Rifle Sling: Chicago Screws-2 or 1 per end?

[SpruceMoose]

I've been making rifle slings for a while. While many designs out there only have one screw per end, I like to double up as a fail safe, they do come unscrewed i'm guessing with use and not checking them.

What do you folks think? Overkill?  

Edited July 17, 2023 by SpruceMoose

[fredk]

Certainly not 'overkill'. Two CS I reckon. Good ones, well fitted. Use thread-lock on them. CS are cheap, a rifle is not

[Dwight]

I only put one per end . . . as I put the blank end on a red paper eraser . . . and seriously push down and screw tight with my screwdriver on the other side.

If I can . . . I try to talk them into a woven . . . 4 hole . . . leather thong.  THEY don't come loose.

Never had one come loose yet . . . and when I've gone back to change something . . . it has been a pain at times.

May God bless,

Dwight

[Hags]

I use 2, with loctite.

[TomE]

A latigo knot would be a decorative way to secure the ends of the sling.  It is used for the cinch strap of a western saddle.  Starts with 3 holes in a triangular shape and a piece of latigo string.  This video shows a fancy knot.  A simpler version is to run the 2 ends through the top hole then secure the ends under the span between the 2 bottom holes.

  

 

[chuck123wapati]

`The old saying, one is none and two are one. I've attached  them several ways depending on the type of sling build and look wanted. if using Chicago screws i use Loctite and the eraser trick. they do come loose as you said.

[Doc Reaper]

2 hours ago, TomE said:

A latigo knot would be a decorative way to secure the ends of the sling.  It is used for the cinch strap of a western saddle.  Starts with 3 holes in a triangular shape and a piece of latigo string.  This video shows a fancy knot.  A simpler version is to run the 2 ends through the top hole then secure the ends under the span between the 2 bottom holes.

  

 

It is probably a nice looking knot, but it’s all so dark it’s impossible to see what was done. Can someone use a white shoelace on a light brown piece of cardboard? I have never seen this knot

[SpruceMoose]

14 hours ago, fredk said:

Certainly not 'overkill'. Two CS I reckon. Good ones, well fitted. Use thread-lock on them. CS are cheap, a rifle is not

12 hours ago, Dwight said:

I only put one per end . . . as I put the blank end on a red paper eraser . . . and seriously push down and screw tight with my screwdriver on the other side.

If I can . . . I try to talk them into a woven . . . 4 hole . . . leather thong.  THEY don't come loose.

Never had one come loose yet . . . and when I've gone back to change something . . . it has been a pain at times.

May God bless,

Dwight

11 hours ago, Hags said:

I use 2, with loctite.

2 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

`The old saying, one is none and two are one. I've attached  them several ways depending on the type of sling build and look wanted. if using Chicago screws i use Loctite and the eraser trick. they do come loose as you said.

2 hours ago, TomE said:

A latigo knot would be a decorative way to secure the ends of the sling.  It is used for the cinch strap of a western saddle.  Starts with 3 holes in a triangular shape and a piece of latigo string.  This video shows a fancy knot.  A simpler version is to run the 2 ends through the top hole then secure the ends under the span between the 2 bottom holes.

  

 

 

 

Thank you for all the suggestions, I do like the thronged knot, saddle knot combination, and have used lock tite in the past. My only issue with both is that i do not include the swivel mount hardware with the slings(they are $30+ for a good set), I wouldn't mind doing so as I sell slings 200cad and up range, but not everyone uses the same mounts. The customer has to be able to attach the sling. 

Some guns out there are worth more than anything i own, so i like to ensure i am selling a product that is secure. The chicago screws i'm using seem to be of good quality. Solid brass, 1/4 inch, buckleguy.

I think maybe 2 per end or a combination with an easier saddle knot( something that will hold tight, and the customer can do, ship laced but loose)

Anyone know what the knot pictured below might be called? Maybe that is what you are referring to Dwight?  I just noticed, I often do not see this lace knot on both ends, I would think one would want to, but the amount of holes on the adjustable end would get wildly out of hand.

Side question,  I've researched this forum thoroughly, and have come up with varying conclusions on average sling lengths, any opinions? I make Cobra style for now, (and am setting up to make M1907). I make a standard cobra and an xl length one, all adjustable. I just like to be sure that i am in range of the standard sizing. Most customers read the description of exact sizing and measurements anyways, but good to be sure with so much varying 'standard' sizing info out there, as well as many buy them for gifts that may not be gun users.

