ScottWolf
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Having spent a good deal of time researching and reading forums, to include this one, I have found that there are plenty of threads on making leather conditioners , but not many actual recipes. People act like it's a secret or are elusive in what ingredients and ratios they use. It's not a secret, I never understood why people act like its some kind of proprietary info on how they make conditioner. It's not like most/any of them are trying to sell it to make a living or anything. Plus its not rocket science. If one looks at most commercial products Material Safety Data Sheets ( MSDS), you can find out what the ingredients are and sometimes even the % of each. A little bit of tinkering and one can figure out what the ratios are. So I've decided to post up an actual recipe for making your own all natural leather conditioner. I also use this for a sealer/finish after dyeing with good success, although it takes more time and hand rubbing/buffing than say applying resolene, etc. The intent is to make an all natural product, using all natural and 100% organic ingredients. I intentionally avoided things like Mineral oil, cheap oils, lards/tallows and other petroleum products found in some commercial products used for leather conditioning. I also avoided using things like kerosene, turpentine or other similar products often mentioned in threads like these, that are used for their solvent properties and ability to penetrate leather. Having looked at ingredients used back as far as the 1800's, it is clear some of those ingredients were used out of necessity and or availability and really aren't that great for leather pH or otherwise in conditioning, but are still held onto and used by some. Likewise, I've seen mention about the concern of rancidity when using some vegetable and or animal products. While I do not doubt that things can go rancid given the right circumstances, I have yet to see anyone actually have this issue, it's always been someones sisters brothers cousin twice removed or a case of gross over saturation. Same goes with attracting of vermin/animals. There just isn't anything concrete to factually point to it as a big enough concern and reason to avoid using any of those ingredients. I chalk the rancidity concern up to an old wives/urban myth that keeps getting repeated in forums like these (I'm sure this last sentence will no doubt bring out someone who claims otherwise, it is the internet after all.). So like any kind of recipe, it is a baseline to start from. You may have to adjust some of the ratios of the ingredients you use from this recipe, as your ingredients might be slightly different from mine and your results different. So if it's too tacky, too hard, too soft, to your liking, you will have to make small adjustments. Likewise, the recipe below is an example of ingredients that can be used. There are many others that are still all natural that can be used in lieu of and or added to the mixture( coconut oil, castor oil, Cod fish oil, jojoba, shea butter, etc). I give an example of that in the recipe below with the addition of two additional ingredients. While some may or may not consider it "natural", neatsfoot oil could also be added to the recipe below if you wanted to add that.Just remember that with neatsfoot oil, less is more. As an example Lexol only uses 5-10% neatsfoot oil and 80% is water and other ingredients in its leather conditioner per their MSDS sheet on their website ( Yes, Lexol IS neatsfoot oil, just like soylent green is people. A shocker , I know) If you have a favorite commercial product, do a duck duck go search on it using "MSDS" or "SDS" to pull up the data sheet on it, and you'll likely find out what ingredients are used in it, that you can replicate yourself or use in your product. Here is something to keep in mind while doing this though. The more oil(s) you add to the mix, the softer the final product will be unless you increase the ratio of the other materials like beeswax and Carnauba wax that help to firm the final product up. So if your batch isn't coming out like you want it, you know where to look at correcting it. Likewise, do a small test batch/run of a given ratio (write this down as you're doing it) if you haven't done it before, so you're not over committing to a final product that you aren't happy with. Once you arrive at the right ratios for the small batch that make you happy, increase them proportionality as needed for larger batches. Basically, if you can make ramen noodles on the stove, you can make your own Leather conditioner in about an hour and in as large a quantity as you want for slightly more than you'd pay for a store bought 4 oz tin.