Consew 202rb

[MtlBiker]

43 minutes ago, PISTOLs said:

@kgg   I am sewing patches on leather vests, mostly leather motorcycle vests. The thickness of each vest really depends on the leather used.  Since I can't test the material I have to try to make an adjustment that will work with for all vests.  

Unfortunately, there is no one size that fits all.  Tension, needle size, etc. will vary depending on the thickness of the leather, it's hardness (softer chrome tan vs veg tan) and I think you should be trying a larger needle as I and @kgg both suggested.  And by experience you may find after a couple of stitches that you need to tweek the thread tension.  Are you also by any chance using black thread sometimes and another color at other times?  That too would probably require a tension adjustment.  Black thread (because of the dye is my understanding) is stiffer than other colors.

I suggest you first try a larger needle and see if that reduces the problem.

By the way, if you want someone to be flagged about a reply, it's not enough to write @kgg as you did... you need to start typing the @ and then the name and you MUST pick it from the popup that appears.  Like I did earlier in this reply.

 

Edited July 26, 2023 by MtlBiker

[CowboyBob]

@PISTOLs You mention the motor is set to stop down,it's possible when you stop if you turn the material the needle could bend.You need to make sure the positioner is adjusted so the needle bar raises approx 3/8" the the point of the hook is past the needle.

[PISTOLs]

 

@MtlBikerthanks for you input, but if you notice (See below) I did properly tag you as I am aware of how to tag.  Unfortunately, @kgg did not appear on the drop down list the first time I tried to respond.  

@MtlBiker What size needle are you using with your v69 thread?  135 x 16 Groz-Beckert LR/RTW Have you tried going up one size which sometimes helps.  I will try a 135 x 17 and see if that helps.  Is there anything different in your fabric assembly when that happens?  Not really, it pretty much is one layer of leather and a patch  Surely you're not sewing for 20 minutes non-stop... there must be stops and starts, new assemblies being sewn. Yes, I am sewing patches so there are start and stops and corners to turn.  It seems that every adjustment I make works really good on my test leather and then I begin to sew (3.5 stitch length) and after a time I hear a light thud or jump and I know something about to happen and before I can get my project to a stoping point the needle breaks  Are you new to industrial machines in general, or only new to that 202rb? Yes I m new to industrial machines but have ben sewing using a household machine for about 3 years. Are you holding the top thread tightly as you begin your sewing?  YesDo your stitches look alright up until the needle breaks?  Yes they look really good Or do you have thread nests on the under side? No  n

[Wizcrafts]

2 hours ago, PISTOLs said:

@kgg   I am sewing patches on leather vests, mostly leather motorcycle vests. The thickness of each vest really depends on the leather used.  Since I can't test the material I have to try to make an adjustment that will work with for all vests.  

Sewing on patches is a large part of my business. When I first got into that field, I was using v92 thread and a #19 (120) leather point needle. I have since moved to only using v69 thread, top and bottom, with a #18 round point needle (GB Gebeder, or Schmetz Serv 7). I also recently bought 7 spools of v45 thread and some #14 round point needles (Serv 7) for poorly edged patches. My round point needles are all System 135x17.

The reason I switched to round points has to do with the embroidered (serged) edges. I found that leather points were actually cutting the thread on the edges, rather than separating them. Round points don't do that as much. I also prefer round holes to anything with a shift between stitches. Most of the patches the customers bring in have tight border stitching. But, some are overly loose. When I run into trouble using #69 thread with a #18 needle, I can move down to #45 thread and a #14 needle. I crank down the foot pressure screw to minimize any deflection from the patch, leather and lining.

In case you're interested in the machines I use to sew patches, they are as follows:

• Adler 30-7 patcher with a long arm and large bobbin (in shop)
• Singer 29k71 short arm, small bobbin patcher (at home)
• Singer 168g101 compound feed post bed machine (at home)
• Singer 139w109 long bed walking foot machine with a Juki LU bobbin conversion (in shop)
• Singer 111w103 walking foot machine (at home)

The reason for the split between home and shop machines is that the place of business that hosted us closed up on December 31, 2022. That put me and my partner out of work. We finally found a new location to setup the shop, but there just wasn't enough room for the three other machine. Also, I was able to sew patches at home for a few local MCs. They still prefer to come to my house, so the three machines will stay in my expando.

