Something to Sing(er) about! :)

[suzelle]

Yep, you guessed it! Another Singer!

Picked her up in Seattle today, Seller had it listed on Craigslist for $400, and it looked pretty good in the photos.

I didn't see that it came with extra feet, straight stitching plate and feed dogs, or any tools, so I offered $350. I could see everything was turning, so it wasn't jammed up in anyway. However, something was goofy with the feed dogs and they were not moving the fabric. Figured if everything else was moving, I could fix that!

Got back to the shop and put the Singer up on the table to inspect and found that all it needed was a couple of adjustments and screwing down the feed dogs! Now she sews! Been wanting one of these pretty bad, I'm going to be testing this machine with some lighter weight leather projects, sewing up some western garments for Grand-Daughter Emma, at last! Emma rides horses (thus the leather garments) and I am spending time with her teaching her to design her own clothing. She's very creative and it's a really fun time for me too! I cannot think of a better machine for her to learn on. However, I think I'm going to get another motor so she can start out slow. Emma likes to ride horses, but I don't think she's ready for the Horsepower this thing puts out. LOL

[dikman]

Appears to be in very good condition.

[Constabulary]

Maybe not too importation for you but the 20U is using the same needle plates and feed dogs as the Singer 107W & 457. So you have quite a wide range you can choose from. How do I know? Well I once ordered a 20U & 457 needle plate and feed dog for my 307G2 AND the needle plates of my 107W1 fit the 307G2 as well - conclusion - 20U and 107w / 457 needle plates and feed dogs are interchangeable 

CS in the UK has a wide range but I´m sure you can find them in the US as well.

https://www.college-sewing.co.uk/store/Singer107G,107WSewingMachineParts

https://www.college-sewing.co.uk/store/Singer457G,457USewingMachineParts

 

[suzelle]

9 hours ago, dikman said:

Appears to be in very good condition.

Dikman,

THANKS! Yes, except for a couple nicks and dings, it's in pretty new condition although manufactured years ago. maybe 1980s??? Not sure yet what year, but that will be fun to find out.

[suzelle]

6 hours ago, Constabulary said:

Maybe not too importation for you but the 20U is using the same needle plates and feed dogs as the Singer 107W & 457. So you have quite a wide range you can choose from. How do I know? Well I once ordered a 20U & 457 needle plate and feed dog for my 307G2 AND the needle plates of my 107W1 fit the 307G2 as well - conclusion - 20U and 107w / 457 needle plates and feed dogs are interchangeable 

CS in the UK has a wide range but I´m sure you can find them in the US as well.

https://www.college-sewing.co.uk/store/Singer107G,107WSewingMachineParts

https://www.college-sewing.co.uk/store/Singer457G,457USewingMachineParts

 

Constabulary,

This is very much important, and much appreciated information! Thank you.  Then gentleman I purchased the machine from said he had (3) machines and I bet they were all the same machine style, but saw just this one. He had a business (garment repair and construction) and had employees, then when through some hard times and had to sell machine(s) to afford a move. When I asked him about parts, he would go back into his home and fish out what I'd asked for: a bobbin to test machine, a needle plate, thread, lol. I realized he was trying to hang on to whatever he could, probably for his other machines(s). So the machine is in excellent condition, but she does need a few things.

One of the reasons for purchasing this machine is that I have about 400 various sized needles in packets of 50 each that will all fit this machine. I got them along with a Consew 217 machine I purchased a few years back. I sold the machine though, because the hook broke, and I'd only paid about $200 for it, but the replacement hook was going to cost far more than the machine at the time. I think hook prices have come down on those since then, because those machines are being manufactured again now, under a different name (Global???) in Germany (???). I priced out new ones about a year ago. Wished I'd hung onto the 217. Oh well, I live and learn.  Learning is fun.