($20) of leather conditioner The ingredients are simple( most/all are for sale on Amazon or locally in stores): 100% organic coca butter- about $15 a pound 100% organic Beeswax- about $14 a pound 100% pure sweet almond oil (or similar non greasy scented oil)- 16oz $8 ( this will make approx 8 batches of 4 ozs tins) Total investment cost: $38-45 if you allow for taxes, shipping, etc Now, the recipe : It’s a simple recipe, mix the three ingredients at a ratio of 1:1:2 (beeswax, cocoa butter, and liquid oil) , this ratio gives the balm a slightly softer texture as opposed to being a very solid bar. This is still a balm, though; if you want more of a cream, use a 1:1:3 ratio. If you add the two optional ingredients you are adding more conditioner( lanolin) and a hardener (Carnauba wax) that result in a more solid final product. The ratio with the other two ingredients would be: 1:1:2: .5: .25 You can increase the Lanolin from .5 to 1 if you choose but it does increase the overall cost. If you need a harder product, increase the carnauba wax, as too much beeswax can result in a tacky feel to the product. Homemade Leather Balm 25g | 0.88oz beeswax 25g | 0.88oz cocoa butter 50g | 1.76oz sweet almond oil (or other not-too-greasy liquid oil) *2 teaspoons of Anhydrous Lanolin *1 teaspoon of T1grade organic Carnauba wax *Optional Ingredients that can be added to this recipe but it will increase the overall price for the materials* Melt everything together in a small saucepan over medium heat. Pour into a 125mL/4oz mason jar and let cool until solid, 20–30 minutes. Obviously you can make this in larger quantities by increasing the recipe above and make several 4 oz jars at once, or a few larger ones. Either way, for a few dollars more than store bought and a little bit of time, you can make your own leather conditioner in larger quantities for a lot less. * Disclaimer* My math might be a tad off, I did this in my head as I was typing so the total batches you get for your initial investment in materials may be less or more than the 8 batches I mentioned above. Here are a few details and amplifying information on how to do this. Actual investment in items ( all products shown and the jars) worked out to be $63 when all was said and done As you can see, my initial estimate of 8 batches of 4 ozs. was off. All said and done, using all the shown products at one time resulted in a total of 19ea at 4 ozs ( the larger mason jars are 8 ozs each) for a total of 76 ozs of leather balm. Breakdown of price per 4 oz works out to $4.80 total Total time from start to finish: 30mins The process: 1ea large metal pot 1ea wooden spoon to stir 1ea laddle 1ea Funnel Like I said earlier, if you can make Ramen, you can do this.It's caveman easy. So, this is how it went and the pictures will give you an idea of what to expect if I can get them to load on this forum. Step 1: Pot on the stove, low heat. Drop entire 1lb block of coca butter into the pot and let melt, stirring/moving it around. It melts like a stick of normal butter would melt. Just be sure to keep the heat low, so you don't burn it. After a 2-3 minutes it is all liquid. Step 2: Add in the Beeswax. The beeswax melts slower than the coca butter so it was poured in a 1/3 of the bag at a time and constantly stirred and broken up before adding more. This was done until the entire bag had been poured into the pot and it was all liquified. Stirring it the whole time and monitoring the heat is important , as you might have to turn the heat up a tad to get the beeswax to melt quicker, but you want to be careful not to burn it. If your beeswax is a solid bar, grate it up and or Chunk it up in small pieces so it melts faster. Step 3: Once it was all liquid and mixed together, the pot was removed from the flame/burner. Both bottles of almond oil were poured into the pot and stirred into the mix. At this point, everything is hot liquid, so you have to move fairly quick, as it will begin to set up. We had the 4ozs jars all set up and ready to go before hand so we lost no time going from the stove into the jars. Step 4: Using a laddle, the liquid was poured into a funnel to aid in filing the jars. If you use tins or another container, you may be able to pour it direct, but to reduce mess and loss, the funnel worked best. The liquid starts to cool pretty quick, so have everything prepped and on hand before you get to this stage. Once you've poured it in to all of your containers, allow it to cool and harden up. Step 5: Clean up of pot and funnel,laddle. Do that right after finishing, as it will be semi hardened but hot tap water and some soap and it comes right off. Step 6: Sniff your fingers/hands. As it cools down, this stuff smells pretty awesome and feels great on your skin. Don't be surprised if your woman makes off with a few jars of this stuff for herself. As long as you haven't put any petroleum products or other harsh chemicals in the mix, you can use this on your own skin safely.