(Photo from 7X Leather, not my own, for reference).  

Thanks everyone.

-Cheyenne

 

 

[Northmount]

1 hour ago, Doc Reaper said:

It is probably a nice looking knot, but it’s all so dark it’s impossible to see what was done. Can someone use a white shoelace on a light brown piece of cardboard? I have never seen this knot

 

[TomE]

59 minutes ago, SpruceMoose said:

Anyone know what the knot pictured below might be called? 

Can't see the knot in the picture very well but I think it's a blood knot/bleed knot.

 

[Doc Reaper]

18 hours ago, Northmount said:

 

 Northmount I really gotta say thanks a bunch! That’s a really handy knot to know, I’m sure there are others but this is very useful!!!!!

[SpruceMoose]

Thanks again for the info everyone, went with 2 quality brass screws per end. Would love to do a nice knot, but like i said, i need the customer to be able to take apart and put it back.

[fredk]

Those slings are real nice so they are

Just a thought, and you may do this already,  Advise the customer to use thread lock on the screws after re-assembly having put on the hardware fittings

as an aside, when I want a purdy Chicago screw head I use these;

Edited July 23, 2023 by fredk

[SpruceMoose]

28 minutes ago, fredk said:

Those slings are real nice so they are

Just a thought, and you may do this already,  Advise the customer to use thread lock on the screws after re-assembly having put on the hardware fittings

as an aside, when I want a purdy Chicago screw head I use these;

Thanks FredK, those are nice looking chicago screws, i'll have to keep an eye out, since i'm doubling up on each sling i'll be needing another order soon!

[bruce johnson]

I agree with using two if you use Chicago screws. My personal preference is to use the Chicago screws with the hole through the head. You can use a longer screw and have more threads to hold. Being around horses for 50 plus years, I've seen several tricks for securing them - drop of iodine to corrode the threads together, clear nail polish, acrylic paint, Loctite, Elmers glue, and more if I thought harder. If you choose Loctite go with the one that will release at low heat. Nothing worse than trying to get a screw loose without damaging the leather or concho head if it is a screw back concho. The low heat loctite will soften and loosen with a soldering iron held on the screw to heat it. Your customers are going to want to change these out to another rifle at some point or some other reason so make it somewhat easy. If you want semi-permanent to permanent then use rivets. I did some of those too. 

A tool that I personal REALLY like is the JP Tack Tool for Chicago screws. Tighten or loosen, they all get the JP tool used on them I got one of the early ones and still use it and have bought quite a few for gifts for gifts. This version is made from a polymer and has some flex. Some makers copied it with a visegrip or metal frame and that works. I havent seen those available recently but they can get enough force to punch the Chicago screw through the leather, the polymer frame ones won't. Here is a link to the JP  -  https://www.jptacktool.com/product-page/chicago-screw-tack-tool

[Red Bear Haraldsson]

On 7/18/2023 at 10:27 AM, Northmount said:

 

Much appreciated! I can see this knot going on all kinds of places...

[Northmount]

On 7/23/2023 at 12:54 PM, bruce johnson said:

If you choose Loctite go with the one that will release at low heat. Nothing worse than trying to get a screw loose without damaging the leather or concho head if it is a screw back concho. The low heat loctite will soften and loosen with a soldering iron held on the screw to heat it.

Loctite bearing retainer allows disassembly for inspection and repairs.  I couldn't get Loctite for threads many years ago and used this instead.  Doesn't come apart due to vibration.  Seals in air-tight spaces.  Fills gaps, resistant to oils and grease as well.

[ThisIsMyFirstRodeo]

No such thing as over-engineering!

Also, if you think it would be an issue, use some threadlock. 

[TonyV]

I guess 2 screws are technically better than 1, but my favorite hunting rifle has worn the same sling with only 1 screw at each end for nearly 30 years of spot and stalk hunting in rough mountain conditions and they haven't come loose yet.  The leather is wearing out at those points and I will soon need to make a repair (or build a new sling), but the chicago screws are still holding tight.  A small dab of blue loc-tite is good insurance.