Scrap Leather Thoughts

[chuck123wapati]

2 minutes ago, Gezzer said:

 

No one is talking about throwing out scrap leather just how to value it .

 then your not the odd duck. 

i must have read a different thread sorry. 

[AlZilla]

1 hour ago, Gezzer said:

Ain't I the odd duck here ? My scrap is free in that if after buying a  B side of H O for $ 260.00 ( about $11.00 a sf / $ .95 a square inch )

If you value the scrap at zero, then the portion you used cost more than you paid overall.

Academic anyway, if you're not selling your items.

[Handstitched]

To me scrap = $$$ . Its up to me to turn that scrap into $$ ....if I had the time..  

I used to give scrap away for free, not any more, now that I've realised the  true value of it, now that the cost of a DB or DS or a side  has gone through the roof...now .

Look around your workshop, how  much scrap can you see? ...and how much could it be worth if you had the time to turn it into $$ ??  whether it be a key ring, ear ring, book mark,  a small purse,  a little leather thing-a-me-bob , or whatever ?  Coming up with creative  ideas  concentrates the mind....apparently  . Each and every day I'm looking for ideas for doing just that.  I might follow up on  a few ideas  later. 

Well done Bruce  I am one of those individuals that turned a hobby into a business.  In case anyone asks,  it hasn't diminished the enjoyment of working with leather one single bit . If anything , its enhanced it . I am now taking on projects that I would never have thought of. My profile does state ' challenging projects' after all     

HS

[SUP]

A bit late in the thread. but these days, whenever I cut any leather, I try to keep the edges intact. Since I normally cut as near the edge of the larger leather as I can anyway, I get some thin, long sections, too thin to make belts or straps. If I get a continuous one, it's great. Else I just sit with scissors and cut them into long strips - lace I suppose, but not particularly well done, since they are not really long enough to use as lace for anything that I make and are usually the  edges, so not smooth or clean enough in texture. But, I use these strips of long and short laces to tie just about anything that needs tying in the house, from leather rolls, to .packets of food to bread packets to even my hair at a pinch. We rarely use thread any more. 

Also, while cutting repeated pieces, I try to keep areas in between to some symmetry so that I can then make keychains or zipper tags with those pieces. Just been making loads of keychains for gifts for dozens of people, so thought of that. Key chains are an unexpected bonus, almost automatically formed and less headache of wondering what to do with all the small pieces left behind! Also, if I cut really close, I still get that lace anyway, the lace that I use for tying. This I guess everyone does but I thought to mention it anyway.

[hmrambling]

I'm just getting started as a hobby. I've been practicing on small pieces from a bag of scraps. I've been using tools I had around the house and practicing hand sewing. If your scraps have no value to you, they certainly would prove valuable to others. I've made tiny little journals and a minimalist cardholder wallet with scraps. Occupied an entire weekend with scraps alone.

[Dwight]

I generally do the key fob thing with my scraps . . . 

If it's too small for a key fob . . . I don't have much else I can do with it . . . but thanks Bruce . . . the zipper pull thing I never thought of . . . basically because I don't use them.

Never have big enough scrap for coasters . . . except for one job that I did 3 times last year . . . and hung on to the 1st two sets of pieces . . . they'll turn into something some day.

Like every one else mentioned . . . thanks Bruce . . . we need your expertise.

May God bless,

Dwight

[toxo]

On 6/6/2023 at 5:29 AM, bruce johnson said:

      There have been some recent posts that Id like to share my thoughts and opinions on. This is just that - my personal thoughts. Take it for what is it worth and if you can use it - great. If not, write it off as a rant. Pricing leatherwork is not easy. When people ask about pricing, they have crossed a line. Gone from hobby to business (registered or under the radar, we are not the business police here). Grandma might give away her knitting she does for fun, but as soon as she sells a little and people ask for more - she's in it for some measure of money now. Break-even, coffee money, Disneyland trip, help a little with mortgage payments, quit your day job - there is probably room for everyone. There are complicated pricing formulas that work, some that don't. Not many simple formulas work. I made every mistake you can make and sometimes on a big scale. Some people here know my story, some don't and doesn't matter. That is not my intent here to be all knowing on pricing. I am only going to focus on one factor and that is leather.  Realistically, leather is the cheapest part of anything you make if you have to value your time, tools, and other materials. 

