New to sewing

[slowmoguy]

Just registered here..

 

After a lot of google searching, I found a few older threads here discussing use of Singer 212g140 model to stitch leather.

 

I see it can be used to do both dual and single needles, seems good.

 

Found one with a 110v motor. Somewhat reasonable price.

 

So, how heavy can the singer 212 normally stitch? What is the most thick material I could fit between the bed and needle?

 

Machine is not local and am wanting input before buying.

 

Interested in using to make leather cowboy gear and cordura gear. Leather for cowboy shooting and cordura for work(military).

 

Will this do 'usable' work? Skill comes with practice. Eventually my work will be pretty. Question is, would the machine be capable of holsters, belts and clothing?

[johnv474]

You may want to post in the Sewing Leather forum.  There are some knowledgeable folks there.

 

I'd be surprised if a 110V motor could sew holsters. You can always sew heavier stuff by hand in the meantime.

[slowmoguy]

So, will the machine itself do it?

 

What if I used 220v 2phase? Another run and bigger motor.. will it snap needles or anything?

[bikermutt07]

I am no expert at all. And really don't know anything about this particular machine. I looked it up though.

Looks like it has maybe a 1/4" lift. That will not see cowboy rigs or harnesses.

It seems to be for upolstery. (Spelling?)

It also appears to be only needle feed, not a compound walking foot with needle feed.

Most folks use the compound walking foot with needle feed, bottom feed, and outside alternating presser foot. Hence the term triple compound feed.

All this doesn't mean it won't sew leather. It just means it has it's limits and capacities. In the range of sewing it is meant for it looks like an industrial beast.

This range is going to be wallets, sails, upolstery, and thinner flat goods. 

Anytime you are looking at leather sewing you will want to consider using a digital servo motor with a speed reducer. This will slow things down while adding torque to pierce the leather. 

110v or 220v really doesn't come into play. Use what is readily available in your home or shop. 

An expert will be along sometime today to help you along. 

[slowmoguy]

I appreciate you all.

 

What is a good and economical machine to sew 4-6 layers of 1000D cordura with potentially one or two nylon webs inbetween the cordura.

 

Seems that will also get me in the category of working belts, chaps and holsters for reenactment shoots like cowboy and wildbunch.

 

Want to spend once on something that will work for all purposes and ends.

 

Any and all guidance is appreciated highly. I believe research first, purchase last.

 

Thank you all

[kgg]

Once you get into holsters you are going to need a much heavier machine other then the upholstery weight machines. Remember that there is not going to be one machine that can do or handle everything. For what you want to do I think you would be looking at cylinder bed machine that would have a high lift capability and being able to handle V92 to 277 plus thread.

kgg

[JLSleather]

I didn't see much info about this machine (google returns a lot of Sesame Street).  First question should be will the machine do what you want to do.  Price is irrelevant if it doesn't do what you need.  It's not a "good deal" if it doesn't do the task.

That said, I would ask what size needle and thread the machine uses.  I don't know what "cowboy gear" is, but for the holsters and belts you mention you'll want something that uses at least a #23 needle and 207 thread.  Some will tell you that you need at least 277 thread, but I'm not one of them (those ppl saying 207 thread isn't strong enough could maybe do a video of them BREAKING some 207... ).  On holsters, I often DO use 277.

It may well sew "clothing" (you didn't mention any details).  Leather shirt?  Possibly.  Leather boots? Unlikely.

[kgg]

The singer 212g140 manual says the machine was a double needle compound feed with no reverse while the 141 had reverse. Made for sewing garments like coveralls, coats, corsets, bras.

kgg

[slowmoguy]

appreciated, everyone. Seems this is not in the realm I need.

 

Yes, 'cowboy gear' meaning a full 'gitup'. Cowboy shooting requires period correct dress, character name and a series of other rules to follow.

 

Basically make some very simple and bland clothes out of leathers and cottons as need be.

 

Would anyone recommend a machine that will do more of what I am looking for?

 

The singer in discussion may work for 'modern' magazine pouches, vests and such.. however I am not entirely confident in that.

 

Once more, appreciated.

[SilverForgeStudio]

@slowmoguy For learning- learn the hand stitching gig- for holsters and belts its great practice... and look at it simply... You can crank out a TON of small goods and learn the principals easily and quickly with a older singer 15-9, a Japanese clone of the 15 series or a heavy old Kenmore. All domestic machines- all from a time period where rigidity and the ability to sew domestic "denim weights" were common. I mention these as they kept coming up in Craigslist searches fairly cheap- and on my area's Free-cycle web there are several without cabinets to be had as "curb alerts"

How do I know they appear frequently? Because Im only a few months "older" than you in my search for a machine. And my mentality was the same as yours.

I am "new" to this sewing thing as well... and if you are trying to do all things at once- you will fail. Learn small- then use those projects to fund/drive the "big boy" machine... but look around- many of the "Holster" machine setups are NOT everyday sewers- these are special use project machines that even the pro's only use for specific tasks.

If you are looking to do Molle type gear then youtube "Jason of all Trades" and get familiar with his techniques. Below is a great webbing tutorial (using a domestic vintage machine) that is from a designer's angle and at a beginners speed. 

https://youtu.be/6IscVRgBdUo

As for holster and belt sewing for thicker leathers- there are several threads on the "Chinese shoe patcher" style machines (Manual and rudimentary versions of the Singer 29K) that will perform well for your starting efforts. Enough to get you familiar with what you are doing, how to do it, and what the next step in your hobby needs to be.