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As far as I know its the beeswax and carnauba wax that do the heavy lifting. The oils in the mix are for the leather conditioning. It's not a secret, I never understood why people act like its some kind of proprietary info on how they make conditioner. It's not like most/any of them are trying to sell it to make a living or anything. Plus its not rocket science. If one looks at most commercial products Material Safety Data Sheets ( MSDS), you can find out what the ingredients are and sometimes even the % of each. A little bit of tinkering and one can figure out what the ratios are. I've been meaning to post my conditioner recipe with actual measurements of each ingredient used here, but haven't gotten around to it yet.
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To answer you question, yes it can be used. I use an all natural ingredient conditioner that I make that uses beeswax, carnauba along with other natural ingredients as a finish after I dye. It works and I like the results, as it kills two birds with one stone in my case , as it seals and conditions. However, it takes more time and applications than say using resolene one time and being done. In my recipe, I use the carnauba in small quantities to harden up the end product to a firm shoe polish consistency. Otherwise without it, its more like a body butter in its firmness. If you're not opposed to a lot of hand rubbing/polishing and a longer time to seal/finish the project, its a viable option to make your own like I do.
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Yes, you can use simple water and a mild soap and a rag to wipe it down. If you plan to dye it I'd follow up with ISO alcohol wipe down prior to dyeing and then conditioning and applying a finish.
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I think there are several ways you can approach this, all depend on what you want to do. The black ink stain is going to be the crux of it though. Unless you plan on dyeing the entire bag black, that stain may be your main issue. You can start with ISO alcohol to try and get it to liquify and blot it off. It's a time consuming and slow process. If the ink proves to be hard to remove, you can always go to harsher chemicals to get it off, such as "goof off" and similar product with acetone in them. It might get it all off, it might just lighten it up some and it very well may remove some of the brown color as well and require touch up. If you go this route, you always need to condition and feed the leather afterwards so it doesn't dry out and you put natural oils back in to the leather. What I would suggest is that you clean the bag good and then give it a good conditioning over several days to see what the leather does and how well it comes back to life and the color it takes on. This is of course ignoring the black ink stain altogether and chalking it up to a life scar. My guess is that this bag will take on a nice color and look once conditioned. From there, I'd say start with a saddle tan for the strap you want to add. It's always better to start lighter, as you can go darker but not vice versa when it comes to matching the bags color as close as possible. You may be able to do this by applying more saddle tan dye to the strap or moving to a darker color dye if the bag proves to be significantly darker after conditioning. Use a few pieces of scrap from the same leather you're making the strap with to do multiple color strips and dye colors to see what best resembles your bag before doing the strap. If you use Neatsfoot oil/Lexol, it will darken up a decent amount color wise. If you use EVOO or other all natural conditioners, it may not darken up as much after one application. In either case, allow it to sit for a day or two after conditioning as it will lighten up slightly and be a better indicator of its color.