[MtlBiker]

1 hour ago, PISTOLs said:

 

 

@MtlBikerthanks for you input, but if you notice (See below) I did properly tag you as I am aware of how to tag.  Unfortunately, @kgg did not appear on the drop down list the first time I tried to respond.  

@MtlBiker What size needle are you using with your v69 thread?  135 x 16 Groz-Beckert LR/RTW Have you tried going up one size which sometimes helps.  I will try a 135 x 17 and see if that helps.  Is there anything different in your fabric assembly when that happens?  Not really, it pretty much is one layer of leather and a patch  Surely you're not sewing for 20 minutes non-stop... there must be stops and starts, new assemblies being sewn. Yes, I am sewing patches so there are start and stops and corners to turn.  It seems that every adjustment I make works really good on my test leather and then I begin to sew (3.5 stitch length) and after a time I hear a light thud or jump and I know something about to happen and before I can get my project to a stoping point the needle breaks  Are you new to industrial machines in general, or only new to that 202rb? Yes I m new to industrial machines but have ben sewing using a household machine for about 3 years. Are you holding the top thread tightly as you begin your sewing?  YesDo your stitches look alright up until the needle breaks?  Yes they look really good Or do you have thread nests on the under side? No  n

I know you tagged me, but you didn't tag kgg, which is why I thought I'd try giving you helpful advice.

[PISTOLs]

@Wizcraftsthank you for that information.

I am used #69 top and bottom with a 16 needle but I am going to try an #18 round point and see if that will stop the needle breakage.  

By a chance do you know if the needle bar should have play in it?  I noticed this and Im wondering if this is why I am breaking the needles?  I am trying to get things set up to do a motorcycle rally in New Richmond in a couple of weeks.   It will be my first one sewing patches.   

[Wizcrafts]

1 hour ago, PISTOLs said:

@Wizcraftsthank you for that information.

I am used #69 top and bottom with a 16 needle but I am going to try an #18 round point and see if that will stop the needle breakage.  

By a chance do you know if the needle bar should have play in it?  I noticed this and Im wondering if this is why I am breaking the needles?  I am trying to get things set up to do a motorcycle rally in New Richmond in a couple of weeks.   It will be my first one sewing patches.   

Get you a couple packs of #18 in Schmetz Serv 7 round points in System 135x17. They have a larger eye and are reinforced to resist bending. They cut through double sided tape well. The next best are Gross Beckert Gebeder in system 135x17. They are titanium coated.

[DonInReno]

Usually broken needles are caused by the material being forced in a direction that bends the needle far enough to make contact with a hard part.   Often, changing how material is fed under the feet is all that’s needed.   A thin needle bends more - I’ll go up one or two sizes larger than normal when sewing difficult items that are likely to put side pressure on the needle (heavy smooth vinyl with thick seams is especially bad).

I’m guessing this machine has a clutch motor and the high speed makes it hard to tell what’s happening when the needle breaks.   Going slower greatly reduces broken needles, but that’s probably easier said than done.

There will be marks left on the part that’s breaking the needles.  Maybe the needle needs to be better centered in the needle plate.  Maybe you simply need a needle plate with larger hole.   Maybe they are breaking on the hook - the condition of the hook’s point is where I’d look next.  It’s possible something up top is loose or worn out allowing too much movement in the needle bar.  I have no idea how many parts are available or what interchanges with the 206.

Hopefully it’s an easy fix.

 

 

 

[Debdeb]

I too recently bought a Consew 202RB from an upholsterer who had upgraded. He purchased a new belt but it’s the wrong size - says M44 and is too big. I found the schematic and parts list of the machine but there is no belt listed. Anyone know what size I need?

[shoepatcher]

Measure around the v groove in the 2 pulleys with string.  It will give you an approximate length.  Buy 3 belts.  The size you come up with, one 1" longer, one 1" shorter.  See what fits best and return other 2.  You want 3L V belts.

glenn