I personally wanted to get into canvas+leather bags and heavier things as well but found the chinese shoe patcher was-

1. more affordable
2. easily modified to suit my needs (going to add a motor like Polyfractal and Mainley Acres)
3. it left $$$ for supplies and plenty of room to grow versus sinking my hobby budget in one purchase

Here is a link to one of the shoe patcher series of machines. https://youtu.be/uNh4HpyqNbk

You will hear it from Battlemunky, JLS, Wiz and many other "older, wiser and more learned and professional" folks than me- Learn by doing 10 of an item at a time... and sell the extras. But dont worry about a high end big money machine until the hobby can support/fund or subsidize the thing.

My 2 cents... your mileage may vary, batteries not included, some assembly required, call your mother- all the usual caveats. Be safe and have fun!

 

 

[slowmoguy]

Appreciated. Very much so. Will look into the machines referred.

Am thinking a manual shoe machine would be useful in ways. It would allow more heavy leather work..

 

I actually called and spoke to Bill at Sailrite. I agree about the cost of things... maybe multiple machines would be ideal. Thought about pursuing the fabricator and doing hand work for the holsters and other heavy leather things.

 

Thought process was, that sailrite fabricator comes almost turn key.. costs a lot but, yeah.. I worked as an automotive technician for more than a decade before entering military. Is a late entry on my part.

That stated, also have plethora of antique and muscle cars. Would be useful for interior work. Seats, shifter covers&boots. Reclaiming sunvisors.

Finally, wife wants to take old baby clothes and make quilt for daughter.

Maybe, buy something that will workhorse the easy stuff and do my cowboy gittup by hand. Look into hand machines later.

Lot of things to consider, discuss with wife, research and more.

As always, I appreciate all of you.

 

I will keep an eye on this for a few days while making decisions. 

[Northmount]

@slowmoguy  Moved to leather sewing machines.

Tom

[dikman]

It's a common enough mistake that many new to sewing machines make - the assumption that one machine can do it all. The general upholstery-class walking foot machine is actually quite a versatile machine - until holsters are mentioned! There is no escaping the fact that a heavy duty machine is needed for them, but such a machine isn't much use for lighter materials.

I hand stitch my holsters because my machines can't handle either the thread/needle size or thickness of materials that are needed (I have stitched a couple of heavy belts, using #138 thread, and it doesn't look too bad, but holsters no way).

If you're going to do this as a "business" then you'll need to fork out for a 441-class or similar, as well as an upholstery class machine. Those two will get you started. Oh, and I wouldn't suggest a cheap shoe patcher as they are not intended for what you want to do - production-type runs. You will not be happy with the results as they cannot handle heavy enough thread/needles or be able to penetrate holster-thickness leather.

Edited February 26, 2019 by dikman

[Wizcrafts]

Light weight cloth can be sewn on a bottom feed only tailoring machine. Denim clothing, chaps, light to medium temper leather, webbing and Cordura should be sewn on a triple feed walking foot machine. Thick stacks of dense material and hard leather need a super heavy duty harness stitcher type of machine. These harness and holster machines have high lift, long stroke for their equally long needles (2.75"), very beefy take-up parts, very heavy thread and needle capacity and hold a lot of heavy thread.

If you want to start out with a walking foot machine for the medium weight stuff, get a Consew 206RB-5 or Juki LU-1508NH. The Juki can actually handle #207 thread, which has 32 pounds breaking strength. It can also sew a little thicker than a standard model walking foot machine because it can be setup with a longer System 190 needle. It could get you through until you get a real heavy stitcher for the work that its too tough for the Juki.

[slowmoguy]

Thank you everyone.

Wizcrafts is there any reason to select a consew over the sailrite? The pricing looks $100 within each other and the features seem the same.

 

I believe the sailrite only handles 138 thread, which is smaller than the consew.. however, if I am knowing that later in life a dedicated "cowboy" is a must..

It seems that 138 is pretty good sized.

Just wanting more insight from highly experienced people. No intent of cutting or stepping on toes.

Thank you!

[brmax]

I think your cordura layers and nylon webbing layer is indeed capable of a machine with needle and bottom feed. I also feel reverse is a real benefit though.

Theres a bazillion methods to loc the stitch on a 212 and the like kind having no reverse. Even though it has both feeds mentioned and in design designated a coverall and items in that median.

If it matters I have one, I went through it and I modified it for 135-17 needle system, and thread of 92 size. It was, is great with two layer canvas; yet has no reverse. This 212 g140 has a new table top, new servo.

Its not your 1st investment choice for your leather work, imo. Lets say its great and has its place. Even if Its designation sew capability list coverall; this is a clothing not  really a do everything. But it is Respected!

Im here to agree with others and also say your sewing task require two different machines. If I was gearing up for either the quilts etc. I would now pick another machine, especially for cowboy leather gear, and another that includes costume and theatre.  

This level of utility is Heavy and medium heavy materials that you will find requires the largest class, level machine.

It really is required, in these there are several!  Your in luck though because in this class/duty level are a couple choices. Anyway note their benefits are the rate of return, and turnover if desired. 

Keep at the hunt, as there are used machines, so keep an eye on the ad places. 

 

Good day

Floyd