Singer 29-4 For Sale

[Sheilajeanne]

This ad came up on FB: https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/3004428886443934/?referralSurface=messenger_lightspeed_banner&referralCode=messenger_banner

Trying to get an idea of what the machine is realistically worth (NOT paying $550!)

Seller says it's been in storage for 12 years and came originally from a tailor's or cobbler's shop.

Also wondering exactly what it would weigh with the stand - how much man or woman power would be needed to get it into the back of an SUV!

No, it's not motorized...treadle only.

Edited April 26, 2021 by Sheilajeanne

[Ferg]

Jane,

That machine in decent working order is well worth the $550. I have seen one of the legs on the base for over $100.

I have one, it is motorized with a digital. I really have very little use for it but it is restored and on a wooden pedestal stand I built.

If you can get the head off the base it weighs probably between 80 and 90 pounds, the base would be close to that also.

Don't try to haul it with the base attached.

Ferg

[Sheilajeanne]

Would you pay $550 for it without a motor, Ferg?

I've asked her if everything seems to move the way it should. It's been in storage a long time so things could have seized up.

[jimi]

Mmmm...is that flywheel shaft bent? or is it a fish eye lens??

[Northmount]

1 hour ago, jimi said:

Mmmm...is that flywheel shaft bent? or is it a fish eye lens??

Looks like the photos are taken with a smart phone, and the more close up you get, the more the wide angle lens distorts the image.  That's why selfies photos are less than attractive.  Make the nose much more prominent; anything closer to the lens looks bigger!

[Sheilajeanne]

They have sent me more pictures. The flywheel is okay and there is no obvious rust on the machine. It appears in reasonably good shape, other than a lot of the paint being worn off in places. And she says everything goes up and down and round and round when she steps on the treadle.

Have asked for the serial number, which is visible in one of the photos, but not large enough to read. I blew up the photo as best I could and the first two figures might be 78, which means it was manufactured in 1887!!

Well, I knew it wasn't young!  

 

Edited April 26, 2021 by Sheilajeanne

[Sheilajeanne]

This is the photo that give the best view of the whole machine, and shows the wear and tear:

 

[Sheilajeanne]

Okay, she got back to me. The number is G3710600, but I am wondering if there was an A in front of the G that got worn off, as there are no numbers that start with that prefix. Edit: found the G serial numbers. Looks like it was made in 1910. http://ismacs.net/singer_sewing_machine_company/serial-numbers/singer-g-series-serial-numbers.html

I have also found and read through a previous thread about these machines, where Wiz gives the pros and cons (some parts hard to find, really short stitch length when badly worn). So, I know if I decide to check it out, I will need to check the stitch length.

https://leatherworker.net/forum/topic/21807-singer-29-4-usable/?tab=comments#comment-140010

 

The Singer website has this to say about the machines. I think it was used for sewing furs, ask she said the locker it was stored in also had a lot of fur coats in it.

 

In the whole range of leather stitching this is one of the handiest machines ever invented.

It is extensively used all over the world for Boot and Shoe repairing, Furriers' work, Slipper binding, Harness work, etc.

The stitching is performed at the extreme outer end of the arm, which may be inserted into the interior of very small and long apertures like toes of shoes and boot-legs etc.

The machine is unequaled for repairing boots and shoes and will stitch closer to the toe of a boot than any other; it will use waxed and coarse thread, making a tight seam; it also uses a fine needle and thread.

 

Edited April 26, 2021 by Sheilajeanne

[ljk]

My first shoepatcher was a 29-4 for $25 still in service. By far the worst of the singer 29 series.  Mainly because the base (foot) area cannot be replaced. That being said if it sews 6 stitches to the inch and needs no parts or service it is probably worth it because the stand is included.  Oil generously particularly the head and cam bushings.  If it won't sew forget it, to expensive to repair.

[jimi]

3 hours ago, Northmount said:

Looks like the photos are taken with a smart phone, and the more close up you get, the more the wide angle lens distorts the image.  That's why selfies photos are less than attractive.  Make the nose much more prominent; anything closer to the lens looks bigger!

Aha that is what i thought but was not 100%?? sure Tom, good observation.

Yes over this end you can find them cheaper and a bit newer but you need to hunt them down, i see over in the US they ask a lot for these old patchers? 

 

 

[Ferg]

Jane,

I bought mine several years ago and gave $600 for the head. It had been redone to a certain extent. Refinished anyway.

I actually got 7 spi out of it. Thread size is critical, #92 is max. There are a few parts available for them.

If it sews without bumping and banging around it is probably okay for its age. BTW: that is the year date of mine.

There are new decals available which I have just never got around to putting them on.

If I had the option of electrified or treadle, I would take the treadle although I can sew as slow as you wish with mine.

My next thought is they are "Fiddly" to use. Takes some practice to use them well. You are never going to use it for Horse Tack.

I just like to look at mine. My wife thinks I am nuts anyway. lol I think of it as a working machine that was built in 1910 which makes it 111 years  old.

How many machines of any kind do we have option of buying that still work at that age?

BTW: Singer needles of today work fine in them.

