David Genadek

I have been approached by some one that wants me to do a custom bike seat. I thought it would be fun to give one a go. This is not a market I know anything about so I am trying to get some idea what a reasonable charge would be . My guess would be between $500.00 to $600.00. Am I in the ball park? I'm also wondering why no one uses a welted construction? David Genadek

If you look at the seat and find that the low point of the seat is back by the cantle, that will be the real issue. If the seat is forcing your pelvis out of neutral position it is causing you to grab with your legs so you are feeling the bulk. Fix the seat so it gives a level platform for your pelvis then focus on getting your sternum and sacrum parallel this will open all your joints so you can move freely with the horse and eliminate the need to grab with your legs and the bulk will disappear David Genadek.

The Longissmus dorsimuscle has no weight-bearing capability. It is however the major antagonist to getting the horse to collect and as such it is the role of both the tree and saddlemaker to do all that they possibly can to prevent this muscle from becoming tight. Commonly accepted practices of horsemanship such as collection, engagingthe hind quarter getting the horse on the bit all become extremely difficult if not impossible if the with longissamus dorsi muscle is tight. The actual function of the the longissamus muscle is to support the spine and arch the back. The actual argument for placing the saddle goes as follows : The horses spine is made up of two separate limbs thatconnect at the anticlinal vertebrae. (The limb theory comes from the world ofpaleontology and biomechanics not the veterinary community so it isunderstandable that people in the veterinary community are not aware of it.). Here is a picture showing a horse divided basedon it's spinal limbs. The argument isthat the back half of the horse or the rear spinal limbs function is the engineof movement and needs to left unencumbered to allow for the generation of thehorses arc of motion. Here is picture ofa sliding stop and you can clearly see how the lumbar region flex's away fromthe saddle. Would you place your chair on a trap door that you know would have to open? Becauseof its' function there is no weight bearing capability in the lumbar span. In fact it has to flex upward in order to get the stifle torelease because of how the reciprocating system of the hind limb ties into thelower back. Inhibit the upward flexationof the lumbar span and you cause stifle and then hock problems. Here is a linkto a diagram that originally appeared in Equus magazine. You will find the photo on the last post onthis page My link The anatomy dictates that the only area a horse has a the ability to support arider is on the back half of the frontspinal limb. Here you have support from both passive and active systems. To understandthe functioning of the horses back you have to understand that the horses bodyhas both active and passive systems. The active systems have muscles that cancontract the passive systems are made of ligaments. The passive systems form reciprocatingsystems. A desk lamp is areciprocating system so this becomes a crude model of the reciprocating systems of the horses body. Most horse owners are aware of the importance of havingproperly balanced feet as this puts the reciprocating systems of the legs intobalance. What horse owners are less aware of, is that the reciprocatingsystems of the legs can also be thrown out of balance form the top down. Inshort if the Longissamus dorsi muscle is tight you will throw off the balanceof the reciprocating systems of thelegs. The dorsal ligament is a major component of the horses back that allows the body to carry wieght. Here is the lamp model with the spinalprocesses and dorsal ligament added. The differing angles of the spinal processes create a reciprocation when the horse engages his hind quarter and puts tension on the dorsal ligament. The sacrum is one big fused bone where the spinal processes lean backward and it acts like a lever to pull on the dorsal ligament . In the lumbar span the spinalprocesses lean forward so when hind endis engaged the reciprocation of the lumbar is upward which in changes anglesand allows the stifle to release. The spinal processes of lumbar region are inclined backward so the reciprocation is backwards and actually lifts the frontend of the horse . to some slow motion bucking horses. You can see the systems working . Notice how the lumbar span on these horses have an upward curve to them . Notice how the horse uses its hind end to lift the front end. First they will engage their hindquarters then they will lift the base of the neck. The last thing to notice is where the cowboys are sitting. keep in mindthey make their living by staying on the rankest of horses and to get themaximum effect they sit at the base of the wither because it is there and only there that the horse is best able to move. You fit english and western saddles exactly the same. The biomechanics are exactly the same inenglish riding as they in western riding . The working of a pickup truck doesn't change depending on what thedriver is wearing. Nor does it changedepending on if you are going to the grocery store or hauling wood. How the horse works is how the horse works and you either work with that or against it. English saddles on average have1" shorter bar length than western saddles. For anyone interested in learning systems anatomy I recommend this class. The content of this class has been reviewed by the veterinary community and found to be correct so the class can be used by vets for their continuing education. The added benefit is the teacher rode extensibility with Tom Dorrance and Ray Hunt so she can put the system anatomy into the everyday perspective of a cowhand. I would also like to invite everyone to join me at the University of Wisconsin River Falls October 1st at 6pm to hear my complete lecture on the subject. Although I am always cheap I am seldom free and in this case I'm being sponsored by local vets and the university so the lecture is free. Here is a link to an interview I did with Rick Lamb where we talk about some of this, some of you might find it interesting. It re aired on 8/14/2010. David Genadek

