Walking Foot Material Feed Problem -- Shifting

[JJDD]

 

I have a walking foot machine - Techsew 2750 (similar to 2700, but with a bigger bobbin). Happy to have it. It's set up on with a table attachment to sew two flat pieces of 3-3.5oz together, 1/8" from the edge. Tension looks like its good - lock in the middle, machine running smoothly... except..  as it sews it veers the material, pushing it to the left (pushing the stitch line closer and closer to the edge). The only way I've been able to sew so far is to wrestle persuade the material to feed thru the machine at an opposing angle to somewhat try to correct it as it goes along. That doesn't work so well, and is leaving too much room for error on important pieces 

Upon a closer look, with and without the needle, the material is moving very slightly to the left, each time the feed dog and needle first come into contact with the material (center and walking foot still down (with walking foot about to lift if action continues).

I've tried increasing presser foot pressure; all types of edge guide combinations, guiding by hand; no guide, no thread (with / without needle), and just running the machine at a slow speed to see how straight it sews on its own -- still shifts.

I was originally using a center & left foot combo, but then switched to center & double foot to see if that would help with more surface area on the back of the feet touching the material. That didn't fix the problem either. The feed dog seems to be at a good height and has worked out well in keeping leather from getting pushed down, while not horribly marring the back as much as a sharp-toothed feed dog did (it's a smoother version, as the sharp toothed cuts up the leather). 

 

For a clean slate, I've set the machine back to the lighter presser foot pressure I have been using for a while now, and ready to keep trying to figure it out..

Since it's not a viable option for me to sew then cut material to size, what are some other things you all recommend I can try on the machine to correct the way the material is feeding thru? 

 

I've seen people just let their machine sew on it's own and it goes straight. That's ideal, but I'll even settle for a partial fix.

Thank you in advance for the help!

 

P.S.  Techsew suggested increasing presser foot pressure so far, which I tried, but also looking forward to getting more feedback from this community as I continue to work with this out from all angles.

 

Edited October 22, 2016 by JJDD

[TinkerTailor]

Did you oil your machine with whiskey? Whenever I do that, it drives really crooked and wants to fight. Remember, it is from Quebec, the french region of Canada, so it probably likes wine better anyways. Originally from china, so I would choose a nice white rice wine..........

Now for serious, How soft is the material you are sewing? I have a 5100 and if the edges are soft, it squishes the leather out the side when I am sewing that close to the edge. Try to sew at least 1/2 inch in and see if it drives straight then. If it does, the material is probably not sturdy enough to stitch that close to the edge.

[JJDD]

Hahaha thanks for the laugh definitely needed that

Thanks for the suggestion!

Feels more steady, but it does still push out the material to the side when the feed dog comes up. Not sure if it's helpful to note, but it does the same in the middle of pieces, not on the edge as well for what I'm using now.  I read another post where they mentioned that sometimes the bottom feed mechanism causes more trouble than helping - wondering if that's the case here.

[Uwe]

I had one machine that did the same thing. Upon closer inspection the inner presser foot shifted very slightly to the left whenever it touched the feed dog. The sideways shifting was very obvious when turning the machine over by hand with no material under the feet. The cause turned out to be a combination of a worn feed dog (the top surface wasn't level but slightly sloping down towards the left) and too much sideways play in the upper swing block that moves both needle bar and inner presser foot bar back and forth. The swing block had sideways play because the guide plate was not close enough (or worn). Replacing the feed dog and tightening the guide plate clearance solved the issue in my case.

A loose feed dog may also tilt slightly sideways when pressure is applied.

The Techsew 2750/Juki 341 design has the upper swing block pivoting in the center and there's no guide plate like in the Juki 563 style heads, so the center pivot screw/bushing may be loose or worn and allowing sideways play.

Checking for sideways play in either feed dog or inner presser foot/needle bar should be easy. Also check the feed dog for uneven or sideways sloping top surface (this may happen if grinding down the feed dog to blunt/remove teeth.)

  

[JJDD]

Appreciate the feedback!

I'm going to check the upper swing block like you suggested when I get back to the machine. A bit confused how to do that but I think once I'm back in front of the machine it'll be clear (*fingers crossed*).

I did get a feed-dog with the teeth removed and it doesn't mark, but it might have that slope / uneven surface. That's another thing I'm going to look into too! -- I'm going to place the factory feed-dog on and see if the shift still happens with the flat feed dog.

[Northmount]

My 2700 tends to feed towards one side as well.  Doesn't sew straight without being guided.

 Tom

[Techsew Ron]

Will look into this one monday morning with the technicians.

@TinkerTailor I'm more of a whiskey guy but I got nothing against a good wine !

[dikman]

Probably not much help 'cos you're talking about a walking foot, but my 331K was doing the same thing when I fitted a new foot. Finally found out that the bar that the foot was clamped to was slightly out of alignment, so I re-adjusted the bar and all was well.

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

On 10/22/2016 at 1:14 PM, Uwe said:

...I had one machine that did the same thing. Upon closer inspection the inner presser foot shifted very slightly to the left whenever it touched the feed dog. The sideways shifting was very obvious when turning the machine over by hand with no material under the feet.

This is what I was thinking as well.  Often the presser feet and feed dog do not match, and the points of contact tell the story.  On some feed dog and presser feet combinations, the feed dog and presser foot are not even or hardly coming in contact with each other.  This happens often with cording or welting feet where the foot print is smaller.  Again, this depends on the setup, not machine, if you will.

 

[TinkerTailor]

I was just thinking, I think i accidentally made my 441 do this by having the feed dog too high while working on something else.. Its like the material squirmed as it was pushed up and due to the feet not being perfectly centered, one just hangs off the edge of the dog a little more than the other, it caused it to steer. These little harness feet we all us need way higher tolerances than the blanket feet for instance. I also was thinking that if one toe is lower than the other, it would walk in a circle like a guy who has worn an inch off his peg leg.