Would I buy it? YES! And I still say if it actually works that is a good buy at $550

Keep us posted. Should be an interesting visit for you. If I was closer I would be delighted to go with you to see it. LOL

I would sell you mine for a good price including the stand and Servo if you want to drive down here again.

Ferg

Edited April 26, 2021 by Ferg

[Sheilajeanne]

sigh...if they ever open the darn border, there are several people I'd like to visit in the northeastern U.S.! But I doubt that's going to happen any time soon!

She says her price is negotiable, so I can likely get it for less than what she's asking. The problem with testing it is the one and only time I ever tried to use a treadle machine, I made a terrible mess of the thread!  I suppose if I just stick with hand cranking the wheel, I'll do okay.

They have never used it, know nothing about it, so I will be very much on my own if I go to test it out. I've been watching videos on threading it and winding the bobbin. The bobbin is very similar to the one I used in Home Ec classes during the 1960's, so hopefully it won't be too hard to figure out.

Edited April 27, 2021 by Sheilajeanne

[Constabulary]

Some wear parts are critical (gearbox pinion + rack f.i.) - you may find them with some luck, time an money. Worst thing is you cannot re time the needle & hook on this model (critical when pinions and rack are worn down). IMO the early 29´s are really bottom like patchers. You can get better / later model patcher machines for that money but of course depends on your market and how badly you want / need a patcher. If the rack and pinions are worn, the needle plate is shot and the hook is poor and you have to replace / rework the bell crank lever (because of short stitches) and maybe the foot and other bits (like the 4 rollers which can be worn / have a flat side / are rusted in place) you will end up investing 150 - 250 (remember - certain wear parts are obsolete) + tinkering (good when have a hubby or can do it on your own).

This is of course a worst case scenario but you cannot foresee how good or bad a 110 years old patcher is and if it has probably been rebuild or not. The presence or condition of decals is often a sign for the degree of wear. It of course tells not the whole story but decals are often a good indicator.

If it is sewing properly and can make 4mm long stitches (5mm is max ex factory) then why not but I would not pay that kind of money for a 110 years old patcher in unknown condition. Maybe half the price. But again depends on your market and...

You always can make something out of nothing but there are always 2 sides of the coin.

If you want to test it hand crank it - look for a manual and read it, buy needles are thread (#69) and check how it performs.

EDIT:

Some years ago I refurbished a similar model. It was a fun project for the cold days...

 

Edited April 27, 2021 by Constabulary

[chrisash]

Pay the extra and get a more model one or even a new one, they have spares available. though bases are quite valued in the UK and can be sold for anything from £100-200 on there own. I have heard that the Amish community in the US make and sell some spares for the early models at  quite expensive prices

[kgg]

22 hours ago, Sheilajeanne said:

Trying to get an idea of what the machine is realistically worth (NOT paying $550!)

The asking price for the Singer 29k's in general have increased in Ontario over the last year. Looking at the photo's, to me it looks like it was rode hard and put away wet. I won't spend anywhere close to the asking price and would consider it a project machine. The true test will be to see if it will stitch and knowing that if it needs repairs those parts maybe hard to come by, expense or for certain parts just unavailable. Overall I would have a tenancy to pass on the machine unless you get really cheap and continue to search for a newer model like a Singer 29k-70's machine that parts are more readily available for.

If you need a 29k style patcher and don't want to spend the $2500 plus for a new clone from a dealer I would have a tendency to look at places down your way like ASC365.com knowing you will probably get no support for around $1100 (asc365.com/newproductdetail.asp?productid=188073&typeid=1847 ). As a note I don't know anything about Asc365 or any of their equipment they sell.

Best of luck,

kgg

[Sheilajeanne]

Thanks, Constabulary (and everyone else)! I have already found and downloaded the manual. As I said earlier, I believe it was used for sewing furs, which might mean less wear and tear than in a cobbler's shop. Just guessing, though...

If the seller didn't live 5 hours away, I'd have made arrangements to see it and test it out already. Not sure I want to drive all that way, then find out the machine is too worn out to be worth the trip. The seller doesn't know enough to be able to really test it out themselves.

If I were going to make the drive, I thought I'd offer them $300 if it tests out okay.

Decisions, decisions... 

Edited April 27, 2021 by Sheilajeanne

[chrisash]

Wizz would probably be the best person to ask and have knowledge of the spares availability of the 29-4

[Sheilajeanne]

21 minutes ago, chrisash said:

Wizz would probably be the best person to ask and have knowledge of the spares availability of the 29-4

Chrisash, he covered that in the earlier thread I linked to above. Believe me, the first thing I did when I saw the ad was search this forum!   Little gold mine we have here...

[Brewerkel]

Recently retired from the wholesale shoe findings business, stocked or ordered every Singer 29K series part you can imagine for 27 years.

Pass on this machine; parts are not compatible with later series. If the drive rail is bent or has a broken tooth you will have to have a replacement machined by a skilled technician. Sewing fur might have been its last purpose but it was unlikely its only one during a very long life.

You might be able to find a 29K51 for that kind of money or maybe a couple hundred more, as shoe repairing is a dying trade. At least that is a dependable machine with parts readily available.

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