Ferdco Super Bull / Cobra Class 4 Issue

[tagger609]

Recently purchased a ferdco which is similar to the class 4. Got it set up, finally got needles and thread in. Put it together and now the foot snaps backward opposed to a smooth motion and the thread appears to be fraying / breaking. Unsure where to start. I never messed with any settings. The foot does this with thread or without. I attached a youtube video of the issue.  it sounds terrible Help please !

 

 

Edited June 29, 2016 by tagger609

[MADMAX22]

Your center foot has the thread line bottom thing (forgot what its called), that is catching on your slotted plate hole. Put some  leather under it and see what it does. Dont run it "dry" like that if you can help it. 

Edited June 29, 2016 by MADMAX22

[Ken Nelson]

There should be a plate and bottom feed dog with this machine.   I think Max may be on to something.   I would also advise you not to run it dry.  HTH Ken

Edited June 29, 2016 by Ken Nelson

[MADMAX22]

Yeah hopefully he got the other sets that usually come with them, Ill admit what did come with his is pretty nice compared to some of the stuff I have on mine. 

 

His slotted plate is fine to run with the other parts its just he is using one of these  which is catching in the slotted plate groove.

[Wizcrafts]

Tagger609;

How did your machine end up with a Cobra style inside foot? They have the tab on the bottom that is designed to push down the leather in the stitch line. It is meant for the Cobra slotted plate which has a long, narrow slot. Your machine seems to have a shorter slot.

You can work around the problem until a replacement foot arrives by shortening the stitch length so the inside foot stops before the end of the slot. Or, grind off the bottom tab.

[CowboyBob]

Wiz,

Ferdco made the stitch groove foot years ago & they copied it from the old machines like the Champion or Landis.

They work pretty good going straight but leaves a lot of unwanted marking when turning corners.

[Wizcrafts]

Thanks Bob. I didn't know that Ferdinand made a foot with a bottom tab.

[tagger609]

I will try a new combination of feet with the slotted plate. See if it helps and will report back. Really appreciate the help. You guys are the best. 

[tagger609]

Ok so with leather under foot it is still a little jerky. Tried repositioning the plate with no luck. Here's how the stitch looks . better on top then bottom . bottom is frayed. Also is a picture with all feet and plates and the feed dog. Any suggestions of new setups. 

[Trox]

I use this set up too (with the Cobra style inside foot, slotted plate and Ferdco lower guide), but I never sew with no material in the machine. Ease up the presser foot pressure (so the presser do not hit the plate) or change the inside foot if you going to sew very thin material. Remember to hold both thread tight when locking down your stitches/ start and stop. To much presser foot pressure will make it hard for the needle to hit same holes on back tacking, you are using a sharp LR needle that will cut/fray the thread easily .

Tor 

[tagger609]

I will try to loose the pressure of the presser foot. What type of needle do you recommend if not the LR 

[Ken Nelson]

I use 794S needles on my Cobra Class 4.   If you don't have a really good operators manual with this machine, I would suggest you go to the Artisan site and pull down the manual for the Toro series machines.  It is really good and  is way more indepth than most of the 441 manuals.  

I used to trade on used sewing machines a little.  I only bought one from individuals that sewed when it come into the shop.  None of them took any parts, just a lot of adjusting and I got lucky there.  I have seen some that were so worn out it cost more for parts than the machine was worth.  Learning how to adjust these machines is part of learning how to sew.  Do not let it scare you.  It is not rocket science and there is a lot of help available.  A really good manual or mechanics video is worth a lot.  HTH's   Ken

[tagger609]

Ok so i checked for burrs, None to be found. Redid the tension on top. Tried different needles , needle sizes, point shapes, and thread thicknesses top and bottom ( combinations of 277 / 207) bonded polyester thread. No luck. You can see a little fray on the top stitch and a ton on the bottom stitch. If i go in reverse it is a nightmare with the fraying. 

[Wizcrafts]

Did you buy the Ferdco from an individual or a sewing machine dealer? If a dealer, contact them about returning the head for repairs.