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This is not unusual, as you will find MSDS will vary from country/region to another, as the laws and requirements vary or change, that's why you will see some MSDS with nothing noted sometimes for one country/region and others with more information, such as % of the product used, etc. In this case, we are seeing a further defining/identifying of the ME esters and Tall fatty Oils that were mentioned in the version I posted.Despite the word "oil" being used often in these ingredients/ substances columns, what it really is, is an ester or a Saturated/unsaturated fatty acid, EG: Sulfated sperm oil, is actually a liquid wax and isn't obtained from rendered whale blubber as many assume. In this case, it's a synthetic version(chemicals) often used as a surfactant, dispersant and or emulsifier for the neatsfoot oil in the product ( or what ever oils are in the product). These component ingredients are also what gives products like these that creamy or thicker "feel" to them vice a pure/straight oil by itself. As mentioned, this newer document(s) goes so far as to include the word "neatsfoot" in the title and on top of every sheet of the MSDS, which in its self , makes the message they are trying to send pretty clear IMO. This is not unusual, as you will find MSDS will vary from country/region to another, as the laws and requirements vary or change, that's why you will see some MSDS with nothing noted sometimes for one country/region and others with more information, such as % of the product used, etc. In this case, we are seeing a further defining/identifying of the ME esters and Tall fatty Oils that were mentioned in the version I posted.Despite the word "oil" being used often in these ingredients/ substances columns, what it really is, is an ester or a Saturated/unsaturated fatty acid, EG: Sulfated sperm oil, is actually a liquid wax and isn't obtained from rendered whale blubber as many assume. In this case, it's a synthetic version(chemicals) often used as a surfactant, dispersant and or emulsifier for the neatsfoot oil in the product ( or what ever oils are in the product). These component ingredients are also what gives products like these that creamy or thicker "feel" to them vice a pure/straight oil by itself. As mentioned, this newer document(s) goes so far as to include the word "neatsfoot" in the title and on top of every sheet of the MSDS, which in its self , makes the message they are trying to send pretty clear IMO. This is not unusual, as you will find MSDS will vary from country/region to another, as the laws and requirements vary or change, that's why you will see some MSDS with nothing noted sometimes for one country/region and others with more information, such as % of the product used, etc. In this case, we are seeing a further defining/identifying of the ME esters and Tall fatty Oils that were mentioned in the version I posted.Despite the word "oil" being used often in these ingredients/ substances columns, what it really is, is an ester or a Saturated/unsaturated fatty acid, EG: Sulfated sperm oil, is actually a liquid wax and isn't obtained from rendered whale blubber as many assume. In this case, it's a synthetic version(chemicals) often used as a surfactant, dispersant and or emulsifier for the neatsfoot oil in the product ( or what ever oils are in the product). These component ingredients are also what gives products like these that creamy or thicker "feel" to them vice a pure/straight oil by itself. As mentioned, this newer document(s) goes so far as to include the word "neatsfoot" in the title and on top of every sheet of the MSDS, which in its self , makes the message they are trying to send pretty clear IMO.
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I am very familiar with the MSDS ingredients, If I wasn't, do your REALLY think I'd reference them and provide a link to the MSDS? Do you know what ME Esters or Tall oil fatty acids are? I do and if you took the time to look into what they are, you'd learn what they actually are and what part they play in making lexol what it is and it's given consistency. What's that saying about horses and leading them to water again? I'll ignore the ad hominem attacks in hopes that maybe, you'll be open minded enough to do a little research for yourself, as I am not trying to be confrontational or "win" on the internet. And who knows, maybe at some point I'll post exact recipes for making both leather conditioners and cleaners at home, using all natural ingredients.
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If the neatsfoot oil is taken out of the Lexol conditioner, it is no longer a leather conditioner( per the MSDS of ingredients). If you take the raisins out of the raisin bran, it is no longer raisin bran. Again, the point is that both Lexol and NFO accomplish the same thing, much like making copies or Xeroxing a document, or like Kleenex and facial tissue. Call it what you want, but its the principal ingredient and the end state(results) is the same.
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I think you're being pedantic here. Lexol IS neatsfoot oil. That is the principal leather treatment in the product, per the MSDS. At the end of the day, that is what is useful to the leather. The whole point of mentioning this is that if used in moderation, if one has a bottle of neatsfoot oil vice Lexol, that its accomplishing the same thing. Not to mention that an entire bottle of neatsfoot oil is comparatively less cost wise than a bottle of Lexol, as one is getting more actual neatsfoot oil at the end of the day. People will recommend to "use NFO or Lexol" often when commenting, as if they were two distinctly different products, when in fact, they are actually the same product(NFO); it is a redundant statement.
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I can tell you from experience, that black shoe polish isn't what you want to use if its pigmentation you are trying to add. You can use black shoe CREAM (not polish) as mentioned above for minor pigmentation additions. Using shoe polish to try and darken that wallet will leave you with a wallet that bleeds black stains on everything it touches. There is actually a recent thread where the person used black shoe polish on a purse to try and even the color out and is having this very issue. if you attempt to re0dye it, you will need to use a soap cleaner on it and scrub it to remove any product that would prevent the dye from penetrating. Otherwise it will just continue to pool and sit on top as you've already experienced.
