The Boss is a direct drive machine and does not get "out of time" unless you break something. Then the machine is broken not out of time. As to quality of work it sews a lock stitch as do all the others and no one would be able to tell if it was sewen on a Boss, a Toro or a Cobra. There is no one part in the Boss that you could break that costs any significant money to replace. If you can operate an allen wrench and snap ring pliers and follow simple directions you can tear down and reassemble a Boss with no problems. As to the effort required. A lot less than your loading press and on straight runs it's no trick to sew 60/spm. Go to the Tippmann website and watch the videos on using and maintaining the Boss and you will see how simple it is. For most people that is. That being said if power is what you want you can't go far wrong with a Cobra or a Cowboy for that matter.

OK! I just have to ask. K-Man what did you do to your Boss machines that destroyed them beyond Tippman's ability to repair them? If they are such a piece of junk how did Tippmann manage to sell thousands of them and why do they hold their resale like no other machine and why do ten year and older machines consistantly bring 70% and better of full retail of a new one. Gary Just something to consider. Do you have the ability to work on complex mechanical devices yourself? If not how close are you to someone who can service your machine. If you live any distance from L.A. which I believe is where Steve is based you will have at least one third the cost of a Boss in shipping alone. Should it need service, and eventually it will, if you are not close to a service person and have to ship it back you will need to palatize it and pay shipping both ways as well as a repair charge. These are heavy machines on the order of a few hundred pounds. These are all things you need to consider before making a purchase decision.

As to preformance hit between manual and powered, virtually none. Sewing heavy leather in no case is a speed situation no matter what machine you are using. The longer arm powered machines are in some case and for some purposes more convenient. ie: I can sew belts on a Boss but I prefer my powered machine I can also sew in liners on large western holsters and sew bullet loops with the Boss but the powered machine is more convenient. To destroy a Boss beyond repair, let alone two, you have to have either a dedication to purpose that is beyond my ability or a seriously large sledge hammer. If you decide on a powered machine I would go with Steve at Cobra. As a beginner at machine sewing leather you will need a lot of guidance and after sale service is Steve's Forte.

My suggestion for a first machine would be a used Tippmann Boss. You can generally get one on eBay for $1000 or a little less and later if you want a powered machine you will be able to get back most if not all of your money on the Boss. Although you may find you don't need anything more. There is a learning curve to sewing leather with any machine and the Boss is easy to learn on. It has a small footprint only weighs about 25lbs and will sew through up to 3/4" veg-tan. They are virtually indestructable and any work that needs to be done on them you can do yourself if you are even remotely mechanicaly inclined. Something to consider if you are not located near someone who can service your machine. Worst case you can send it UPS to Tippmann and they will completely rebuild it for about $100 plus parts and give it a new factory warranty. I've sewen over 2K of holsters on both of my Boss machines and the only thing I've broken is two needles and a presser foot cable.

Simply put you do not want a flat bed machine for making the kind of holsters you make. Won't work don't bother trying. Put together between $700 and $900 and watch ebay for a use Tippmann Boss. It is a great machine for sewing holsters and you may never need anything else. It will make you money and when you are ready to step up to a powered machine you can sell it and get back your money or maybe a profit. It is also simple, easy to learn and you can work on it yourself. For a beginner those are all important things.

Not sure. I believe either $59 or $69