Do you have other feet to try?

Edited October 24, 2016 by TinkerTailor

[cdthayer]

On 10/22/2016 at 10:59 AM, JJDD said:

Techsew 2750 (similar to 2700, but with a bigger bobbin).

Is that a new machine or an older one?

I’ve got a worn 1959 Singer 111G156 that doesn’t like to sew thin materials.  It kind of turns the work curving the stitch line, and has even puckered the top layer at times.  I found out that the inner foot was not lifting cleanly off of the work before starting its movement forward and lightly drags on the top layer.  It may just be an adjustment, but it’s got a lot of slop when I wiggle the foot, so I think that it’s wear.  The machine sews fine on thicker or firmer materials that don’t seem to be affected by the light drag.

CD in Oklahoma

 

[JJDD]

Hey all,

It's a new machine @cdthayer. Took a look at again in slow-mo, and I really do think it's something to do with Gregg From Keystone Sewing suggested: "Often the presser feet and feed dog do not match, and the points of contact tell the story." 

I feel like I've tried so many different combinations to see what's the problem - but going to try all original factory settings again - original presser feed, feed dog, etc.

It would mean that whatever / even minor uneven surface there is now really pushes that material to the side (it's almost impossible to correct when it's moving along). So it would be a great relief if that's all it is - but also onto the next thing to figure out with the leatherworker.net community -- how to get level smooth feed dogs.

For now, still working this out. Suggestions welcome

Keep you all posted! 

Edited October 25, 2016 by JJDD

[shoepatcher]

Send pics of what you have once the original parts are back in.  We can suggest things but pics will tell us a lot!

glenn

[Techsew Ron]

20 hours ago, JJDD said:

I feel like I've tried so many different combinations to see what's the problem - but going to try all original factory settings again - original presser feed, feed dog, etc.

Best bet is to return to original factory provided presser feet and feed dog and see if the problem persists. Keep us updated!

Ron

[JJDD]

Thanks Ron, will do ! You all are very helpful

[JJDD]

@Techsew Ron sent an updated email - please check it out when you get a chance

thanks!

[JeannieH]

Hello everyone. This is my first post and I'm having a problem. I have a consew 227 r. My machine moves my material to the right and it's causing it to be impossible to see straight edges without an edge guide. After some inspection....I see that my inner presser foot starts off in the right position, but once it gets a second from its lowest point..it moves to the right and when it gets back to the highest point it moves back to the center where it should be. At first I thought the feed dog was moving it...but it does it even when it isn't able to contact the feed dog. Any advice on what's going on?

[brmax]

Welcome to the site Jeannie

This is an interesting article with some great tips. So to start i should say first that checking the bar that the presser foot is mounted to for excess slack sideways or other directions is worth noting. Other than the above

The presser feet i have purchased in recent times are seriously lacking in mounting alignment, their bottom surfaces not being level and what bothers me also is the inconsistent height. 

I have honestly had to rework or tune every single one i have purchased, a pita!

What i can say i found is the very reason "i think" why some factory original items are so much more costly. ( i would hope )

So If the machine parts are sound and little to no slack i would assume the feet as they are secure in mount can be tuned, or the bottom surface sanded with some sand paper of the wet dry kind in 400 first and followed with 600 grit. 

Its a task that requires ultra care sheilding other parts from the grit. This can be done with tissue placement over the hook areas and vacuming prior to removing the sheilding. Theres not a lot of grit but a clear need to be aware of.

First i try to position the feed dog surface to be flat level with other area surrounding surface. When in that position secure the pulley wheel with a rubber door stop or eraser 

Moving on, and i know this is long winded, sorry. Anyway i would always just put the grit side facing the feet and pull the sheet through carefully taking turns both ways. It may take some coaxing or even backing off the top pressure tension some times so as not to tear the paper, get a few sheets.  After 8-10 times take a look and try to keep the feed dog level with other surface. A Tip is to color bottom side of presser feet with say a sharpie to verify where exactly it is being sanded and not equal. 

I have done this an afterward without needle at first run a sheet of paper under as sewing noting if paper was running true. This can be a long a tedious task, and it does work. I was and still am happy if a typing sheet can run true its length, this is again tedious if many but amazingly it works. Cording feet can be tough but done

Following that this other basic top presser tension adjustment can help if one of the two layers seem to get longer or shorter. Using two layers of same 2-3 feet long material sew these "without" thread if they appear to be matched in length at end of sew Great! If not one can adjust the presser tension on top and this can seriously help to keep the layers perfectly even. 

Good day

Floyd

[JeannieH]

Thank you for your response!  I actually figured out the problem after a while.  I took my outer foot off and noticed that the movement of the inner foot to the right stopped!  I looked at the outer foot (looks like it was fabricated some how by whoever lol) had a section of metal that stuck out.  So, as the inner foot got to that section it had no choice but to follow and move to the right!  Sooo I got a metal file and sanded it off...voila!!  No more movement to the right and I can finally so straight edges without a guide.  I've had this machine for almost a year and have been at my wits end trying to sew straight by going at an angle....simple fix!

[LumpenDoodle2]

I also think you should check the inner presser foot bar is aligned correctly.  It the easiest thing to fix, and I'm a big fan of checking the easiest/obvious to see first.

 I cured slight crabbing by shifting the bar on my Juki by a tiny amount.

(or you can file the excess off the outer foot).

Edited March 13, 2017 by LumpenDoodle2

[JeannieH]

LumpenDoodle2 it ended up being my outer presser foot...it came with my machine.  It had the right toe sawed off...which is what I needed..but there was extra metal not ground off that was causing the inner foot to move to the right as it went up to the section.