Getting ready to pull the trigger on sewing machine and would like some input.

[TonyRV2]

Hi all...I started out as a knife maker a few years ago and making sheaths is what got me started in leather, although did a little leather work back in the 70's. Anyway, I'm finding I enjoy the leatherwork even more than the knife making an plan on expanding that part of my hobby. To that end, I'd like to branch into making handbags, hats, straps and so on, and maybe put enough together to start doing fairs and festivals. Thus the need/want for a sewing machine, as I've been hand stitching everything up to this point. So moving forward, I need a machine that does well with garment leather as well as knife sheaths. I think I've settled in on a Cobra Class 20 machine and I've found very little feedback on this model here at Leatherworker. The specs say this machine is good for up to 1/2 inches which should adequately cover the 3 layers of 7/8 oz leather that I use for sheaths, and furthermore, since this is a flat table model it will naturally be well suited to much thinner projects.  

So then, anyone have any experience with this particular machine, and do you think that it would be the best machine for the jobs I want to do? Thank you for your input!

[mikesc]

Get a cylinder model, ( more versatile ) not a flat bed, get a "table attachment" ( @uwe may have some ) for it, for when you want a flat bed..

[kgg]

Tony I don't think the cobra class 20 machine is going to be the ideal machine. There is not going to be one machine that does both ends of the spectrum. You need to decide whether you are going to do mostly garment weight items or holsters. A machine that will do the holster would probably tear the hell out of garment weight stuff and a machine that does garment weight won't be able to handle the holster weight. 

To give you an example Sewing Gold have a good set of videos on youtube that show the end result with three Juki's dnu-1541s, du-1181n and ddl-8700 sewing the same light, medium and heavy fabric. I would class the 1541S as a good compound feed upholstery type machine, 1181n a walking foot machine and the 8700 as a garment machine.

kgg

 

[Wizcrafts]

The Cobra Class 20 is listed as capable of tensioning #207 thread. That is doable by spacing the hook far enough away from the needle to let that size thread pass around the hook and bobbin case. I have a post bed machine that was adjusted to sew with #207 thread, so I know it is doable. But, sewing 1/2 inch of veg-tan leather with #207 thread is something that's not as simple as it seems.

Each layer of 8 ounce leather adds to the density of the package that needs to be penetrated and then held down as the threaded needle ascends, carrying the overlocked bobbin thread with it. This is where problems manifest themselves when you try to sew thicker than the machine is setup to handle efficiently. The holding down part is done by a coil pressure spring. That spring would have to be as strong as the ones used in the Cobra Class 3 and 4 to keep the leather stack from lifting with the needle. Lifting leather, due to insufficient spring pressure, causes skipped stitches, bent and broken needles, needles stuck inside the leather and varying stitch lengths.

These problems can occur with 3/8 inch of veg-tan too. I would ask for a demonstration of the machine sewing 24 ounces, or more, of veg-tan leather, with a #24 needle and #207 thread, top and bottom. Those are the minimum needle/thread requirements for such a stack of leather. Personally, I use at least #277, or #346 thread when I sew over 3/8 inch of veg-tan leather, or Latigo. This requires a #25 or #26 needle! And, I have to crank down the pressure screw to keep the thick stack of leather with thick knots from lifting on my CB4500 or my buddy's Class 4.

Just my .02

[TonyRV2]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I just got off the phone with Alexander at Solar Leather Machines and he advised that for what I want to do that the CB3200 or (something he thought would be better) the CB3200 Pro which apparently a little heavier duty, has a heavier stand and a sewing area which is more accessible. He didn't seem to think that the optional table platform would do much good in sewing thinner leathers and also indicated that the minimum thickness that could be sewn would be about 6oz stacked...and then only with careful adjustment. This last part worries me a bit considering its my first machine. So I guess my new question to the group is this: Has anyone sewn thinner garment leathers with this model and what was your experience?  Thanks in advance for you help!  

[Wizcrafts]

9 hours ago, TonyRV2 said:

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I just got off the phone with Alexander at Solar Leather Machines and he advised that for what I want to do that the CB3200 or (something he thought would be better) the CB3200 Pro which apparently a little heavier duty, has a heavier stand and a sewing area which is more accessible. He didn't seem to think that the optional table platform would do much good in sewing thinner leathers and also indicated that the minimum thickness that could be sewn would be about 6oz stacked...and then only with careful adjustment. This last part worries me a bit considering its my first machine. So I guess my new question to the group is this: Has anyone sewn thinner garment leathers with this model and what was your experience?  Thanks in advance for you help!  

Alexander knows his stuff. He not only sells machines, but also sews on them professionally. His advice about the CB3200 is spot on. You are going to need one machine for light, thin work - with small needles and thread, and another for heavy, thick work with big needles and thread. That is my experience.

[dikman]

Tony, you are faced with the same unpalatable truth that many who start out with industrial sewing machines soon discover - there is no one-machine-that-does-it-all (unfortunately). Many want to start with bags, dress belts, purses etc - oh, and maybe the odd knife sheath, and maybe a holster or two. Which is why people end up with a minimum of two machines (and generally more!). In my case I have to hand stitch holsters as I have nothing that can handle them.

I recently came across a nice used 3200, unfortunately it's 3 days drive away so I'll just have to keep looking.

[JLSleather]

My judgment, you're going to be better off with a slightly lighter machine.. maybe the cowboy 227.  Should sew your garment leathers reliably.  Hand sew those 3/8" thick sheaths 'n' holsters... far less stitching on those.

[TonyRV2]

Thank you to everyone that has responded, I know these things have been discussed ad nausaum. Yeah JL, I considered just doing the thicker stuff by hand, but I'm now at the point where I believe I will be buying the Cowboy CB3200 and then, over the next few months look for a used flat table machine which seem to be found rather commonly in order have something set up for thinner leather.

 

[Mark842]

IMO your looking for a unicorn to do both good. I have the Cobra version of the CB3200 and it is an excellent machine but it will struggle with anything under 6 oz. the problem is that the smallest needle and thread combo you can get away with using basically leaves you with not enough thickness to hide the knot. I honestly don't know of any machine that will sew both good. You need to decide what product you want to start with, either the garment leather products or the sheaths. Seeing your last post your making a good choice. you're going to love that machine!

[TonyRV2]

Thanks Mark...I suffered from newbie to sewing machines syndrome going into this but I'm over it now. In fact I'll be ordering the CB3200 this afternoon, and then I need to go down to the car dealership to buy a Mini Cooper to haul lumber and cinder blocks in.  

Edited May 1, 2019 by TonyRV2