The horse owners management skills should always be considered as should their riding ability. A saddle tree will be somewhat self adjusting for weight gain and and loss with in normal parameters if the maker has actually fit the skeletal structure of a non pathological back and the rider is proficient in the five essentials of horsemanship. If not it is a crap shoot of shifting pathologies. This works because of how the fat collects in the body. The whither will get thicker but fat will also collect along both sides of the spine, that is why on a really fat horse you can pour water on their back and it won't run off. If you have fit the ribcage the fat wi will lift the front of the saddle which is triangular shaped and as such it gets wider as it is lifted. This only works with in normal limits and it is the responsibility of every horse owner to know what those limits are for each individual and do all that is necessary to maintain their emotional and physical health. David Genadek

I use Dreamweaver which allows me to get as involved as I am capable. I have a online subscription to Total Training so I can learn what I need to know quickly. If your not doing a lot with it I think your better off hiring it done. You pretty much need to understand Cascading Style sheets nowadays if your going to get anywhere. This stuff makes me feel real dumb at times. I am running CS3 right now but will soon upgrade to CS5 and I have been finding with each upgrade to Dreamweaver things become more user friendly however the possibilities seem to expand geometrically too so it all can be a bit overwhelming for an amateur. It always seems with all programs that if you want any real control you have to learn a lot. If your good in Photoshop there is a program called Site Grinder that lets you do your layout in Photoshop and then it converts it to a site for you. My host has built in software that I could use for free if I wanted but I have never tried it. David Genadek

I buy around a $1,000.00 month worth from Weaver and have not seen any difference in service or quality. They have consistently been one of the best companies for me to work with. It is fair for a company to charge more shipping and handling on small orders especially when their prices are generally the lowest in the industry. Here is some news on their sale: Weaver Leather sells majority interest to private firm November 4, 2008By CHRIS LEONARD Staff Writer MILLERSBURG -- Weaver Leather has sold a majority interest to Capital Partners, a small Greenwich, Conn., private equity firm, to "ensure the long-term stability of the company," officials said in a release. The deal was made Oct. 27, and "this decision was made after careful consideration and will ensure the long-term stability of the company for its employees, customers and suppliers," the release stated. "Selling majority interest to Capital Partners will provide expanded opportunities for Weaver Leather to pursue new product lines and opportunities in the marketplace." Spokesman Jeff Albaugh said "there's no additional comments or interviews." He declined comment on what the "expanded opportunities" were and also any effect the sale has to its 262 employees. Paul Weaver, chief executive officer and second-generation owner, declined comment. In the release, it stated he "will continue his active involvement in the organization both as chairman of the board and shareholder." As of Sept. 26, Weaver Leather filed to become a limited liability corporation in the state of Delaware, according to a state Web site. "An LLC gives you the best of both worlds. It allows you to avoid the double tax and, according to the legal profession, provides limited liability," said John Cook, a certified public accountant with Wooster-based Long, Cook & Samsa. With an LLC, a company pays taxes on all income earned and not on income and dividends like a corporation, Cook said. "Weaver Leather will continue operations at its Mount Hope, Ohio headquarters with the same core values, culture and passion for exceeding customer expectations through quality products and excellent service that have been cornerstones since the company's founding in 1973," according to the press release. Started by founder Harry Weaver as a two-man shop, Weaver Leather has grown from making products like leather halters to pet supplies, horse saddlery and arborist equipment. Capital Partners Managing Director Mark Allsteadt said the investment company, founded in 1982, makes investments long-term and keeps a laissez-faire approach concerning company direction. "We invest money in high-quality, middle-market companies. We think Weaver Leather is one of those high-quality companies," he said. "We hold the investments long-term and let the existing management run the company." According to its Web site, it invested in companies like Border Foods, a packer and marketer of green chile and jalapeno products, and Flavor House, the largest snack nut processor and marketer in the United States. "We like what we would describe as niche markets that are relatively small in size that would allow a company like Weaver Leather to be a leading participant in the market," Allsteadt said. Looks to me like they needed more capital to grow. David Genadek