Thanks again for the help! I am not selling this Singer, parts are cheap and plentiful. I have loads of bobbins, needles, and feet already that fit it. Thread too, mostly v69 in many colors. Great for uniform repair, which I seem to do a lot of. I have a lot of v92 thread too, I use poly in both these sizes, bonded. I'm pretty sure this Singer can handle the v92 thread, as long as I don't use it all the time? Please feel free to comment on those ideas, I want to learn. Matt at Sailrite posted something a while ago on his forum that you can use v92 thread on the Singer 20U, as long as you have the correct foot, needle plate, and feed dog. He recommended the zig zag set for the v92 thread.

[DrmCa]

This machine may be an upgrade for you, but be aware that 20U is not really a full-blown industrial machine. This is a small-shop glorified household machine, put onto an industrial K-legs. It will run light textiles and denims, but nothing heavier.

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

Singer 20U made in Japan is a very describable machine.  

[suzelle]

On 3/22/2018 at 11:29 AM, DrmCa said:

This machine may be an upgrade for you, but be aware that 20U is not really a full-blown industrial machine. This is a small-shop glorified household machine, put onto an industrial K-legs. It will run light textiles and denims, but nothing heavier.

DrmCa,

Machine is not an "upgrade" for me, actually it fills a gap in my herd. I have what you called a "full blown industrial" lol. So don't worry 'bout me, k?

Oh, and thanks for the encouragement.

[suzelle]

18 hours ago, Gregg From Keystone Sewing said:

Singer 20U made in Japan is a very describable machine.  

Greg, Thanks very much! Yes, I have wanted one of these Singers for some time.

The advantages for me are: I can mount it in a portable case and take it on jobs with me when my projects call for any work on the spot. I may not be able to use the heaviest of my threads (v92) in that situation, but I can with confidence use a Bonded Poly v69  thread for my proto-type aircraft covers, knowing it won't damage my machine. The v69 thread is strong enough to hold my fabrics together and to get approval on the fitting, but this is not the thread I would use in the final product, nor would the Singer 20U be the sewing machine I'd use for the final product. It's at least an answer to travelling equipped, and getting a good fitting initial pattern.

Another advantage: This machine was manufactured in Japan, and although it's an older machine, it is like new. After fully inspecting it, I've found that it just hadn't been run, hadn't been oiled or greased either. These older Japan made machines seam to be very dependable. Again, parts are plentiful and affordable! Oh, and this type of machine is still being manufactured today, under various names. I think my $350 investment was a smart one. In fact, I know it was! Money well spent.

In my experience, it has been a challenge finding a versatile machine I can use on a job or at the shop, one that is portable and takes the industrial needles and threads I commonly use. When travelling to a job, it just makes sense to have a machine with me so I can make the best use of my time and travel. One thing I won't do again is ship a machine to a job, have had some damage in shipping.    I have also purchased machine(s) when having to travel to another State and that's not fun either, never know what you will end up with when you get there. So these days, I don't go too far. A day trip, maybe a weekend, and I can pack my Singer 20U with me!

I am sure the Singer 20U will handle much of my smaller stuff, upholstery work and most uniform work with ease, it won't even sneaze! I have 6,12, and 15 needle embroidery machines and  make large, pretty densely embroidered jacket back patches that are sewn onto garments, I think this machine will handle that task with ease as well. I won't have to tie up my Pfaff 545, which I keep set up to sew over the street banners. It's not the thickest thread available, but I use Bonded Poly v92 on this machine and I don't like to fuss with it since it needs to be ready to run banners immediately after running them on our HP Latex Printer. My banners can go up to 60" wide and any length, so no screwing around here! LOL.  I keep that area set up with extension tables needed to sew long banners, and use these tables for some of my portable machines and sergers when I NOT on a banner job. I also use these tables to spread out/sort paper work and pack orders. this is the most efficient use of that area in the shop. Above a section of the tables that are against a wall, I keep the portable machines. They are ready to pull down and use for whatever orders I've got. Also, assortment of threads, needles, velcros, banner making supplies, etc...