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NO, not in my experience. The end product may look yellowish, but that color isn't transferred to the leather.
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Organic T1 grade carnauba wax is a pale yellow. The color is immaterial to its performance. I use this exact product in a leather conditioner I make. I add small amounts of it to the beeswax and other ingredients in the conditioner in order to make it hard. https://www.amazon.com/Carnauba-Wax-Flakes-Organic-Leather/dp/B07CLCGJPM/ref=pd_ybh_a_137?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=AM0XMZ9P52DSPWTSV65B
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Organic T1 grade carnauba wax is a pale yellow. The color is immaterial to its performance. I use this exact product in a leather conditioner I make. I add small amounts of it to the beeswax and other ingredients in the conditioner in order to make it hard.
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Per the MSDS, Lexol conditioner is 5-10% Neatsfoot oil and approx 80% water(and other additives). While there is nothing wrong with using lexol/NFO, the idea after dying is to add back any of the fats/oils that the dying depleted. All natural ingredient conditioner will put those back, where as NFO simply makes the leather soft again, but is actually an oxidizer. Any of the many conditioners out there with natural ingredients like beeswax and natural plant oils (VOO, Castor , Coconut, Almond, etc) will better condition and balance the leather's pH after a dying. Lexol MSDS Sheet: https://www.mws-d.com/images/PDF/2307286.pdf
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Question about the item. Did you wipe/buff the item you dyed down once it was dry, to remove the excess dye, before applying the sealer?
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Holster Liner Material
ScottWolf replied to DuqQuaid's topic in Gun Holsters, Rifle Slings and Knife Sheathes
^^^^^THIS^^^^^^ ^^^^^THIS^^^^ times 1000 -
If your intent is to soften it, you need to look at 100% anhydrous Lanolin or NFO ( not compound). Be careful not to use too much NFO, you don't want to saturate the leather with it. Coconut oil is a conditioner and will darken leather more than other natural oils. Vaseline is a petroleum product or in simple terms, mineral oil. I don't advise using vaseline/mineral oil. Its tackiness will also attract dirt and clog the leather up. The last product from what I could tell is a Dubbin, which to me , means its a waterproofer type product used on boots/outdoor type of equipment using animal tallows. Good for waterproofing boots and jackets, not so great for softening leather. Beeswax is usually used with other ingredients, like coconut oil, sweet almond oil, etc, and is a conditioner as well as a protectant/mild waterproofer/sealer. By itself, it's not going to make your leather softer.
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sure, go ahead.
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All the "lotions" I have encountered are in a creamy liquid state and conditioners are in either a semi solid(shoe polish tin) or straight liquid state(neatsfoot oil). As far as ingredients go, they all tend to have some of the same things known for conditioning leather. The lotions tend to use a combo of water and chemical mixtures to keep the conditioner(s) suspended in a fluid state if you look at the material safety data sheets for them. Most of the "lotions" are usually for items like car and furniture upholstery and even some clothing. The creamy liquid state makes the application easy and it doesn't run like a liquid would when applied to those type of items. Here is the kicker though. Having looked at a lot of MSDS, it has become apparent to me that Any conditioner that is in a lotion or a semi liquid state ( squeezed out of a bottle) is more water/suspension chemicals/preservatives than actual conditioner percentage wise. Typically as much as 50% or more is anything but a known leather conditioner. In some cases, several known conditioners are used, but they typically fall into the 5-10% range each in the combined mixture. This can sometimes also apply to semi solid conditioners, which is why the MSDS is so useful an item to look at if you want to know how much actual conditioner you are getting. With semi solids, this also falls into simple science, as mixture ratios of oils to non oils will determine if the end product is solid like shoe polish or soft like a body butter/balm. With liquids/creams, all they need to do is suspend the ingredients in their liquid form and don't have to worry about how solid they are, which is why 50% or more is that suspension liquid.