Cowboy 316 There are a few things you should keep it at the top of your mind when designing a rigging. The most important of which is where the tree was designed to be placed on the horse. There are basically two schools on thisthe first school or the traditional school seeks to get the rider is close tothe base of the wither as possible as anatomically this is where the horse is best equipped to carry the rider. The newer school tries to center the saddle on the anticlinal vertebrae which is generally found to be the third rib up from the hindquarter. Unfortunately this weights the lumbar span and causes stifle and hock problems none the less it has become the popular line of thought today. So when you are determining your D position the first question you need to have an answer to is Where was the tree designed to sit ? Your next question is going to be; Where do you want your cinch to lie? Here again there are two basic thoughts the traditional thought of behind the furthest point that the elbow will go back or the currently popular thought of being in the girth groove. One should first ask; Why is the girth groove there? You will hear that you need to have the girth in the girth groove so that it rests on the sternum and as such you will be anchoring to something solid, the sternum is made of cartilage. The second reality here is that the sternum is up much higher in the body than people think which you can verify very easily with any anatomy book , you will find that at best you could only catch the very tail end of it. Further the sternum is made of cartilage as are the costal cartilages which is what the cinch will actually be resting on. Some current research being done over in Europe is showing that these currently popular concepts of where the cinch should go are cracking and displacing the costal cartilages(this is the cartilage that goes from the end of the rib up to the sternum). So before one goes about designing the rigging one should have a clear perspective of the facts and how they see them, as it is the actual anatomy of the horse and the laws of physics that will determine what you need to do. As for the laws of physics, the flat plate rigging is a triangular configuration. The designcenters around the engineering principle that states; If you have a triangle and you pull on the point of the triangle the pressure will go to where the area of the triangle is divided in half. This should be the overriding principle used when laying out the shape of the flat plate. One must also take into account that most flat plate riggings also have the rear billet which means it is a hybrid between a triangular configuration and a double configuration. If whoever is using the saddle is tightening the rear cinch the shape of the triangle becomes less critical. David Genadek

Here is a clip I did for my lectures so people could see how the horses back functions. David Genadek

I have a lot of trouble with the bolts breaking on all of them. One of my John Bianchi just had all the threads strip out while stamping. I had similer issue with my Barry King maul. This seems to happen with all wieghts and I have had big issue with heads working loose. David Genadek

The corporation Cow Country which produced and sold the brand Circle Y had three plants that produced saddles at different price points. If you could look under the seat and tell us what color the tree is we could give a better guess. If it was Black or Orange it is a Ralide. The black trees are the cheapest. If this is the case you should find a metal disclaimer plate on the skirt that essentially says that the saddle will work fine as long as you don't use it. If the tree is white color then it is fiberglassed covered and if it is brown or green then it likely rawhide covered. David Genadek

This is the real answer but one should also check the shape of the seat . Does it have a flat spot for the pelvis or is the low point of the seat way back near the cantle? What does the fender pattern look like? Was it designed to place the legs forward? Martha Jose used to sell Velcroe you could put on the seat and on your pants (really I'm not kidding). David Genadek

It would be helpful if you could post some pictures of your horse from different angles. What you have described sounds like old polish lines which is very different than the Crabett lines that most "Arab trees" are made for. David Genadek

It's just an edge paint that is commonly used in manufacturing. You can get it from a company like LCI David Genadek

I tried it. I failed. I actually sent one of my trees over to them along with patterns and instructions and told them I would work closely with their people to help them learn how to build the saddles. It took for ever for them to get it done and when they finally got it done it was hardly recognizable as the saddle. I was dealing with the owner of the company and I suggested that I be able to actually work with his people and train them. However, the caste system over there is pretty rigid and he was the boss and it was the job of his production people to know how to do things so the idea of doing additional training just did not sink in. I was discussing this with a friend that spends a great deal of time in India working for a computer company and he explained it to me like this. "They can put in a vent cover for an air-conditioning duct on the wall and think they have air conditioning and not understand why it isn't working." Another issue that came up was using sewing machines. This gentleman thought that was a strange idea as he needed to employ a lot of people and sewing machines would speed things up and would not allow him to employ as many people. But when I asked about the quality control he basically said that that was up to his production people and I got the impression that if somebody did not do it correctly they would get beat with a cane or something like that. I finally decided that as much as I have a fascination with India and I think they have a huge impact on the saddle market in the US for lower-cost goods and as such it would be nice if they had some reasonably designed product. However, I believe their inability to grasp the necessity of form to function makes the likelihood of properly designed equipment coming from India a remote possibility and as such I act way from the project. China or Thailand would be a whole other story. David Genadek

People visit all the time I have no problem with that. In fact we have a guild meeting here tomorrow night and I will often complete a whole project during the meeting so people know it can be done. The two attached belts were done at a guild meeting. One I had stamped earlier in the day so I could show the dying but the natural one was from scratch. I didn't use my normal belt sewing machine as I have it another shop but everyone got to see a lined basket stamped belt from start to finish. David Genadek