The Singer 20U takes industrial needles, you can even set it up as a "twin" needle (I just learned) which can be helpful with a double-stitch look. I'm sure not a true double stitch as it's not a double bobbin machibne, but it's somethi'n! It has pretty good reviews for it's wide zig zag stitch and people do comment on the lovely Satin Stitch, beautiful straight stitch. I know it's got more oomph than a domestic/household machine. I'd call that Glorious! I mean Glorified!

Since I really put my sewing machines through the paces, it's a great plan to have a couple of Home/Domestic machines in my shop too! After all, we make and fix garments too! I think that the making of a fine garment is the most intricate work I do. I feel that every machine is a tool and like a set of socket wrenches, it's good to have them in various sizes. After 32 years in business, I've gathered up a few of these tools! Love them, have never lost my excitement over getting a new one. Correction: New/Old one!

Edited March 24, 2018 by suzelle

[suzelle]

20 hours ago, Gregg From Keystone Sewing said:

Singer 20U made in Japan is a very describable machine.  

P.S. Gregg - I mean to say good eye! You caught that - 2nd photo included shot of back of the machine with "made in Japan"

That is why the 2nd photo was included. Other wise, who cares?  When you have a chance Gregg, let me know if you have parts for these 20U machines. I'm going to make her portable. Looking for parts that are missing. I think previous owner moved parts off for another machine, either that or it just never had them in original table set-up? The motor is old (Arrow brand) but looks unused like the machine. I do have a nice portable motor I bought a few years back that is heavier than a standard household motor, I think 1/4 hp or something like that. Going to mount that to the motor boss, or back, we'll see. Also, need a decent box to put her in. Something like what Sailrite has on their website. I don't want plastic. If you have things, let me know please. Or if you have used parts from the old machines I'd be interested in that too.

Thanks!

Edited March 24, 2018 by suzelle
adding a line

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

Sorry I was trying to type desirable.  

Edited March 25, 2018 by Gregg From Keystone Sewing

[suzelle]

As found condition - under the table 

[suzelle]

Previous Owner fixed a couple things. Trying to add more pics because I wanted to show the paper clip wrapped around the top of the rod that connect to the motor. Anyhow, I'm unable to post another photo, but use your imagination.  I am sure this is part of the reason the machine had never really been used at all. I have Mickey Mouse to thank. So glad the head is in such great shape. Really just a few small adjustments all over the machine and it will be a great workhorse for standard sewing in the table.

I'm thinking I will go ahead and use the clutch motor in the table, that makes sense. Later, when I get the table all set up (taking my time) I will work on making the machine portable too. It has the kind of hinges that allow you to just lift the machine right out of the table without any unscrewing or anything. Love that!

Edited April 10, 2018 by suzelle

[suzelle]

I am hunting for the rod and the bolts that go here to hold the motor into position and/also adjust the belt tension.

Can't find anything online, just a part. Hopefully I can find one, if not I may just fabricate this part. If anybody has one of these, please let me know.

Much appreciated!

[Michiel]

I have two sewing machines i do not use verry often so they share one table (they have the same bedsize)

i discovered that in my case the motor is heavy enough to produce the right moment to keep the belt on tension.

(so its verry easy switching machines)

it  works because of the angle of the motor (realated to the v belt) 

maybe it works for you to (depending f the position of the connection between the table and the motor and the lenght of the V belt.

since this works so well i try to have all my machines from the same " family" (adler in my case)

 

[brmax]

I think to avoid shipping cost, I would fabricate. This choice if I was in a hurry. 

The connection at the top needs known ? I believe it to take typically an L shape 3/8” rod to be .340” diameter up to 3/8” with threads at the oppositte end, these likely 3/8” course thread size and 4”.  In short I would picture a 7”  long bolt and have some one help with vise, bend this long bolt. The shape would be an L with the bottom end then longer at 5-3/4” and straight with 3/8” threads. The top length being 1-1/4” long. Flat washers needed @ 2, with one loc washer and two standard nuts that fit the threads. Again this if in a hurry and to save shipping which i havent a clue what 4 oz cost.