   Leather costs and scrap. Scrap is NOT free just because it is scrap. If you bought a side then you  paid exactly the same amount for every square inch piece of flank as you did for every square inch piece of back or butt. You might not like the flank and should have bought a bend, but that flank or belly was paid for just the same. Figure out a place to use it with a "purpose for it's properties".  (not an original quote). Then account for the real cost of it when you use it.  You might be surprised what can be done. My late first wife took little end cuts off headstall pieces - 1/2 or 5/8 by 1" sometimes, stamped a random flower center impression or some small geo stamp impressions, put an eyelet in and a small split ring - instant designer zipper tabs. Even with chemo she might do 4-6 an hour when she felt like it. Sold them for $8-10,  little beaded inlay took longer - $20. I was mainly doing strap work and personal stuff then with the occasional saddle and scrap was never an overflowing problem. My wife now started with 4" coasters, clicked out my saddle scrap and stamped simple designs on decent leather, on the crappy pieces glued some hair-on hide. At that point I was still building saddles, rope bags and cans, and she ran me totally out of scrap. Called my supplier and bought her rugged sides and second grade hair-on hides to keep up with those orders at the time. Point is, money was made and materials from either scrap or supplier pay their own way. I'd say don't fall into the trap of the scrap is just scrap and not account for it. Go into it with the idea that is has the same value and you will make "Profits From The Scrap Bin" Another not original quote - used to be regular feature in the Leather Crafters Journal. 

. 

Nice post Bruce. I think it was more a homage to your late wife than anything else and there's nothing wrong with that. It's a good thing. As far as pricing goes, leather is one of those things that is all things to all people so some enjoy the pottering, some enjoy the challenge, some just like being constructive. The list is infinite. I'm fortunate in that, being retired I can get an idea in my head and go and try it out in my "shop" (spare bedroom). Occasionally I make something, I might even sell something now and then but when it comes to "pricing", the man who came up with the phrase "A fool and his money are soon parted" had me in mind because I've always believed in having the right tool for the job and so I've just pulled the trigger on another sewing machine. That's three now plus the 801 skiver plus the Lucris clicker press plus the two arbor presses plus the laser engraver plus plus plus. Now factor in the cost of the components, leather, findings etc etc and it doesn't take a genius to work out that the idea of making any money is just silly. As far as scrap is concerned I find it really useful for setting up the sewing machine because I like to do different things and so have to change thread/needle size etc all the time and it's good to test on similar material before starting a new project.

[Mulesaw]

In an old German saddler book, the author specifically writes about utilizing scraps.

All sorts of scrap that are to small or to bad to be used for anything else should be put into an iron pot and carbonized by heating this pot over the fire till it is burnt. The burnt leather is then mashed while in the pot, and when it has cooled off, it is finely ground. 

The carbonized leather is (according to the author) sold to knife makers and instrument makers, And they use it for hardening fine steel. 

I am pretty sure that the hardening process he is referring to is called "case hardening". You fill a steel box with the carbonized leather and put the item to be hardened into it. put a lid on it all and heat it all to red hot. Keep the heat for a couple of hours. That will cause carbon to infuse the surface of the steel to be hardened so you get a higher carbon content and you can then harden it like normally.

I have no idea if anybody still does this since nowadays you can easily get steel with a defined carbon content in. I guess it wasn't quite as easy in 1908. But anyway that is a suggested use of the final remnants of scrap according to the book "Das Sattler, Riemer und Täschner Handwerk" by K. Vollmer

Personally I try to use my small scraps for belt keepers and stuff like that. But I think that I could do better. I might have to look into making some key rings.

[Mablung]

9 hours ago, Mulesaw said:

In an old German saddler book, the author specifically writes about utilizing scraps.

All sorts of scrap that are to small or to bad to be used for anything else should be put into an iron pot and carbonized by heating this pot over the fire till it is burnt. The burnt leather is then mashed while in the pot, and when it has cooled off, it is finely ground. 

The carbonized leather is (according to the author) sold to knife makers and instrument makers, And they use it for hardening fine steel. 

I am pretty sure that the hardening process he is referring to is called "case hardening". You fill a steel box with the carbonized leather and put the item to be hardened into it. put a lid on it all and heat it all to red hot. Keep the heat for a couple of hours. That will cause carbon to infuse the surface of the steel to be hardened so you get a higher carbon content and you can then harden it like normally.

I have no idea if anybody still does this since nowadays you can easily get steel with a defined carbon content in. I guess it wasn't quite as easy in 1908. But anyway that is a suggested use of the final remnants of scrap according to the book "Das Sattler, Riemer und Täschner Handwerk" by K. Vollmer

Personally I try to use my small scraps for belt keepers and stuff like that. But I think that I could do better. I might have to look into making some key rings.

That sounds a bit like a step in the carbon infusion process for creating Wootz steel, described in another thread about round knives.  That's interesting.

[Mulesaw]

14 hours ago, Mablung said:

That sounds a bit like a step in the carbon infusion process for creating Wootz steel, described in another thread about round knives.  That's interesting.

I had to look up Wootz steel, and it sure does sound a bit like it. 
I Googled case hardening yesterday after my post, and it is still done. An example could be a sprocket for a gearbox, where you machine it almost completely. Case harden it, complete the machining and harden it. It should leave you with a hard outershell and a robust core. But if carbon from leather is better than say powdered carbon from charcoal - that I don't know :-)