If the seller can't help you, one of our member dealers probably can. Check the banners on top of our forums for links to our supporting dealers' websites.

[Northmount]

If you use leather point needles, don't back tack.  Leave your thread tails long and do your back stitching by hand, doing a saddle stitch.

Tom

 

[tagger609]

Im not worried as much about the backstitch as i am the small fraying coming up through the top stitch as pictured. The back stitch was mostly  solved by the washer trick ive read about.

 

Far right stitch line is of the top stitch and the small frayed pieces. 

[tagger609]

Wiz, Dealer said to ask you guys !

[MADMAX22]

Haha thats not good. I mean Wiz and the guys are great but that dealer should be fixing the machine he/she sold ya. 

[Wizcrafts]

11 hours ago, tagger609 said:

Wiz, Dealer said to ask you guys !

No shit?

[Trox]

The first thing you do with stitch errors are to change to a new needle, bad needles cause 90 % of all stitch errors. No matter how old that needle is and do not look for burrs on it, just change it for a new one. Then look for burrs on your hook tip, check the inside foot and hole in the needle plate for the same. Use your finger and a magnifiers, look for anything that might cause that fraying. When it comes to the adjustment, it's not your job to adjust the machine. Have it delivered back for repairs or let them come and adjust it in your place.  You have a warranty, if you start doing repairs yourself that might not be valid anymore. You will learn how to adjust the machine soon enough, a brand new machine should be sewing fine when you receive it.  

Tor 

[SARK9]

I don't have a machine that is remotely similar to yours, but if one of my smaller machines was showing frayed thread in the stitches, I'd look closely at the operation of the check spring. The needle could be clipping the top thread if the tension is released too early on the downstroke, also,  if the loop is formed a bit too close to the scarf of the needle when the hook arrives, it could nip the thread a bit as its picked up. That is something to double check-Your manuals should outline the adjustments.

 

-DC

[Darren Brosowski]

If the picture is the top then I agree with SARK that it could be the take up spring.

The inner grooving foot should not cause a problem unless there is a burr on it somewhere so check that first.

If the foot is clean an smooth then check the take up spring. There are two springs and it could be as simple as the spring you see on the outside is not locked into the primary spring. The loop on the primary spring can break off and the secondary spring just flops around

 

 

[Yetibelle]

There are many Class 4 timing videos, while it may not be exactly the same as yours it is the same principle action to make a stitch. 

 

 

[Trox]

It's easier, cheaper to make a copy or clone just like the real thing; than make it different. Therefore, you can trust they are all the same. Of course there have been some modifications/improvements and different material qualities. I'm sure we can help him get his machine sewing as it should. Nevertheless, that the dealer job in the first place. Just return it and demand they fix it and pay for the transport. Is it not a brand new machine and you paid for a fully operational sewing machine. If you want a DIY project you can buy it direct from China yourself to a fraction of the price. I'm sure any of our dealers would have replaced/repaired it and not told you to seek advice here on their mistakes. If the dealer will not help you, then tell us where we should not buy sewing machines. Let them earn their pay check like our dealers have too.  

Tor  

[Uwe]

Open the bobbin cover and turn it over by hand very slowly and just observe what's going on. Most of the time it'll be obvious what is causing the thread to fray, either rubbing against something or running over a sharp edge or whatever. Does the thread get frayed before it ever gets to the eye of the needle? Running and snapping the feet dry like you did will surely cause some sharp metal edges somewhere. Sending the head back for repair on the dealer's dime seems excessive at this point and risk more damage than it may fix.

Figure out how to take a close-up video of the hook movement with thread and leather like the one posted above, except focus on the hook instead of the thread stand in the background (usually done by touching and holding the area on your smart phone screen that you want to be in focus until the focus locks.) Get a $10 phone holder (a scotch tape dispenser works nicely in a pinch) and put the phone on a stable surface. Horizontal video rocks.

Edited July 6, 2016 by Uwe