 

Good day

Floyd

 

[suzelle]

 

Michiel and BRMAX,

Thank you for your ideas! Initially, I was hoping that when I found a Singer 20U, that it could share a table with another machine. Unfortunately, my Pfaff 545 isn't the same size opening. I have seen a few photos of tables that people have altered in different ways, even for machines that were shorter - they put a filler piece in the table to temporarily fill the gap in the table for smaller machines. That's also something to consider, but the whole belt and motor combo would have to be easy to adjust for me, otherwise I wouldn't do that.

I really don't mind having (2) Commercial tables, I can always lift the Singer 20U out  when not in use, and still utilize the table as part of my extension table(s) set up for my Pfaff when I sew long banners. So I do have some floor space in that area of the shop. I'm not in a hurry to get this Singer 20U set up.

BRMAX, thanks for your ideas about fabricating a bolt, I had been thinking I might do just what you have described. Not being in the bolt-bending business myself, I wasn't sure if I was on the right track though, if the bolt was actually bendable. Glad you described it, thank you! Wouldn't you think you could just buy that bolt with the bend already in it? I was unable to find anything but maybe someone who sells motors would have those parts available to them. I'll keep trying and if no luck, will probably just visit my local hardware store and start fabricating! Thanks so much!

Edited April 17, 2018 by suzelle
Adding photo

[dikman]

Best way to bend a bolt is to heat it at the bend point first, this removes any stresses and ensures it won't break/fracture. As long as the bolt is mild steel, however it can be bent with brute force, either holding it in a (solid) vice and hitting it with a big hammer or slide a long piece of pipe over it and pull! The only thing you have to watch is that you don't damage the threads (I've had to make a couple myself).

[480volt]

Threaded rod bends easy and is cheap. It’s like grade nothing on the SAE chart, but will be plenty strong for what you are doing.

[suzelle]

On 4/17/2018 at 3:29 PM, dikman said:

Best way to bend a bolt is to heat it at the bend point first, this removes any stresses and ensures it won't break/fracture. As long as the bolt is mild steel, however it can be bent with brute force, either holding it in a (solid) vice and hitting it with a big hammer or slide a long piece of pipe over it and pull! The only thing you have to watch is that you don't damage the threads (I've had to make a couple myself).

Thanks dikman and 400volt! Okay, no fear - I will proceed!    Had a busy weeks, lots of my Customers in a rush for stuff, so have been away from the forum.

Hopefully I will find some more time to mess with this machine next week. Although I say I am not in a hurry (I'm not, I have other machines) I am anxious to get this one together. I think this machine is going to be one I'll use pretty regularly for it's zigzag stitch. I have so much v69 thread too, which is all good thread but not getting used much these days. So I'm excited! 

Again, thankyou!

[suzelle]

Well, I found a little time today to get the singer 20U out again and still haven't found the rod I need to get the motor properly hooked up. I've been to the hardware store and poked around a bit, just hadn't yet found the right bolt/rod. I did find a sewing machine shop that may have the part I need though, and I would prefer to just buy that if I can.

So in the meantime.... I decided to install a couple of parts on my machine to beef it up a bit. I found the parts on the sailrite.com site for my machine. I added a heavier duty beehive spring in the tension knob, a heavier duty take up spring, and a heavier duty spring for the presser foot. These three changes will allow me to work with thicker/heavier materials. It took some doing, but I got the stitch looking good. I tested the stitched by turning the handwheel manually, which took some time! 

Since I don't have an actual manual for this exact machine (which is a 20U33) I downloaded the closest one I could find, which looks slightly different than my machine and older. There are a few things that look a little different on my machine, and the stitch widths on the 20U's can vary from about 9mm to 12mm. My machine does 9mm zig zag at best and I'm happy with that. I'm guessing that most of the 20U machines are capable of 5 stitches per inch, which I wish mine could do. I'm getting close to 6 stitches per inch. This is a bit shorter stitch than I thought this machine was capable of.

Anyone know how to make the stitch longer? I've got the stitch dial set to it's longest, which says "5" on the dial, so I'm certain that's not the problem. This machine is older, but it is in like new condition. So the parts are not worn out. Is there something I'm missing or something to learn about how to adjust the machine to make it stitch longer? Please let me know if you have the same machine I have and if you are able to to get 5 stitches per inch.

Thanks so much!

[Constabulary]

if you can´t find a pitman rod buy 2 feet of chain and 2 S-Hooks.

[suzelle]

Constabulary, thank you for that idea! Yes, I'll be needing a pitman rod too. Wasn't sure what that was called, so thank you again!

[suzelle]

Okay, I think I figured out my stitch length problem!

The stitch length problem is really a math problem.

Since I don't have the manual for this machine, I was guessing based on what I found on internet that my machine would do 5 stitches per inch. Well, after finding some more info (brand new 20U machines for sale), I think the longest stitch on the machine would be 5mm, not 5 stitches per inch!

Conclusion: This machine is now sewing the longest stitch possible, unless I can find a trick to make it sew longer stitches than manufacturer intended.

Sadly, this won't do for some of my heavy duty sewing. I do like that it can easily sew the v69 poly bonded thread and I can use it for upholstery work, sewing denims and that type of thing. I can also use it as a portable machine, but this thing is heavy! I think I found out it's limitations! I still like it though and it's in great condition.

Thank you all for reading and for you input.

[suzelle]

I got my first project done on the machine with the help of a small motor (1.5 amp) attached to the machine. My project the repair of my Greenhouse Cover. I have well over 1,000 Japanese Maple trees that I've been growing and my poor Greenhouse Cover that I bought Spring of last year was falling apart. My young trees still need protection from the heat and direct sun in the warmer months. The webbing reinforced plastic was still very usable and functional, only the manufacturer used a very cheap cotton thread to construct it and it was falling apart after a year in the sunshine. I estimate that I had sewn about 400 feet of v69 bonded poly thread through the machine last night and the machine powered through it with no issues, perfect stitching all the way through. All I have left to do is attach a few grommets to anchor my newly repaired greenhouse cover to the frame. It felt good to be able to do this job at home, I didn't have to drive to the shop and drag this huge cover around.

Since I did all of my sewing in one sitting, the small motor and foot pedal got a bit warm, so this motor set-up is really just temporary or for smaller jobs, until I find something better. I had the foot pedal already and decided to just put out a few bucks for a 1.5 amp motor. Has a little more oomph than most of the small motors I have owned.

I did try a zigzag stitch at one point, and decided since there was lots of skipping going on in the stitch with zigzag, that I would just do the entire repair job with straight stitch. That was fine for this project, so my zigzag was just an experiment. I'll have to figure that out later 

As far as parts go for my table set-up, I was able to locate a real pitman rod, I had also found a new bolt (bent rod) for adjusting the belt pressure on the 1/2 horsepower. After upgrading the tension spring and the foot pressure springs in the machine, I may even be able to sew with v-92 thread, we'll see. I'll wait to get it into the table before I try that. 

Of course I still would wish to be able to sew a longer stitch, but if 5mm is all this machine will do, I will still be handy as a portable machine. I ordered a new wooden carrier/case for porting it around, arrivingtomorrow. I will want to get a decent thread stand for the portable set up too, that was one of the parts the previous owner took off the machine. Sailrite has a nice one that swings out from the bed of machine. The older 20U-33 machines like mine came with a couple thread stand options and a light that attached to the back of the machine. I also ordered a modern LED magnetic light for the machine which will plug right into the socket I have for the foot pedal (portable set up), or into the 1/2 horsepower motor in the table set-up. The magnetic lights look pretty nice and nice that you can moved them around on the machine as needed. I was having a hard time lastnight seeing what I was doing without a light attached to my machine.

Just wanted to share what I've done with this machine if there is anyone else out there looking for ideas on how they can put together a portable machine that may be the answer to some of your projects where you need something a little beefier than a standard home sewing machine and you need to be able to take it with you.